Design of Foils & Struts

The International Hydrofoil Society (IHS) Hydrofoil Correspondance Archives
General: IHS Administration Design of Foils: Foil-Struts-Controls-Performance Design of Vessels: Hull-Machinery-Costs-Performance/Ops History of Hydrofoils: People-Vessels-Operations Hydrofoils: Commercial Hydrofoils: Military
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Updated last August 20, 2006
Design of Foils: Foil-Struts-Controls-Performance

Design of Foils: Foil-Struts-Controls-Performance Scroll To Top Top

Count,MessageID,category,ShortTitle,Message,Date,UserName,MsgPswd,Phone,Email,ParentMsgId

“1”,”950336″,”2″,”Re; Re; Revolutionizing a watersport||950336″,”Good response, Tom. When you say ” it’s much better to specify the pressure distribution and then calculate the section shape that will produce it. Would you be suggesting to use Xfoil to do the calculation?”,”2005-12-20″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,”rvell@san.rr.com”,”949055″

“2”,”949055″,”2″,”Re; Re; Revolutionizing a watersport||949055″,”I don’t think the radius+ogive middle is a very good way to go. That was the philosophy behind my Proa 1-series.

The sudden change in curvature at the junction between the ogive and radius caused a sharp pressure spike:

This, in turn, led to laminar separation, premature stall from the leading edge, and increased drag. Separation near the leading edge is especially bad for a hydrofoil, because it leads to ventilation and the sudden loss of three-quarers of the lift.

So, while ogive sections may be easy to construct, I’m not enamored with their hydrodynamics.

Today, it’s much better to specify the pressure distribution and then calculate the section shape that will produce it. That way you can see what needs to be fixed in the hydrodynamics and go after it directly instead of shooting in the dark by modifying the geometry. “,”2005-12-17″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”946625”

“3”,”946625″,”2″,”Re; Re; Revolutionizing a watersport||946625″,”Tom Speer, any discussion of ogival hydrofoils sections is of interest to me. I have made and flown several such foils. They are easy to construct by welding a rolled piece of metal plate to a flat metal plate and then grinding to make the welds fair.

You have mentioned the idea of adding a radius to the leading edge of the ogival foil. This could be done by welding the forward edges of the top and bottom plates to a rounded section–a tube or a bar. Two questions: Do you have some guidelines on choosing a radius to the rounded leading edge? And, is the junction between the rounded edge and the top plate and the bottom plate a big problem? Would you think this to be a difficult transition?”,”2005-12-12″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,”rvell@san.rr.com”,”945783″

“4”,”945783″,”2″,”Re; Revolutionizing a watersport||945783″,”Yes, it’s possible to design fore-aft symmetric foils that will work equally well in both directions. You basically have two possible approaches: sharp-edged, and rounded edges.

Examples of the sharp-edged foils are the ogival that have been used by may hydrofoil designers. They have the advantage of being simple to construct and have low drag within their design range of angles of attack. The problem with sharp leading edges is they only have a small range of angles of attack at which the flow is attached. Outside that range, they experience leading edge separation. This can lead to sudden ventilation – a charactersitic that has bedeviled many craft that use these sections. You can find section data for ogival sections published in the literature and in books like Hoern’er’s “Fluid Dynamic Drag”.

The round-edged approach promotes leading edge suction for low drag and does not necessarily suffer from leading edge stall. There will be a separated zone at the trailing edge which can cause some increased drag. Elliptical sections have been used for some stopped-rotor VTOL aircraft.

To the best of my knowledge, the only round-edged sections specifically designed for use as hydrofoils can be found at http://www.basiliscus.com/ProaSections/ProaIndex.html. XFOIL predicts the Proa-3 series sections have performance comparable to NACA 6-series sections.

“,”2005-12-10″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”935018”

“5”,”942165″,”2″,”Foil works in forward or reverse direction||942165″,”You haven’t said specifically which watersport you want to revolutionize, but I’m pretty sure I know. I won’t say it outright here because you seem to be concerned with someone stealing your idea. I have had discussions with others wanting to do the same thing, and have evaluated some of the pitfalls. If you drop me a line at tothebin@adelphia.net, I’ll send you my contact info and we can talk, I’m in Stuart Florida. I may not have the ultimate answer for you, but I think I can help.”,”2005-12-03″,”Scott Smith”,”nopswd”,” “,”boatswithwings@adelphia.net”,”941596″

“6”,”941596″,”2″,”Foil works in forward or reverse direction||941596″,”Nat,
I appreciate your response, but have no idea what you said. I’m not familiar with a “soft” foil. I have so many questions, I feel I’m just going to be more of a burden than anything on here. But again, I am willing to pay someone for their time. Also, maybe there is somewhere I can go for more info, I have tapped the internet for all its worth.

Thanks to all,
Derek”,”2005-12-02″,”Derek”,”nopswd”,” “,”Derekseaman@gmail.com”,”941408″

“7”,”941408″,”2″,”Foil works in forward or reverse direction||941408″,”I SUGGEST THAT YOU CONSIDER A SOFT FOIL OVER A RIGID SPAR FOR SAFETY. ALSO, IF PROPERLY DESIGNED IT COULD BE INHERENTLY STABLE. (THAT IS IT WOULD DEFORM TO REDUCE THE ANGLE OF ATTACK IF STALL APPROACHES.) NAT K”,”2005-12-02″,”NAT KOBITZ”,”nopswd”,” “,”kobitzn@ctc.com”,”940695″

“8”,”940695″,”2″,”Foil works in forward or reverse direction||940695″,”Thank you all for your help. Unfortunately, I am still unsure if the design I have in mind is possible. There are many variables that are not taken into consideration with hydrofoil boat designs that I have to think about. For example, instead of proplusion, this board will be towed, and the rider of the board will be able to manipulate the board in ways we could not with a boat. If there is anyone that would be willing to give me a little more in depth advice, possibly over the phone, or in person (I live in Orlando), I would be more than willing to pay for your time. I need to first determine whether it would be physically possible to do what I want, and then if it is, I would have to explain some of the problems that might arise that are not addressed with any other hydrofoil. If all goes well, I would like to make a few prototypes, and start a company that would revolutionize the fastest growing watersport.

Thanks for everyone’s time,
Derek Seaman
407-739-1827″,”2005-12-01″,”Derek”,”nopswd”,” “,”derekseaman@gmail.com”,”938319″

“9”,”938319″,”2″,”Foil works in forward or reverse direction||938319″,”A complete copy of this 57 page report is in my hands. Today I offered it to Barney Black to be posted on the IHS site. If he accepts, you can download it from there soon.

I have used the Ogival sections with some success. They are useful because they can be built easily using sheet metal, a welder and a metal grinder.”,”2005-11-26″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”935301”

“10”,”938089″,”2″,”Re; Hydro foil designs||938089″,”Go to a good technical library and take out a copy of “Theory of Wing Sections” by Ira Abbott and Von Doenhoff, by Dover Publications, Inc., NY c 1959.

All the airfoil sections described there will work as foils. The charts shown for lift and drag coefficients will be accurate for air or water. Just remember that water is 800 times more dense that air so the resulting speed, lift, drag, etc. will differ accordingly. “,”2005-11-26″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”935322”

“11”,”935334″,”2″,”Foil drag, size vs. angle of attack||935334″,”Ray, you seem to know what you are talking, about please look at my posting and see if you have any input.
Thanks
Dan Bush”,”2005-11-20″,”Dan Bush”,”nopswd”,” “,”lostboys81@bellsouth.net”,”918835″

“12”,”935322″,”2″,”Hydro foil designs||935322″,”I have a 1973 Carri Craft Catarmaran. Full displacement hulls. Lenght 57″, beam 12′.If I did the calculations correctly theoritcal hull speed is close to 20 knots. I am not willing to repower or pay the fuel penalty for this speed. I should mention I have lived on /traveled in this boat for three years and the following speeds and fuel economies are from more than 1000 hours of travel,deterimined by gps. While in drydock two years ago I added three fins/stabilizers on each hull, 8″ wide and 8′ long. This solved the problem of excessive roll at anchor or docked. When I added these fins I expected to lose a knot or more due to extra drag. Much to my surprise and pleasure I actually picked up a knot in speed. Boat weighs approximately 38,000 lbs empty, has twin Isuzu 150 horse diesels, and the best speed I have gotten out of her to date has been a little over 12 knots at 2400 rpm slinging 20×20 four bladed nibrile props. I have solved an over heating problem and can now go to a continous 2700 rpm. Fuel effiency at 9 knots is(I am not a liar, normally I tell people three knots per gallon) 4 knots per gallon at approximately 50,000 lbs gross weight. Currently I am in dry dock and it occurred to me that by reshaping my stabilizers as hydro foils I could gain more speed. I need foil designs. It seems that the strenght of my stabilizers is sufficient to support the weight of the boat. Idiots ran STRAPS over the fins and lifted my boat with no damage.They moved it while I was not present from one place to another in the yard. The front fin is canted upwards three inches out of level which I suspect is the reason for my speed gain. I currently have helicopter foil designs which I may expand out to eight feet and install. It seems to me with the front fin pitched 3% higher then the middle and last foil like Burt Rutans designs the level of the boat should be limited by stalling of the front first. I am seriously contemplating adding trim control but before I do this I would like to add hydrofoils and play with it for six months.
I should add that I am a fully competent welder, actually “enjoy” fiberglass work, can wander around a machine shop and identify a tool or two. Feed back on hydro foil shapes would be greatly appreciated. This is not “pie-in the sky”, I will be modifying my stabilizers in the next few weeks. Your help will be greatly appreciated and is worth a wild time out fishing, or traveling to some exoctic port to get into exoctic trouble.”,”2005-11-20″,”Dan Bush”,”nopswd”,” “,”lostboys81@bellsouth.net”,”2″

“13”,”935307″,”2″,”Foil works in forward or reverse direction||935307″,”I have a photocopy of a few pages of Report No. E-79-6 “WATER TUNNEL OBSERVATIONS ON THE FLOW PAST A PLANO-CONVEX HYDROFOIL”, by R.B. Wade, February 1964, Division of Engineering and Applied Science, CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY, Pasadena, California. On the cover page, it also says “Office of Naval Research Department of the Navy Contract Nonr-220(24)”, and “D.J.Nigg” in handwriting. I forget where I got it, maybe from Donald Nigg himself. Is he still making foils?

Anyways, the paper gives lift & drag data for a foil with an “ogive” section. That means straight line on the bottom, circular arc on the top. The model used for testing is 0.19″ thick, with a chord length of 2.77″. At zero degrees angle of attack CL is 0.4 and CD is 0.013. This would be the same forward or reverse.

Maybe someone with access to the whole report could get it posted on the IHS website. As a last resort, I could scan what I have, but it’s incomplete. Not sure about the copyright issues here.”,”2005-11-20″,”Mac Stevens”,”nopswd”,” “,”stevensm@earthlink.net”,”935018″

“14”,”935301″,”2″,”Foil works in forward or reverse direction||935301″,”I have a photocopy of a few pages of Report No. E-79-6 “WATER TUNNEL OBSERVATIONS ON THE FLOW PAST A PLANO-CONVEX HYDROFOIL”, by R.B. Wade, February 1964, Division of Engineering and Applied Science, CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY, Pasadena, California. On the cover page, it also says “Office of Naval Research Department of the Navy Contract Nonr-220(24)”, and “D.J.Nigg” in handwriting. I forget where I got it, maybe from Donald Nigg himself. Is he still making foils?

Anyways, the paper gives lift & drag data for a foil with an “ogive” section. That means straight line on the bottom, circular arc on the top. The model used for testing is 0.19″ thick, with a chord length of 2.77″. At zero degrees angle of attack CL is 0.4 and CD is 0.013. This would be the same forward or reverse.

Maybe someone with access to the whole report could get it posted on the IHS website. As a last resort, I could scan what I have, but it’s incomplete. Not sure about the copyright issues here.”,”2005-11-20″,”Mac Stevens”,”nopswd”,” “,”stevensm@earthlink.net”,”935018″

“15”,”935018″,”2″,”Revolutionizing a watersport||935018″,”I think the use of foils may change the watersport I love. Unfortunately, I cannot seem to find the information I need to make a basic hypothesis on the design. Every hydrofoil I have seen is based upon moving in one direction (boats don’t reverse at high speeds). Is it possible to have a hydrofoil design that allows movement in opposite directions and will perform well either way? If you could imagine a symmetrical jet propelled boat, so that it could go backwards or forwards either way. Any help would be appreciated.”,”2005-11-19″,”Derek”,”nopswd”,” “,”derekseaman@gmail.com”,”2″

“16”,”931880″,”2″,”Re; Assistance wanted – foil design||931880″,”Dear Bob,

Please give me a call or send me your phone number and email contact.
You can call me on (203) 313 4061.

My company, Hydrofoil Assisted Water Craft HAWC Technologies was recently formed.

We work to help people like you, and believe we will have a solution for you. We need to assess your vessel’s basic information first in order to do a speed prediction based upon the vessel’s length, displacement weight and power amongst some other info.

Looking forward to talking with you.

BR
Gerhard “,”2005-11-14″,”Gerhard Kutt”,”nopswd”,” “,”caemarine@earthlink.net”,”926828″

“17”,”926832″,”2″,”Assistance wanted – Foil design||926832″,”We have a 24 meter commercial Catamaran with a cruising speed of approx. 25 knots with full load. We plan to retrofit the vessel with “aasisting” foils.
We are looking for an hydrofoil expert that can assist in the design and technical specification of “assisting” foils that will be placed between the hulls of the Cat. The goal is to reach a cruising speed of approx 27-28 knots and with a lower the fuel consumption than today. (if possible)!

Best regards, Bob Email: swedbob@hotmail.com”,”2005-11-05″,”Bob”,”swedbob”,” “,”swedbob@hotmail.com”,”2″

“18”,”926828″,”2″,”Assistance wanted – foil design||926828″,”We have a 24 meter commercial Catamaran with a cruising speed of approx. 25 knots with full load. We plan to retrofit the vessel with “aasisting” foils.
We are looking for an hydrofoil expert that can assist in the design and technical specification of “assisting” foils that will be placed between the hulls of the Cat. The goal is to be able to reach a cruising speed of approx 27-28 knots and lower the fuel consumption.

Best regards, Bob”,”2005-11-05″,”Bob”,”swedbob”,” “,”swedbob@hotmail.com”,”2″

“19”,”925912″,”2″,”Foil drag, size vs. angle of attack||925912″,”I appreciate the feedback, but it wasn’t really what I was asking. I’m not trying to determine the optimum foil size or profile at this time. I am trying to find out at a fixed speed and weight, which has less drag, a larger foil at lower angle of attack, or a smaller foil at higher angle of attack. A perfectly trimmed hydrofoil boat (without active controls) will perform quite differently if the overall weight or weight distribution changes. I see three directions to attack this problem. One is to have foils sized and trimmed for optimum performance when the boat is lightest, then increase the angle of attack when the boat is heavy. The second is to size and trim the foils for the boat at its heaviest, then run the foils at a reduced angle of attack when the boat is lighter. The third is of course to size and trim the foils at a point halfway between the weights, and then re-trim accordingly as the weight changes. I’m trying to figure out which will have the least drag penalty when run at the most commonly used weight.”,”2005-11-04″,”Scott Smith”,”nopswd”,” “,”boatswithwings@adelphia.net”,”920315″

“20”,”920315″,”2″,”Foil drag, size vs. angle of attack||920315″,”Check your data. I believe it is in error.
NAT KOBITZ”,”2005-10-26″,”NAT KOBITZ”,”nopswd”,” “,”kobitzn@ctc.com”,”918835″

“21”,”918835″,”2″,”Foil drag, size vs. angle of attack||918835″,”Scott Smith: Look on page 522 and 523 of “Theory of Wing Sections” By Abbot & Doenhoff for the
best Lift over Drag ratio, L/D for the wing section NACA 63412. This section is in common use.
The best L/D is at about Coefficient of Lift = .4. This occures at -6 degrees Angle of Attack.
The Excel formula attached determines that the area should be 1.32 square feet.
If your cord were 4.75 inches, the span should be 40.1 inches.
“,”2005-10-24″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,”rvell7829@yahoo.com”,”917973″

“22”,”917973″,”2″,”Foil drag, size vs. angle of attack||917973″,”This is a rather simple question, and I hope there is a simple answer, but here goes: I am looking at the design of a foil wing that must support a fixed weight at a fixed speed, let’s say 1000 pounds at 30 mph. Which has less drag, a larger foil at lower angle of attack, or a smaller foil at higher angle of attack? Other considerations such as stall angle are not important.”,”2005-10-22″,”Scott Smith”,”nopswd”,” “,”boatswithwings@adelphia.net”,”2″

“23”,”917248″,”2″,”Re; Stevenson SportFoiler Published||917248″,”This is indeed good news, as there have been many requests over the years for these plans. IHS should ask permission to reprint them in the next hydrofoil CD-ROM”,”2005-10-20″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,” “,”916786”

“24”,”916786″,”2″,”Stevenson SportFoiler Published||916786″,”Stevenson Projects produced a set of plans for the SportFoiler, a single person surface-piercing hydrofoil. Unfortunately, several years ago they abruptly discontinued the plans, although many of us have asked for them.

To my delight, Stevenson Products has published the plans (for free!!) online. The address is: http://www.stevproj.com/TheSportfoilPlans.pdf

I want to thank the people at Stevenson, as this project shows just how easy hydrofoils are to build. Don’t dismiss these plans. “,”2005-10-19″,”Barry Steele”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”2”

“25”,”908696″,”2″,”Re; Req for Technical Paper||908696″,”I don’t have a copy of the paper; however you may be interested in the following excerpt from IHS archival correspondence taken from www.foils.org/students.htm, and you may want to try the email contact:

[18 Jan 01] We were sort of toying with the idea of using supercavitating foils. Do any of you know where I can get some good information on supercavitating foil sections, or the design of supercavitating hydrofoil vessels. I don’t remember who asked, but I am pretty sure we are just doing our hull with FastShip and then doing analysis using NavCad. If you have a better suggestion (which can be handled at an undergraduate level) Id love to hear it as well. — Earon S. Rein, MIDN USN (m015346@nadn.navy.mil)

Responses…

[18 Jan 01] Two suggested sources:

Altman, R., “The Design of Supercavitating Hydrofoil Wings,” Technical Report 001-14, Hydronautics Inc., April 1968.
Martin, M., “The Stability Derivatives of A Hydrofoil Boat – Part II”, Technical Report 001-10(II), Hydronautics Inc., January 1963.
[18 Jan 01] The best info I’m aware of on supcav foil sections is the Carderock work in the 1970s on the “TAP-2” series of base-vented supercavitating foils. The work may have been done by Young Shen but I’m not sure. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)

“,”2005-10-06″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,” “,”904808”

“26”,”904808″,”2″,”Req for Technical Paper||904808″,”Where can I find this paper Altman, R., “The Design of Supercavitating Hydrofoil Wings,” Technical Report 001-14, Hydronautics Inc., April 1968[. Can somebody email me the pdf version of this paper at the following mp_mathew@hotmail.com.”,”2005-10-01″,”M.P. Mathew”,”nopswd”,” “,”mp_mathew@hotmail.com”,”2″

“27”,”889045″,”2″,” Supercavitating Foils||889045″,” I have to design supercavitating hydrofoils for a hydrofoil vessel going upto a max speed of 70 knots. I was thinking of going for Tulin’s sections. But I also know that the L/D charecteristics for this type of sections below 40 kts would be absymally poor. Am I correct? Can I use the public domain XFOIL(by Mark Drela) for getting the fully wetted Lift and Drag charecteristics for these sections for the non cavitating regime(upto 40 knots)or is XFOIL not suitable for sharp leading edge profiles.

My second question: Can I use base ventilated tulin section foils so that I can get supercavitating regime even at low speeds. How are supercavitating flows and base ventillated foils related. Can I use linearized Tulin’s theory for base ventillated foils. Are base ventillated foils approaching sigma (cavitation no.) = 0 . How do i get the lift and drag coefficients for base vented foils otherwise. Any references will be highly appreciated. Thanx
“,”2005-09-06″,”MP Mathew”,”nopswd”,” “,”mpmathew73@yahoo.com”,”2″

“28”,”888679″,”2″,”Re; Question on fully submerged foils||888679″,”My Dynafoils use a fixed rear foil, fully submerged. The front foil is a simple mechanical system, fully submerged foil coupled to a surface follower. There are no other controls except steering and throttle. It can be a handfull to control at times, but only because it is short, with deep foils and lots of power. At moderate power levels and reasonbly calm seas it handles just fine, with no roll control aparatus or trimming of the foils needed. On smaller boats with less roll moment, steering works just fine to control roll issues.”,”2005-09-05″,”Scott Smith”,”nopswd”,” “,”boatswithwings@adelphia.net”,”872569″

“29”,”888667″,”2″,”Re; Cheap ready made hydrofoils?||888667″,”I have copies of the old Popular Science articles on how to make wooden foils cheaply, with a tablesaw. Would work very well for you. Drop me a line and I’ll e-mail them to you, free.”,”2005-09-05″,”Scott Smith”,”nopswd”,” “,”boatswithwings@adelphia.net”,”2″

“30”,”884493″,”2″,”Re; Idea; Use Air to Bank Turns||884493″,”Grant,

Your proposal to use air feed to control the lift force on a hydrofoil is a sensible one. So sensible in fact, that it has been successfully implemented on both small and large hydrofoils!

The name most commonly applied to this method of hydrofoil stabilisation is “controlled ventilation”. In this context, the term “ventilation” refers to air being drawn down to the foils. On the other hand “cavitation” refers to water changing state to ‘steam’ due to very low pressure as sometimes occurs on hydrofoils so isn’t as accurate a description of what is happening.

My understanding is that this concept was first practically applied by the Swiss based company Supramar headed up by the hydrofoil pioneer Baron Hans von Schertel. Early experiments were carried out on a Supramar ST 3A fully submerged air-stabilised hydrofoil research craft. Later, various large passenger hydrofoils adopted the concept, in particular the Supramar PT 150 of which three were built. My understanding is that air stabilisation may have variously been used to assist with roll, pitch and heave stabilisation of hydrofoil.

Hans von Schertel wrote a number of technical papers on this concept at the time pointing out its advantages over conventional flapped hydrofoils. None the less, it never seems to have achieved widespread application. I don’t know why.

You would be able to find out more details if you can gain access to early issues of Jane’s Surface Skimmers or the journal “Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil” from the 60’s.

In more recent years, there had been renewed interest in foil stabilisation using air feed. A research project in Australia had considered this approach for use in controlling lift on motion control foils (for catamarans and the like). In that case, the concept had been referred to as “lift dumping foils”. I don’t believe this progressed to any operational systems.

I was not aware of any Italian research / patents on this concept but would be interested to hear more about that.

Good luck with your own experimentation.

Martin”,”2005-08-28″,”Martin Grimm”,”nopswd”,” “,”seaflite@alphalink.com.au”,”883043″

“31”,”883043″,”2″,”Re; Idea; Use Air to Bank Turns||883043″,”I believe this type of foil control is called artificial cavitation. I am not sure what or how much effect it has on foils at different speeds. It may not be enough effect to control the boat. The Italian patent was for large fast ferries carrying a couple of hundred passengers. I don’t think it was ever used. I think that Boeing may have investigated this idea too. I believe they held a few patents for artificial cavitation in other forms as well. I was thinking it might have application in smaller recreational boats.

My first test will be to try to improve the turning ability of My Volga. A 90-meter turning radius is not exactly turning on a dime (with very little banking). My first trial will be to use some 1” rubber hose and a lot of duct tape. Two hoses (port and starboard) will run from the cockpit to the bow and down to the center two struts (of 4) on the front foil the hose will end right at the top of the foil. A valve at the cockpit controls the airflow. Massive amounts of duck tape should smooth out the bump the hose will make as it goes down the strut. The strut is not hollow; it is made of 1/4’” stainless steel. Any ideas?
“,”2005-08-25″,”Grant Calverley”,”nopswd”,” “,”grant@sanjuantimberframes.com”,”882728″

“32”,”882728″,”2″,”Re; Idea; Use Air to Bank Turns||882728″,”Revision #1 of Idea
On rethinking it seems air passages on from the struts to the foils should not be crossed from port to starboard and visa versa. On a boat unevenly loaded or running parallel to waves it would not right its self. It could even get dangerous as the heavy side of the boat would lose lift and sink even lower. The lower it sinks the greater the lift on the opposite side. Opps bit of a problem. It would be easier to make a foil without the cross over air tube feature anyway.

Another benefit to not having it cross over is after an operator initiated banked turn is complete the boat would right itself automatically. The lower (deeper) side would have more lift than the upper side creating a righting effect. The operator initiated banked turn air system would need to override or supply more air than the altitude control air system. The two systems would be somewhat fighting each other.
“,”2005-08-24″,”Grant Calverley”,”nopswd”,” “,”grant@sanjuantimberframes.com”,”882721″

“33”,”882721″,”2″,”Idea; Use Air to Bank Turns||882721″,”Hello,

I have been kicking around a simple idea for stabilizing fully submerged foils for a long time. I did a patent search a while back and found that an Italian had patented a very similar idea for fast hydrofoil ferries before I was born in 1963. It seems like a good Idea so I will attempt to describe it. Maybe some one else can use the idea and make it real. I am not an engineer but would be interested to have some feedback.

The system would have almost no moving parts. It would use hollow struts and foils. Air supplied to the tops of the foils to reduce lift would main mechanism for stability, banked turns and attitude control. Two separate sets of holes on the port and starboard sides of the foils (like holes on a flute) would be across the top in the low-pressure area.

Banked Turns. When a banked turn to the right is desired an air is supplied to the right side of the foil decreasing its lift creating a banked turn. The mechanism could be as simple as a two tubes and valves (for port and starboard turns) near the steering wheel. Open the valve just before starting your turn. Electronically a turn signal lever like on a car would work well and is already instinctive to use. I have a Volga 70 and may try a duck tape and plastic hose version of this banked turn concept next year. (when I get it running)

Altitude Control and Stability. The banked turns would require some mechanical input to initiate. Attitude control would be automatic and may require a separate set of holes from the banked turn set. The line of holes on the top surface of the starboard side of the foil would be connected through the hollow foil to a corresponding set of holes in the side of the strut on the port side of the boat. At slow speeds all of the holes in the strut would be below the surface. As the boat gains speed the strut raises out of the water and the first of a serious of holes is exposed to the air. The low pressure of the wing sucks the air down through the hole and reduces the lift slightly. As the boat speeds up more holes are exposed and the lift is reduced even more maintaining equilibrium in altitude. Having the air lines cross from port strut to starboard foil and vies versa would aid in banked turns.

There are a few problems /questions in my mind. 1) Is there enough suction on the top surface of the wing to suck the air down the tubes and blow out the water that would be there already? Would you need compressed air?.(the Italians used compressed air and some complicated sensors from what I remember) 2)The hole’s orifices would need to be sized and located very carefully. Not to big and not too little. 3) Would there be a big lag time as the water is pushed out of the struts and hollow foils. 4) At slower speeds water would circulate through the strut and foils holes, would this effect lift? 5) Would the boat right its self after completing a banked turn?

I would appreciate some feedback and may try some simple experiments on my Volga next year if it is warranted. What do you think, does it have merit or is it flawed? I never even took Physics in high school so go easy on me.

Grant Calverley
“,”2005-08-24″,”Grant Calverley”,”nopswd”,” “,”grant@sanjuantimberframes.com”,”2″

“34”,”872638″,”2″,”wsome Re; Re; Re; FOIL SHAPE AND AN||872638″,”Awsome answer. Thank you Tom.
I have already experienced much of what you have discussed. I actually started with a low angle, and found that the drag of the foils actually pulled the boat down. I compensated by doubleing the front angle, and that helped. I had already preset the rear foils at an angle of six degrees. So by end of testing on the first day, it came down to the fact that my jet pump could not supply enough thrust.
I have doubled the size of the pump, and have created a four bladed impeller. I also have an output reduction cone built to see if reducing the output diameter doesn’t increase the speed of the output.
I have several things to try including two more motors.

I was hoping to get 12mph, and the first pump failed miserbley.
I don’t think I will have any chances at the pond till next weekend

Thank you

“,”2005-08-06″,”Umi_Ryuzuki”,”nopswd”,” “,”umi_ryuzuki@hotmail.com”,”872597″

“35”,”872597″,”2″,”Re; Re; FOIL SHAPE AND ANGLE||872597″,”You have the basic idea, but I think you’re missing a couple of things. You do get the area by assuming lift = weight and dividing by the dynamic pressure and design lift coefficient. But you have to use consistent units.

The factor F in your formula is the fluid density divided by 2. For water, the density is (using your English units) 1.939 slug/ft^3, so the Factor F should be 0.9695 for fresh water, or pretty close to 1.

The velocity has to be in ft/sec to be consistent, so I’ll take the “12” in your calculations as being 12 ft/sec (same as 8.2 mph or 7.1 kt). The velocity has to be squared, which I’m not sure you did to come up with your final result.

So at a speed of 12 ft/sec and a lift coefficient of 0.5349, I get an area of 0.067 sq ft or 9.64 sq in for the required area. Since each of your wings have an area of 7.5 sq in, getting the 5 lb of lift from 6 of them is not a problem. The extra area will let you fly at half the design speed of 12 ft/sec.

However, while the average lift coefficient may be 0.5349, that doesn’t mean the local lift coefficient will be the same over all parts of the wing. For your swept foils, the tips will be loaded more heavily than the root. This is due to the downwash in the wake of the hydrofoil and how it affects the conditions along the span.

And the angle of attack of the foils will not be 2.25 degrees as indicated by the two-dimensional section data. Those data are for a foil of infinite span, so it produces an infintessimal downwash. The shorter the span, the greater the downwash to produce the same lift, so the angle of attack has to be increased to offset the downwash. Your foils have an aspect ratio of 4, and at a lift coefficient of 0.5349, an additional 2.44 degrees of angle of attack will be needed because of the downwash. So the incidence of your foils will be more like 4.7 degrees than the 2.25 given by the section data for the same lift coefficient.

But more than that, the downwash will increase the drag substantially. You should allow for an additional drag coefficient of 0.0228 because of the lift-induced drag. This is 0.21 pound of additional thrust required. The induced drag goes down by the square of the span, so if you make your foils wider they will be much more efficient. But this runs into problems of strength and stiffness, so the span is always a compromise. The induced drag goes DOWN with speed (squared), so flying at too slow a speed can actually require more power than going fast.”,”2005-08-05″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”2″

“36”,”872572″,”2″,”Re; Cheap ready made hydrofoils?||872572″,”Take a look at http://www.fastacraft.com/moulded_foils.html”,”2005-08-05″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”2″

“37”,”872569″,”2″,”Re; Question on fully submerged foils||872569″,”It’s not enough to balance lift against weight. You also have to balance the moments that want to turn the craft, tip it over, or pitch it. And the problem with balancing the lift is the lift is constantly changing as a function of speed, the attitude of the craft, and the disturbances from waves, gusts, thrust changes, etc. So when it does change, there has to be a means of returning it to its original value. If you hold a broom upside down on your hand, it’s easy to compensate for the weight of the broom. But the moments are unstable so you can’t maintain that balance without actively compensating for any change.

There’re also the problems of regulating the flying height, maneuvering and accommodating different amounts of payload.

Lift at a constant speed and attitude does drop off as the foils get close to the surface. It’s possible to use this effect to stabilize the craft if you are operating in flat water. But this also robs the fully submerged foil of much of its performance advantages.”,”2005-08-05″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”2″

“38”,”862463″,”2″,”Re; Cheap ready made hydrofoils?||862463″,”There were some articles published in the late 1950s – early 1960s in hobbyist magazines as to how to make wooden hydrofoils and add them to runabout-type boats. For example, Popular Science June 1960 has an article, “How I Fitted Oak Hydrofoils To My 14-Foot Runabout.” Science and Mechanics Feb 1960 has a similar article, with foil design for boats up to 18 feet length. Take a look at the magazine descriptions on the IHS website in the Hobbyist section of this page: www.foils.org/popmags.htm.

You can buy copies of old magazines by searching for them on eBay and/or google.com. Sooner or later, just about everything shows up on eBay. Google will find you magazine sellers who sell directly. I have used the Canadian company “Smelly Old Books” http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/sobooks/(contact: John Muxlow jj.muxlow@ns.sympatico.ca) to obtain reasonably priced copies of articles back to the 1920s and earlier (S.O.B. has an almost complete collection of Mechanix Illustrated, Popular Mechanics, and Popular Science). It has been a while since I contacted them, so I hope the URL and email address are still good.”,”2005-07-18″,”Barney C Black”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”0”

“39”,”861182″,”2″,”Re; FOIL SHAPE AND ANGLE||861182″,”So No help or confirmation on the previous calculations?
“,”2005-07-15″,”Umi_Ryuzuki”,”nopswd”,” “,”umi_ryuzuki@hotmail.com”,”0″

“40”,”860748″,”2″,”Re; Question on fully submerged foils||860748″,”Maintaining a close enough balance between weight and lift without feedback control to allow a flight for more than a few seconds is currently not possible. Suggest you consider a mechanical feedback controller. The Rave, Hobie Trifoiler, and the height control on Talaria IV all use mechanical surface sensors with linkages to their foils to maintain a balance between lift and weight. “,”2005-07-14″,”Harry Larsen”,”nopswd”,” “,”htdr.larsen@verizon.net”,”0″

“41”,”860689″,”2″,”Re; Question on fully submerged foils||860689″,”Thanks! That puts me very close to the goal.

Andy”,”2005-07-14″,”Andy”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”0”

“42”,”860646″,”2″,”Re; Question on fully submerged foils||860646″,”If you are using fully submerged foils for main lift, you can have a 25 to 35% lift stabilizing, surface piercing foils to supplant an autopilot. I do not know of any all fully submerged foil systems that are self stable.”,”2005-07-14″,”NAT KOBITZ”,”nopswd”,” “,”kobitzn@ctc.com”,”0″

“43”,”860356″,”2″,”Question on fully submerged foils||860356″,”I have read that fully submerged foils require flight control. My question is whether this is strictly necessary, or if I could design a submerged foil for a specific boat through experimentation that would be functional without flight control. The idea being to balance the lift against the weight of the boat.

Thanks,
Andy
“,”2005-07-13″,”Andy”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”0”

“44”,”856862″,”2″,”Cheap ready made hydrofoils?||856862″,”Forgive me for my ignorance- I’m only just starting to embark on a project to add hydrofoils to a 12′ boat. I’ve been searcing for ready made aerofoil sections that could be used, and of course there are none specifically for hydrofoils-other than sailing ones, which are still expensive and probably unsuitable. When I searched under ‘aluminium aerofoil section extrusions’ I came up with extrusions intyended as sun blinds, see page 14 for an example :http://www.productselector.co.uk/docs/4/02274/external/COL02274.pdf
I realise the sections avaiable would not be the most efficient, but would using these extrusions provide a cheap and reasonably efficient way of getting foilborne?

Any comments?

Cheers, Roland

r.wilson@bath.ac.uk”,”2005-07-07″,”Roland Wilson”,”nopswd”,” “,”r.wilson@bath.ac.uk”,”0″

“45”,”855770″,”2″,”Re; Re; FOIL SHAPE AND ANGLE||855770″,”Let me see if I read all this correctly.

S = L / F U^2 Cl

S = 5lbs/ (2.09)(12©÷)(0.5349*) *assuming a 2.25¡æ angle of attack.

S = 5lbs/ 160.9835

S = 0.310591 sq ft

Therefore S = 44.725104 sq inches divide by 3 for each foil

Each wing needs an area of 14.908 sq inches
¡î14.908 = 3.861 square plate cut diagonally

Am I correct in assuming a six wings one on each side of the struts with

a root of 2.5″
trailing edge of 3.875″
tip length of 1.375″

Will fly a 5 lbs (2.268k) hydrofoil?
Would this include control surfaces, or would adding control surfaces to the existing area be preferred?

Thank you in advance.

Umi_Ryuzuki

Nyow
\
=^o^=

“,”2005-07-04″,”Umi_Ryuzuki”,”nopswd”,” “,”umi_ryuzuki@hotmail.com”,”0″

“46”,”830353″,”2″,”Re; Foil Design Help||830353″,”hi sam,

you might want to re-think the approach to what you are trying to achieve. a hydro foil solution for wake boards has been around for ages.
it’s called the WEDGE and is a fold down foil under the stern of the boat that pulls the boat DOWN at speed to increase the wake.

http://www.glencraftmarina.com/Pages/malibu.html

cheers
boogie”,”2005-05-17″,”Boogie”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”0”

“47”,”824680″,”2″,”Foil Design Help||824680″,”Gday mate my name is sam doolan and I am an Industrial design student from
RMIT university Melbourne Australia. I am currently designing a foil, which
creates larger wakes for wakeborders by lifting the front of the boat and
transferring the weight to the back, to give it larger wakes. However I am
sure how the foils should be designed. Wether one at the front of the boat,
or coming off both sides or both. Would you be able to answer this question
for me.”,”2005-05-06″,”sam doolan”,”nopswd”,” “,”doolans@bigpond.net.au”,”0″

“48”,”824319″,”2″,”Re; Re; coordinated (banked) turns||824319″,”Could you send us a picture?”,”2005-05-06″,”Harry Larsen”,”nopswd”,” “,”htdr.larsen@verizon.net”,”0″

“49”,”823711″,”2″,”Re; Re; coordinated (banked) turns||823711″,”Thanks for your response and info. We call the boat “straightfastboat” as it’s very fast in a straight line, 65mph+ and requires slowing and greater immersion of the rudder to turn with a bit of inboard banking. I’ll try deepening the rudder as a first move and stay away from adjustable angle of attack in the foils. “,”2005-05-05″,”Mike Turner”,”nopswd”,” “,”mike@turnermarinegroup.com”,”0″

“50”,”823598″,”2″,”Re; Re; coordinated (banked) turns||823598″,”Roll can be a complicated consequence of rudder deflection. Since the rudder is located below the center of mass, a port deflection of an aft-mounted rudder will result in a rolling moment to port.

It also produces a yawing moment, of course, and as the craft yaws to port, it picks up a sideslip (leeway) angle. If the foil system has positive roll stability – like a V foil configuration – the sideslip angle will also make the craft roll to port. Roll due to sideslip is likely to be the more powerful effect of the two. As the bank develops, the sideslip angle will be reduced.

But it takes some time for the craft to rotate enough to generate the sideslip. So there’s lag between when you put in the input and when the rolling due to sideslip is experienced. The rolling moment due to the rudder deflection itself is prompt. The sideslip itself will reduce the force on the rudder, lessening the rolling moment from that source.

If the rudder is on a forward strut, then the craft will yaw in the opposite direction, the sideslip will be reversed, and the roll due to rudder deflection and the roll due to sideslip will be of opposite sign.

So the relationship between rudder and roll depends on the placement of the rudder, the stability of the craft, and the frequency of the input. The rolling due to rudder could be opposite in sign for different frequency ranges.
“,”2005-05-04″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”0″

“51”,”823592″,”2″,”Re; Re; coordinated (banked) turns||823592″,”Yes, typically. Like ailerons on an airplane wing.

But they could be done in many ways. You could change the incidence on a whole foil, positive for the port foil and negative for the starboard foil to get a positive rolling moment. You could articulate the outer panel of a hydrofoil. Flaps are an effective and easily mechanized way to go. But not the only way.

Aeronautical experience has shown that it’s not a good idea to try to produce roll from a canard (forward wing), however. The resulting downwash has the opposite effect on the aft wing and can cancel or even reverse the intended rolling moment. The effects could be even more complicated by the way hydrfoil downwash is affected by the free surface.”,”2005-05-04″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”0″

“52”,”821847″,”2″,”Re; Re; coordinated (banked) turns||821847″,”When you dig up the info on this I’d love to se it. I have a Volga 70 that I’d like to convert the banking in turns to inboard rather than that disconcerting outboard feeling. My rudder depth will be increased soon and I’ll report the result. It currently is as deep as the prop blade sweep. Anyone have anything to suggest? “,”2005-05-02″,”Mike Turner”,”nopswd”,” “,”mike@turnermarinegroup.com”,”0″

“53”,”821718″,”2″,”Re; Re; coordinated (banked) turns||821718″,”You mention ‘roll surfaces’… are those the main hydrofoil surfaces (or flaps on the main foil)?”,”2005-05-01″,”Wayne Johnson”,”nopswd”,” “,”tspwtj@yahoo.com”,”0″

“54”,”821713″,”2″,”Re; Re; coordinated (banked) turns||821713″,”The mechanical… I wanted to be sure that I was not missing a simple thing like ‘roll is a consequence of rudder’, or some other simple mechanical link.”,”2005-05-01″,”Wayne Johnson”,”nopswd”,” “,”tspwtj@yahoo.com”,”0″

“55”,”821318″,”2″,”Re; coordinated (banked) turns||821318″,”The definition of a coordinated turn is zero lateral acceleraion (along the Y axis). One way to achieve it is to use lateral acceleration feedback to a rudder. The rudder turns the craft about its Z axis to zero the leeway angle that results in the side force causing the acceleration.

However, a tricky aspect of this with a hydrofoil is the center of mass of the craft is well above the foils, and the crew station is typically above that. So you have an issue with how you enter the turn. If the craft rolls about the hydrofoils, there will be a significant lateral acceleration of the center of mass, and a somewhat greater acceleration yet at the crew station. Acceleration feedback at that point would turn the rudder to point the craft to the outside of the turn. So you’d have the roll control and the yaw control fighting each other, and when the two get out of phase you could lose control.

Everything will be fine for slow gentle entries that don’t develop much acceleration. But if you apply a frequency sweep to the wheel, sarting with a slow oscillation of the wheel and working up to faster and faster reversals, you will arrive at the point at which the motion becomes alarming. I had the chance to experience this when I rode on Harry Larsen’s Talaria.

A better approach would be to rotate the craft about either the center of mass or the crew station. This requires that the hydrofoils describe a pendulum motion, swinging to the outside of the turn as the craft rolls and the g-loads increase – keeping the net hydrodynamic force aligned with center plane at all times. To get such a motion probably requires a means of generating direct side force on the foils, such as both a forward and aft rudder or a flap on a main strut in addition to the rudder. An interconnect between the roll surfaces and the side force flap(s) would generate the right linear acceleration of the foils in concert with the roll acceleration. The feedbacks would then deal with the left-over motion due to imperfect match in the interconnect, and the fact that the control deflections you want initially are not necessarily proportional to what you want in the steady state.

An alternative approach is to use model following. The commands from the helm go to a dynamic model that has the ideal chaaracteristics – rolling about the crew station, etc. The ideal model produces state, rate, and acceleration commands to a feedback regulator control law that makes the hydrofoil follow the ideal motion as closely as possible. The regulator would typically be designed using multivariable control theory (Linear Quadratic Gaussian, Pole Placement, or many others).

The ideal model can be simulated separately, independent of the configuration of the hydrofoil itself, assuming perfect model following. This lets you tune the characteristics in parallel with designing the rest of the system. For example, you might want the ideal model to descend a bit at the same time that it kicks the hydrofoils to the outside of the turn so that the foil tips don’t broach because of the pendulum motion.

I recommend Thor Fossen’s books and papers for more details.”,”2005-04-30″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”0″

“56”,”821034″,”2″,”Re; coordinated (banked) turns||821034″,”From a roll acceleration point of view a coordinated turn is no different than flying straight and level. Is your question related to the mechanical, sensor, electronic, or mathematical means of performing a coordinated turn? “,”2005-04-30″,”Harry Larsen”,”nopswd”,” “,”htdr.larsen@verizon.net”,”0″

“57”,”819978″,”2″,”coordinated (banked) turns||819978″,”How do you get a fully submerged type hydrofoil to bank in a turn?
Are there any documents which explore the requirements of coordinated turning? “,”2005-04-28″,”Wayne Johnson”,”nopswd”,” “,”tspwtj@yahoo.com”,”0″

“58”,”795120″,”2″,”Re; Foil pressure coefficient data||795120″,”I think your best bet would be to go to something like a Navier Stokes CFD code if you really want to characterize the flow well past stall.

You might be able to get some idea by going as far as you can with an integral boundary layer code like XFOIL. The idea is separation occurs in an adverse pressure gradient. So there must be a lower pressure ahead of the separated flow that is attached, and that might be predictable with a lesser method. My guess – and it’s just a guess – is that even though you operate well past stall, the worst case as far as minimum pressure is concerned might be at or just past stall, and this could be computed with something like XFOIL.

If you application is operating near the surface, though, ventilation rather than cavitation is likely to be your real problem. They both end up with vapor on the suction side, but for completely different reasons. The separated flow will be a real bear when it comes to ventilation, because you are setting up all the necessary preconditions for ventilation. If you insist on the separation, you’ll have to concentrate on keeping the air away from the separated regions.”,”2005-03-12″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”0″

“59”,”788896″,”2″,”Re: Foil pressure coefficient data||788896″,”Is stalling a separation of the boundary layer? Probably, the shapes with negative presure gradients will be usefull for your purpose to avoid cavitation. See my message No 7888876 and attached file.

“,”2005-03-01″,”Ihor Nesteruk”,”nopswd”,” “,”inesteruk@yahoo.com”,”0″

“60”,”788876″,”2″,”Hydrofoils without cavitation||788876″,”I am looking for people or organization wich are interested in futher investigation and wind tunnel tests of hydrofoils without cavitation. Please find the
details below and in the attached file.

Dr. Ihor Nesteruk
Institute of Hydromechanics
National Academy of Sciences of Ukraine
Kyiv
——–
Axisymmetric and plane shapes with negative pressure
gradients at a surface are calculated. It is shown
that the length of the pressure increase zone may be
very short. Some shapes of axisymmetric bodies tested
in a wind tunnel provide unseparated flow patterns.
Such shapes are both of theoretical and practical
interest, since the unseparated flow pattern gives an
opportunity to reduce the total drag of vehicles
moving in gas or liquid. Moreover presented shapes
probably provide no cavitation at arbitrary small
cavitation numbers (see theoretical and experimental
arguments in [1,2]). Tests in a water tunnel have to
be carried out to prove this fact. For the presented
2D profiles, there were no wind tunnel tests to
investigate their separation behavior at different
angles of attack. Such experiments could be carried
out in the wind tunnel of Kyiv Institute of
Hydromechanics. [1] Nesteruk I.: Can Shapes with
Negative Pressure Gradients Prevent Cavitation. 4th
ASME/JSME Joint Fluids Engineering Conference,
Honolulu, USA, July 2003: FEDSM2003-45323.[2]
Takahashi S., Washio S., Uemura K., Okazaki A.:
Experimental study on cavitation starting at and flow
characteristics close to the point of separation.
Fifth Symposium on Cavitation: No. Cav03-OS-3-003, 2003.

“,”2005-03-01″,”Ihor Nesteruk”,”nopswd”,” “,”inesteruk@yahoo.com”,”0″

“61”,”787296″,”2″,”Foil pressure coefficient data||787296″,”Could anyone tell me how I could get hold of minimum pressure coefficient data for aerofoils operating at and beyond the stall (ideally up to twice the stalling incidence)? I am designing a lifting device for a marine application which is heavily stalled for much of its operating life, and must not cavitate.

Many Thanks

Chris Huxley-Reynard

chris_huxley_reynard@hotmail.co.uk”,”2005-02-25″,”Chris Huxley-Reynard”,”nopswd”,” “,”chris_huxley_reynard@hotmail.co.uk”,”0″

“62”,”779156″,”2″,”Lift formula||779156″,”Konstatin Matveev’s lift formula is encoded in Excel on this web site:
http://mysite.verizon.net/res6pe7p/

“,”2005-02-10″,”Harry Larsen”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”0”

“63”,”776265″,”2″,”Calculating Lift||776265″,”Sorry but I’m not too good at math. Can somebody please give me a simple equation that will allow me to calculate approximate lifting force in kg (what the hell is a newton anyhow ?) at a given area (sq meter) speed (kph) and angle of attack (I want to experiment with variable angles to load or unload a vessel). Now I know that aspect ratio, foil thickness, diehedral etc etc all play a part but I just want approximate values please. “,”2005-02-05″,”Andy”,”nopswd”,” “,”formula@bigpond.net.au”,”0″

“64”,”764798″,”2″,”Re: FOIL SHAPE AND ANGLE||764798″,”It’s achievable. You’ll probably need a foil with a chord of about 750mm. At the speeds you’re talking about, just about any decent airfoil section would work. The incidence of the foil needs to be set with its zero lift lne about 5 – 7 degrees above the trim attitude of the boat. If you build it so you can bend the trailing edge up or down, that will allow you to fine tune the lift.”,”2005-01-15″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”0″

“65”,”759759″,”2″,”Re: Foil Surfing||759759″,”there is no foil surfing allowed anymore.

You must shape your own board out of koa and paddle it – no more tow in’s mish”,”2005-01-05″,”big wave surfer”,”nopswd”,” “,”bigwavesurfer”,”0″

“66”,”756659″,”2″,”Foil shape and size||756659″,”Many thanks for your reply to my request for info on foil design,
being an absolute bunny in this area everything Ican learn is a huge benefit.
Iam hoping to achive a slightly ‘better’shape than a circle cord, I have a copy of the shape of a Speer H005 foil and am aiming at that shape if it will improve lift on the cord.
I note that the C/L increases somewhat at higher angles of attack is there some reason for not using 6,8 or 10 degree angles of attack?
Is there a minimium depth that the foil should be below the surface when travelling at speed, being a catamaran we dont draw much but I can extend the foil down by using longer end plates if required.
Once again many thanks for your time, I’ll keep you posted with the results when they occur.
Regards John”,”2004-12-28″,”JOHN PAYNE”,”nopswd”,” “,”gateopen@xtra.co.nz”,”0″

“67”,”756181″,”2″,”Re: FOIL SHAPE AND ANGLE||756181″,”John,

I see that the table I provided you is unreadable. It may help if you know that the first line and the first column is Angle of attack = -4.00, second column is Coefficient of lift = .0065, third column is Coefficient of drag = .0309, forth column is Coefficient of Moment = -0.1053, and the fifth column is lift over drag ratio = .210. Hopefully, with this you can read the table.

“,”2004-12-27″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,”rvell@san.rr.com”,”0″

“68”,”756177″,”2″,”Re: FOIL SHAPE AND ANGLE||756177″,”Hello, John,

Here is a little cook-book on designing hydrofoil wings. As a welder, you may find the “ogival” AKA
Plano-convex shape easiest to fabricate out of aluminum, steel or stainless steel. The wing is created
by twice cutting a pipe lengthwise to form a vault-shaped piece. On the bottom inside weld a flat plate.
Use a grinder to make your welds fair. Fill in the pits with Bondo. Make everything smooth.
You may choose to round off the leading edge to avoid slicing marine life as you fly by.
The trailing edge should be sharp, but not so sharp as to be hazardous.
You then have a wing, the top of which is a segment of a circle with the underside flat.
For starters, make the thickness to cord ratio 10%.

You need to estimate the area needed, so get out your calculator. The formula is:

S = L / F U^2 Cl

S = Surface area in Square feet
L = Lift (this is the total weight of your boat, crew, etc., in Pounds)
/ = “divided by”
F = Factor to adjust for water density, unit measurements, etc. Use the number F = 2.09
U^2 = Velocity in MPH multipied by itself (squared)
Cl = Coefficient of lift. See the table provided below for Cl. You should cruise at a high L / D or say 2.25degrees.
Take off will be at a higher Cl & lower speed. You must make some assumptions based on experience.

I hope you didn’t sleep through math class.
Contact me if you have problems: rvell@san.rr.com

Ray Vellinga

Water Tunnel Observations on the Flow Past a Plano-Convex Hydrofoil By R B Wade Feb 1964
Caifornia Institute of Technology

Graph the Characteristics of Hydrofoil in Non-cavitationg Flow, Table, Page 51

v = 31.32 ft/sec = 21.35 M/H
Re = 0.75 X 10^6

Angle Coefficient Coefficient Coefficient L / D
of of Lift of Drag of Moment ratio
Attack
Series 1 Series 2 Series 3

-4.00 0.0065 0.0309 -0.1053 0.210
-3.50 0.0487 0.0262 -0.0932 1.859
-3.00 0.0995 0.0223 -0.0782 4.462
-2.75 0.1247 0.0201 -0.0723 6.204
-2.50 0.1481 0.0190 -0.0665 7.795
-2.25 0.1721 0.0178 -0.0564 9.669
-2.00 0.1921 0.0164 -0.0476 11.713
-1.75 0.2140 0.0152 -0.0400 14.079
-1.50 0.2420 0.0149 -0.0375 16.242
-1.25 0.2636 0.0146 -0.0313 18.055
-1.00 0.2778 0.0136 -0.0244 20.426
-0.75 0.3106 0.0137 -0.0192 22.672
-0.50 0.3295 0.0131 -0.0140 25.153
-0.25 0.3583 0.0133 -0.0089 26.940
0.00 0.3714 0.0129 -0.0026 28.791
0.25 0.4023 0.0122 0.0016 32.975
0.50 0.4261 0.0119 0.0089 35.807
0.75 0.4478 0.0126 0.0148 35.540
1.00 0.4539 0.0138 0.0197 32.891
1.25 0.4490 0.0141 0.0245 31.844
1.50 0.4644 0.0152 0.0303 30.553
1.75 0.4781 0.0164 0.0356 29.152
2.00 0.5031 0.0164 0.0408 30.677
2.25 0.5349 0.0167 0.0474 32.030
2.50 0.5443 0.0172 0.0540 31.645
2.75 0.5725 0.0185 0.0593 30.946
3.00 0.5797 0.0184 0.0647 31.505
3.50 0.6360 0.0217 0.0775 29.309
4.00 0.6751 0.0245 0.0896 27.555
5.00 0.7732 0.0338 0.1151 22.876
6.00 0.8352 0.0447 0.1391 18.685
8.00 0.9873 0.0735 0.1858 13.433
10.00 1.0919 0.1182 0.2044 9.238
“,”2004-12-27″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,”rvell@san.rr.com”,”0″

“69”,”754783″,”2″,”Re: Foil Surfing||754783″,”I believe you need to really think about your design expectations. In the application you are considering, manueverablilty and stability are inherently opposite. If the board is stable, such as with surface peircing foils, you won’t have the manueverability of a board such as the ones based on an “Air Chair” or “Sky Ski”. You are going to eventually have to decide where to make the trade-off.”,”2004-12-22″,”Scott Smith”,”nopswd”,” “,”ssmith@veinrxinc.com”,”0″

“70”,”753679″,”2″,”FOIL SHAPE AND ANGLE||753679″,”I HAVE A 10 TON STEEL CATAMARAN HOUSE BOAT WITH 2 X 90 HP OUTBOARDS
THAT SUFFERS FROM A HUGE BOW WAVE COMING OVER THE FORE DECK AT SPEED
MAX SPEED BEING ABOUT 12 KNOTS DUE TO HALF A TON OF WATER ON THE BOW.
I WOULD LIKE TO ADD A FOIL BETWEEN THE HULLS AT THE BOW TO LIFT IT ABOVE THE BOW WAVE SITUATION. CAN YOU SUGGEST A FOIL SHAPE OR SITE THAT A SIMPLE PERSON CAN UNDERSTAND TO FIND A SHAPE WITH CLEAR INSTRUCTIONS AS TO WIDTH AND THICKNESS OF FOILS AND AN ESTIMATED LIFT IN LBS/SQ IN ON THE FOIL. I HAVE A 1200MM GAP BETWEEN THE HULLS AND FIGURE THAT I NEED ABOUT 2-3000 LBS LIFT IS THIS ACHIVEABLE, THE FOIL CAN BE AS LONG AS REQD AS THE BOAT IS 12M LONG.IM VERY HANDY WITH THE MIG WELDER IN THE GARAGE BUT CANNOT TRANSLATE THE INFO ON FOIL DESIGN SITES INTO A SIMPLE WELDABLE SHAPE THAT MAY WORK, ANY HELP WOULD BE APPRECIATED
JOHN”,”2004-12-19″,”JOHN PAYNE”,”nopswd”,” “,”gateopen@xtra.co.nz”,”0″

“71”,”743418″,”2″,”Re: Foil Surfing||743418″,”For your wakeboard, if you want an alternative to the inverted “T” fully submerged hydrofoil designs used on hydrofoil surfboards and sailboards today, you could consider using an arrangement of surface piercing foils… these would be self-stabilizing. Back in 1978, an individual named Michael Shannon of Birmingham MI sent a letter to Dave Keiper, who was offering foils kits for Hobie Cats. He stated that he and his partner James Coulter had successfully adapted parts from Keiper’s foil kit to a windsurfer and planned to make a production run. In connection with this correspondence, Keiper sketched and annotated his own first thoughts on how he would do the design. Unfortunately, Keiper is deceased, and the return address on Shannon’s letter no longer exists, according to the USPS database. So I don’t know if this hydrofoil windsurfer ever went into production or not. Anyway, I put a copy of Keiper’s notes and the Shannon letter up on the web at http://www.exigent.info/DAK-Windsurf.pdf. So take a look. It was common practice for the pioneering hydrofoil designers starting with Alexander Graham Bell to try out their hull/foil prototypes by towing them, so this is similar to a wakeboard being towed by motorboat, only the towed board is the end product rather than an interim test piece. Hopefully this info is of some help. Maybe someone else who checks the IHS BBS will know something of Shannon and Coulter. As to sources of foils and struts, that is another subject, but there are some: mostly in connection with human-powered vehicles, but also a company that makes them for adding to Moth class sailboats.”,”2004-11-24″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,”barney@alum.mit.edu”,”0″

“72”,”742586″,”2″,”Re: Foil Surfing||742586″,”Hi Mitch,

In a first time, I think the better solution is a very simple inverted T foil on the rear (about under the rear foot) and a surface traking “patin” on the front. The rear foil must be about 0.1 square meter area.

For the front “canard” there are several solutions :

The more simple is a planing surface but you can try too somes V surface piercing foils.

Gérard”,”2004-11-23″,”Gérard Delerm”,”nopswd”,” “,”gerard.delerm@free.fr”,”0″

“73”,”742553″,”2″,”Foil Surfing||742553″,”I am interested in alternate designs for foil boarding waves. Currently many surfers are using a foil like the water ski chair type with a stand up board similar to a snow board. It seems to me that there might be a more stable and/or manuverable design like some of the boat foils I have seen. The speeds are 15-30 mph and generally the weight of a surfer(180lbs). Manuverability and stability is a must. Can you make some suggestions as to designers that might help me or direct me as to how to decide on a design and type of foil for surf? “,”2004-11-23″,”Mitch Haynie”,”surfer”,” “,”haynie240@msn.com”,”0″

“74”,”730516″,”2″,”Re: Advanced Educational Pages||730516″,”Hi Barry,

If you try to do any Educational Pages project I can try to translate in French (in IHS there is “International” )
I am not a professional translator but I think I can make good translations if I can have “chat” with the author.

Gerard
“,”2004-10-30″,”Gerard Delerm”,”nopswd”,” “,”gerard.delerm@free.fr”,”0″

“75”,”730318″,”2″,”Re: Advanced Educational Pages||730318″,”An excellent suggestion. The closest the site has come is grouping correspondence by topic in the archives. Main page for accessing the master archives is http://www.foils.org/posted.htm.

There is also the barest start of an FAQ page at http://www.foils.org/faq.htm. However, no significant work was ever done on this.

As it states on the main page, the content of the IHS site reflects the interests of the members and visitors to the site who are willing to provide content. The site is very simple in design, no frames or anything, but rather sprawling. It is quite possible for someone with a particular interest or with a particular project in mind to assume responsibility for a page or pages on the site, whether the page currently exists or not, as an assistant to the webmaster. Revision and creation of pages is fairly simple with any WYSIWYG webpage creation program. File upload is easy with any FTP program such as CuteFTP. So if you were willing to undertake the project you suggest, even if it is over a considerable period of time, that is welcome, I believe, and fairly easily arranged.”,”2004-10-29″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,”barney@alum.mit.edu”,”0″

“76”,”730307″,”2″,”Advanced Educational Pages||730307″,”I found Tom Speer’s discussion on foil stability facinating. I’ve not see this information explained so clearly before. Similarly, I’ve read explanations on calculating foil sizes from Tom and others which made it understandable for someone who hasn’t been in the industry for 30 years. I’ve seen so many of the questions I’ve asked years ago posted again and again.

Is there any way that somehow this explanation might be incorporated in an Advanced Educational page on the site? Perhaps as a continuation of the existing educational pages? I’ve gotten some great explanations from Tom, Mark Daskovsky, William O’Neill and Harry Larson.

I don’t know if you have a hit counter on your basic educational pages, but I know I’ve been there many times and they have been very very valuable. I don’t know how I could help, but I’d be happy to try.

Topics might be:

What shape foils? Typical NACA numbers (other better foils), what they mean and where to find the plots. The choices for submerged vs surface piercing vs strut foils.

How Big? Calculations on lift vs speed… or just a table. Wing loading.

Stability? Tom’s stability discusson, formatted would be great.

Takeoff speed vs flying speed, relationship between these and parameters in determining them.

Estimating power requirements or max speed foilborne…

Add to the glossary words and terms which are used a lot on the discussions: freude numbers, sea states … similar things which took a while to pull together.”,”2004-10-29″,”Barry Steele”,”nopswd”,” “,”barry_steele@yahoo.com”,”0″

“77”,”729123″,”2″,”Re: Foil Spacing||729123″,”Sumi raises an interesting point. PLAINVIEW never lost directional stability. One of the closest we probably came was when one of the main foil incidence angle control systems experienced a structural failure while foilborne. The result was that the foil with the failed system went to full-leading-edge-down. In response to the ship beginning to drop, the control system called for full foil-leading-edge-up. This resulted in one forward foil full leading edge up and the other forward foil full leading edge down while foilborne. The helmsman chopped the throttle immediately. The ship rolled and the hull hit the water at foilborne speed at an angle of 18 degrees. After impacting the water, the ship continued to roll to 32 degrees before coming to a stop. No one was hurt and there was no damage to the ship. We continued back to port hullborne.”,”2004-10-27″,”Phil Yarnall”,”poopdeck”,” “,”YarnallP@nswccd.navy.mil”,”0″

“78”,”729122″,”2″,”Re: Foil Spacing||729122″,”John, By conventional configuration, I refer to the airplane configuration. On PLAINVIEW, we showed the model test results done at the Michigan tank showing the loss of directional control to each of the skippers assigned. One could argue that the carriage helped the ship roll over, but it would still be quite a ride. I know of no instance where we actually encountered this situation since the crew was attuned to the possibilities.”,”2004-10-27″,”S. Arima”,”poopdeck”,” “,”sumi@foils.org”,”0″

“79”,”729121″,”2″,”Re: Foil Spacing||729121″,”Hi Sumi, By “Conventional” configuration, do you mean “airplane” configuration where the aft foil is lightly loaded, as was in the case of Plainview? I understand there was an incident where the stern tried to replace the bow in the foilborne mode, if you know what I mean.
“,”2004-10-27″,”John Meyer”,”poopdeck”,” “,”editor@foils.org”,”0″

“80”,”729120″,”2″,”Re: Foil Spacing||729120″,”I would like to add a word of caution to Tom’s extensive and informative dissertation. The location of the struts on the hull, especially in the conventional configuration, one needs to look at the sea state and hull contact with the sea. In a quartering sea, where the bow of the ship could make contact with the wave could produce side loads that could easily overcome the ability of the aft strut to maintain directional control. Stability needs to be looked at in more than just the foilborne situation.”,”2004-10-27″,”S. Arima”,”poopdeck”,” “,”sumi@foils.org”,”0″

“81”,”729119″,”2″,”Re: Foil Spacing||729119″,”Phil, You may also recall that during detail design and construction of PLAINVIEW, it became apparent that the initial location of one of the diesel generators was too far forward and that the aft foil would have been too lightly loaded and subject to broaching, so the generator was moved aft by at least one frame space.”,”2004-10-27″,”Mark Bebar”,”poopdeck”,” “,”mbebar@csc.com”,”0″

“82”,”729118″,”2″,”Re: Foil Spacing||729118″,”On PLAINVIEW, the concern was not so much the space between the forward and aft foil, but rather the amount of lift capacity in the forward and aft foils. 90% of the lift capacity was in the forward foils and 10% of the lift capacity in the aft foil. Knowing the precise longitudinal center of gravity became a high concern. Ultimately, there was scale at the ramp to the ship. The weight and location of each new piece of equipment and gear was recorded when it came onboard and the LCG calculated. There was volume in the aft portion of the hull which was unusable for payload due to the requirement to maintain 90% of the load on the forward foils.”,”2004-10-27″,”Phil Yarnall”,”poopdeck”,” “,”YarnallP@nswccd.navy.mil”,”0″

“83”,”729117″,”2″,” Stability Has Been Investigated||729117″,” Yes, stability has been extensively investigated. The Hydronautics handbook on IHS’s AMV CD#1 has a whole chapter devoted to trim and a whole chapter devoted to longitudinal stability. You can also find papers on hydrofoil stability on the NACA technical reports server (http://naca.larc.nasa.gov/).

There are also performance aspects to hydrofoil spacing. Constantin Matveev used to have a page on his web site that showed how the rear foil should be located in the rising part of the transverse wave generated by the forward foil. This leads to a foil spacing based on the design Froude number.

With regard to “stability”, the foil spacing is just one of many important factors. I’d say there are really four areas to consider in addition to wave drag, all of which are affected by foil placement and spacing. The first is trim – the ability achieve an equilibrium where all the forces and moments balance (sum up to zero). For best performance, the least drag is obtained by the “airplane” configuration, with a large foil taking nearly all of the weight of the craft and a lightly loaded (quite possibly negatively loaded) stern foil for stability and trim. This means the main foil must be placed in the vicinity of the center of gravity, which for most boats is a little aft of midships. This only leaves half the length for foil spacing. If you look at the Carl hydrofoil, you’ll see that the hull has a slender tail to put the stern foil farther aft while keeping the weight near the main foils.

Then there’s stability itself. Stability has to do with whether the craft returns to a condition of equilibrium after having been disturbed from an initial equilibrium. So stability presupposes trim – it’s meaningless otherwise. Stability is usually further broken down into static stability, which is the instantaneous tendency to return to trim after a disturbance, and dynamic stability which deals with whether or not the motion damps out over time. The pitch damping goes by the square of the distance between the foils and the center of gravity. So there’s a definite connection between stability and foil spacing there. Heave damping is usually quite high by the nature of hydrofoils, so if the pitch heave coupling is stable, the dynamic heave stability will probably be stable.

The static stability in the longitudinal axis depends on how the moments change for a disturbance in pitch angle at constant depth, and how the moments change with depth at a constant pitch attitude. A bow-up change in pitch must generate a bow-down change in the pitching moment. As a practical matter, this requires that the forward foil be more heavily loaded – it must carry more of the boat’s weight per unit area than the aft foil. So as you change the foil spacing and placement relative to the center of gravity, you have to change the area of the foils. An increase in height (decrease in depth) must also generate a bow-down pitching moment to have stable pitch-heave coupling. This is why you see inverted T foils used so extensively for the aft foil and either surface piercing foils or flapped foils forward. Again, the spacing and placement of the foils is very important, taking into account their heave stiffness.

Yaw damping also improves with the square of the distance between the foils and the center of gravity. So there’s another effect of foil spacing. Roll damping goes by the square of the foil span, so it’s not very affected by longitudinal spacing, although it’s heavily influenced by the lateral spacing of the foils.

The next issue to consider is controllability. Control power is needed to achieve the desired trim state. Especially with surface piercing foils, there will be an optimum flying height for best performance, and the pitch attitude must be trimmed so as to achieve it. Control power is needed for stabilization if you are actively augmenting the craft’s stability, as is universally done for fully submerged foil systems. Control is also needed for maneuvering. Finally, control power may be needed for achieving the desired ride quality, as in using direct lift to counter the effects of waves. If you have a system with high static stability, you need to have more control power for trim. If you have a system that is unstable, you need more control power than a neutrally stable craft.

Once again, hydrofoil spacing comes into account because it provides the moment arm for a given change in force at the foil. If you want to generate a direct force at the center of gravity, this will require more or less control from other foils to cancel out the moments if the foil is located away from the center of gravity. If you want to generate a moment but the foil is close to the c.g., it’s like mounting a door knob near the hingeline of a door – pushing or pulling on the knob will not rotate the door. So you have to consider the foil placement with regard to what controls you intend to associate with it.

Finally, there’s the issue of ride quality. In the longitudinal plane, the hydrofoil can either platform the waves, flying at a constant elevation with respect to the earth; or it can contour the waves, flying at a constant distance above the water surface and following the wave shape. If you’re platforming, foil spacing may not be that important. Platforming requires a lot of direct lift control power, though, and the size of the wave you can platform at a given speed may be more limited by the control power than the flying height. But if you’re contouring, then the craft will be maneuvering much more aggressively in pitch, and the foil spacing issues above come into play. No hydrofoil on the ocean does exclusively one or the other. Wave heights greater than the flying height have to be contoured. And the short wavelengths have to be platformed.

In the lateral-directional axes, ride quality may dictate how the vessel rolls into and out of a turn, if it rolls at all. Hydrofoils have their center of mass well above the foils. If they do a skidding turn in a upright attitude, there’s an overturning moment toward the outside of the turn that has to be resisted. If they bank into the turn, then they have to roll first, then yaw as they carve the turn, and finally roll out. The rolling in and out of the turn causes lateral accelerations at the crew station that can be very disconcerting. The craft may actually have to apply direct side force to the foils while rolling so as to put the center of rotation near the center of gravity instead of at the foils. So there has to be a coordinated combination of rolling moment, yawing moment, side force, and lift to obtain acceptable lateral ride quality in maneuvers. Foil spacing would be a part of that equation, along with many other factors.

For example, an aft rudder will tend to produce side force to the outside of the turn, whereas a forward rudder would produce side force to the inside of the turn. It might be necessary to apply opposite forward rudder for a rapid change in aft rudder to generate the necessary side force while rolling, then wash out the forward rudder to allow the turn to develop. Depending on how sophisticated the control system is, the foil spacing may be important to tuning the interrelationship between the various forces and moments.

In most papers on hydrofoil stability, you will find equations that have a number of parameters called stability derivatives. They will describe how each derivative affects the craft’s stability and trim. But what you’ll find very difficult is coming up with good numbers for the stability derivatives to represent a given design. Getting those numbers is why companies spend so much money on testing and engineering analysis.

I hope this has given you the pointer you need. I think the Hydronautics handbook, “Hydrodynamics of Hydrofoil Craft”, is the most comprehensive source on the subject. If you can find them, there are two Hydronautics companion volumes, “The Stability Derivatives of a Hydrofoil Boat, Part I (and Part II)” that deal with estimating the numbers you need to actually calcuate the stability of a given configuration.
“,”2004-10-27″,”Tom Speer”,”poopdeck”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”0″

“84”,”729116″,”2″,”Foil Spacing||729116″,”Does anyone know of anything that has been published on the fore-and-aft spacing between the main foils and the stabilizer as related principally to pitch stability? I have searched the IHS CD-ROMs (lists of titles and abstracts of those that were at all promising), and have looked through my own file of hydrofoil material (mostly of Grumman origin), and have found nothing. Has this ever been investigated? Or has the spacing of the foils which falls out from the proportions of the hull always provided sufficient pitch stability, and the question has never come up? I want only to be pointed in the right direction; not to have any research done.
Is this question worth answering? I don’t know.

“,”2004-10-27″,”Joe Koelbel”,”nopswd”,” “,”JOEKOELBEL@aol.com”,”0″

“85”,”729115″,”2″,”Re: HYDROFOIL PONTOON||729115″,”Hi Ed. This same question has been asked of IHS several times over the years. Correspondence on the subject is archived on the IHS site at www.foils.org/motofoil.htm. I have yet to see a report or photo of a hydrofoil pontoon boat project completed and working. You should review this information. In particular, Charlie Pieroth’s recollection of his work at Dynamic Development, Inc. should be of interest.”,”2004-10-27″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,”barney@alum.mit.edu”,”0″

“86”,”725016″,”2″,”Re: HYDROFOIL PONTOON||725016″,”To review the photos as described above go to http://www.totalrisk.com/diveboat.zip and copy Ed
“,”2004-10-18″,”Ed DeMoss”,”11030h”,” “,”eldemoss@totalrisk.com”,”0″

“87”,”725012″,”2″,”Re: HYDROFOIL PONTOON||725012″,”To review the photos as described above go to http://www.totalrisk.com/diveboat.zip and copy Ed
“,”2004-10-18″,”Ed DeMoss”,”11030h”,” “,”eldemoss@totalrisk.com”,”0″

“88”,”724962″,”2″,”HYDROFOIL PONTOON||724962″,” This is my first attempt to acquire information about putting a hydrofoil system under a pontoon boat. We have a 28 Ft. tritoon pontoon boat that has been built by our volunteer rescue dive group. The photos will best describe what it looks like. It is powered by a new Mercruiser Bravo 5.7 I/O with a ProCharger. It has 400 HP and runs right at 40 mph (via gps). It weights right at 6000 lbs. with dive tanks, equipment, and fuel. Planes very quickly.
There is a hydraulic lift on the front that extends 1 1/2 ft into the water on the front end that will lift well over 1500 lbs. The lift is for raising injured persons out of the water and for divers to get out quickly.
I weld aluminum as a hobby and have built and designed the entire system. We have an idea on how to do it but we need some advice and maybe some calculations. WE cover a very large lake and think this would be faster to respond to a accident. We have cad drawings on what exists.
2 questions am I asking the right group and is their anyone that can help? Thanks Ed DeMoss “,”2004-10-18″,”Ed DeMoss”,”nopswd”,” “,”eldemoss@totalrisk.com”,”0″

“89”,”716776″,”2″,”Power Boat Foil Design||716776″,”I am doing some research and feasibility studies on developing surface piercing hydrofoils for a power boat in the 24-30 foot range. I have read up a little on the Talaria as well as pulled the patent documentation on one of the kits they made for the boats back in the seventies. I have a couple of basic questions for the group here. First, when calculating the lifting force of a surface piercing foil is the lifting force of the foil roughly equal to that of a fully submerged foil of the same width as the part of the foil that is under water? Also what NACA foil profiles do people reccommend? The 16-510 design Tom Lang used? I tried plotting this shape out using one of the foil programs and the foil bottom was concave. Is this right or did I mess something up? Thanks for all the help in advance. I’m sorry if some of this is a little simplistic!”,”2004-09-30″,”Jim Harrington”,”nopswd”,” “,”jharrin1@msn.com”,”0″

“90”,”716553″,”2″,”Hydrofoil kitesurfer||716553″,”Has anyone seen a kitesurfer hydrofoil made of glass/kevlar/carbon fiber instead of the usual and heavy steel?

I am interested in building my own but steel is ruled out due to weight.

Thxs

Rod”,”2004-09-30″,”Rod”,”rodrigo”,” “,”rod.vr@teleline.es”,”0″

“91”,”716442″,”2″,”Re: Looking for Scott Smith||716442″,”Look no farther, you’ve found him again! I can still be reached at ssmith@syntheon.com. Missed you Diane. Sorry Tori and Todd, been under the weather and out of touch for a few months, but I’m coming back around. For any Dynafoil enthusiasts out there, I’m cleaning out the extra projects and thinking about selling a pair of mine (4 is just too many). I’ll post it here when I get my act together again. By the way, if any of you have a Honda PWC and wondered what would happen if you ignored the warning label and engaged the reversing lever while under way, here is the video. It is almost 3 meg, so if IHS decides not to post it, e-mail me and I’ll send it to you.”,”2004-09-30″,”Scott Smith”,”nopswd”,” “,”ssmith@syntheon.com”,”0″

“92”,”715374″,”2″,”Check the Dynafoil area||715374″,”Hi Diane,
Check out the Dynafoil threads that he and I were posting on. Here’s one address that’s listed: ssmith@syntheon.com

I’m not sure if it’s good though, and I had the same fatal crash a few weeks ago and lost his other address too.
Todd”,”2004-09-28″,”Todd Miller”,”nopswd”,” “,”austinado16@cs.com”,”0″

“93”,”714505″,”2″,”Looking for Scott Smith||714505″,”I am looking for Scott Smith from Florida. My computer crashed a few months ago and I lost his e-mail address. “,”2004-09-26″,”Diane Bell”,”nopswd”,” “,”outlawbettybel@hotmail.com”,”0″

“94”,”701771″,”2″,”Re: foilboard design||701771″,”Sam,
The choice of aluminium or carbon fibre on a foam core would be a decision you need to make based on what you are most comfortable working with. Either material should in principle be strong enough for this purpose (provided your carbon skins used over the foam core are thick enough). One of the tricky bits for either construction material would be to work out how you would connect the foil to its support strut. I assume you are working on using an inverted “T” shape foil and strut? If you are able to weld aluminium or can get someone to do that for you after you make the parts, that may prove to give the best connection at the junction of the T. For carbon fibre, making a sufficiently strong junction will take a bit more design and construction effort so that it does not simply fail at that point when you do more harsh manoeuvres with the board. “,”2004-08-30″,”Martin Grimm”,”nopswd”,” “,”seaflite@alphalink.com.au”,”0″

“95”,”697278″,”2″,”Re; foilboard design||697278″,”I suggest you take a look at Rich Miller´s article on hydrofoil sailboards. Go to: http://www.exigent.info/miller.pdf. You can also contact him directly for advice. I do not believe that he monitors this BBS.”,”2004-08-20″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,”bcblack@erols.com”,”0″

“96”,”693486″,”2″,”foilboard design||693486″,”I am a kitesurfer and wakeboarder from England. I amm thinking of making a foil to go on the bottom of a board I have made. It would be for use at speeds of up to 20knts. I weigh about 13st, and my board is about 125cm long. I wouls be very keen to get some advice on foil design and building. Although I had been planning to make the foil from foam and carbon, I know that most production foils are aluminium. Why is this, and which is better to use. I have very little experience of hydrodynamics, but am keenm to learn. Many thanks, S.”,”2004-08-12″,”Sambo”,”nopswd”,” “,”sam.evans@students.pms.ac.uk”,”0″

“97”,”692405″,”2″,”Re; Re; Attitude control system||692405″,”Walt,

1. The text book “Theory of Wing Sections” by I.H Abbott & A.E. von Doenhoff provides geometry definition of various NACA profiles.

2. NACA foil sections are appropriate for underwater use. The main difference between air and water is the density of the fluid, that is easy to account for, see elsewhere on our website for information. Another issue is cavitation. This may not be a problem if your application is for relatively slow towing speeds.

3. The center of lift of foil sections is typically a quarter of the chord chord length aft of the leading edge. It remains at a relatively constant position for small variations in angle of attack.

4. Another package you could consider using is Wing Analysis Plus by Hanley Innovations (http://www.hanleyinnovations.com). This would help with answering many of the above issues.”,”2004-08-10″,”Martin Grimm”,”nopswd”,” “,”seaflite@alphalink.com.au”,”0″

“98”,”688064″,”2″,”Re; Re; Attitude control system||688064″,”Tom, thanks for the link. I’ll take a look.”,”2004-08-01″,”Walt Allensworth”,”nopswd”,” “,”walt@aharinc.com”,”0″

“99”,”687887″,”2″,”Re; Attitude control system||687887″,”http://raphael.mit.edu/xfoil/”,”2004-08-01″,”Tom Speer”,”nopswd”,” “,”me@tspeer.com”,”0″

“100”,”685359″,”2″,”Attitude control system||685359″,”Hi! I’m building an underwater attitude control system that is to keep a towed device nearly horizontal. This system will include two movable underwater foils of modest size and force (under 100lb). The angle of attack of the foils will be controlled by weights. Is there a program I can use to generate [X,Y] pairs of points that describe common hydrofoil cross-sections? Are NACA foil sections appropriate for underwater use? Also… knowing the exact center of lift of the foil section is a critical aspect of the design. Are there programs that identify the center of lift of common foil sections?

Thanks in advance!”,”2004-07-27″,”Walt Allensworth”,”nopswd”,” “,”walt@aharinc.com”,”0″

Re; Re; How foils lift
Terry, I agree completely. I would just like to know what proportion is due to deflection downwards by the underside compared with suction from the upper side, especially at takeoff.

regds, Ian
[Date/Time=05-26-2003 – 11:11 PM] Name:Ian Ward ianward@ozemail.com.au, [Msgid=441938]

Re; Re; Re; How foils lift
Ian. You asked: “I would just like to know what proportion is due to deflection downwards by the underside compared with suction from the upper side, especially at takeoff.”

I guess what I’m saying is that I agree with Martin Grimm when he said (in an earlier reply to your question) that the two surfaces mutually interact in their contribution. Integrating the pressures over each surface of the wing does yield the “suction force” on the upper surface, and the “pressure force” on the lower surface–and the vertical component of the vector sum of the two will yield the lift force on the wing. These pressures/forces are important in structural considerations.

However, I think these numbers can be misleading in describing the aerodynamics/hydrodynamics of the situation. In general, I believe that the pressure force on the bottom side will not be the same as the force on it solely “due to deflection downwards” (of ambient fluid mass).

Here’s my conceptual model of how I think it works (and I’d appreciate hearing about any errors in this model):

A positive (or negative) angle-of-attack to a wing/foil shifts the location of the stagnation point relative to the leading edge of the wing/foil (this is the reason that a symmetrical section can generate lift at a non-zero AOA). The location and magnitude of this high pressure area determines (in part)the upwash over the leading edge of the wing (and the circulation around the section). This upwash (or the circulation), in turn, affects the magnitude of the suction force.

For a symmetrical wing/foil section generating a positive lift force, the stagnation point occurs below the leading edge on the lower face of the wing/foil. Hence the upward deflection (or “negative downward deflection”) by the lower surface of the wing/foil affects the suction force on the upper surface.

An example: Consider a (hypothetical) flat planing hull of infinite aspect ratio traveling across the surface of water. There will be no fluid circulation around the hull. Now consider a wing/foil section (i.e. also infinite aspect ratio) moving through the fluid. If integration of the pressure over the upper and lower surfaces of the wing/foil yields pressure forces in the ratio of ~ 3:1 (as is commonly suggested), then one would expect the wing/foil to have a lift-slope coefficient that is four times that of the planing hull alone.

But measurements show that the ratio is only slightly more than 2:1. That says to me that removal of the barrier to circulation (i.e. the air/water interface) allows the high pressusre area on the underside forward area of the hull to (in part) drive a circulation over the top of the wing/foil (i.e. generating the upwash ahead of the leading edge). This results in a reduction of the speed of the flow past the underside (decreasing both the mass flow/unit time and the downward component of momentum added to that flow–and hence the pressure force resulting from downward deflection of fluid mass) and boosting the flow over the upper side–hence increasing the suction flow. So the lower surface of the wing/foil contributes to the magnitude of the suction force on the upper side of the wing/foil.

[Date/Time=05-27-2003 – 2:02 PM] Name:Terry Hendricks thendricks@pacbell.net, [Msgid=442328]

Re; Re; Re; Re; How foils lift ViewThread
Terry,
I must agree that you have put a very good case for the synergy between increased pressure on the underside interacting to also create increased suction on the upper side, both contributing to the total downwash. So it would appear that the two cannot really be separated.

Hence it would appear to be erroneous to consider that an airfoil works by suction rather than deflection, as without deflection, there would be no suction and vice versa.

I can therefore see how symmetrical foils, barn doors and sails on boats work can all create lift, and why this is proportional to the angle of incidence.

The conclusion I am drawing is that there should therefore be no major benefit in using an asymetric thick airfoil, when compared with a thin curved foil such as a sail, provided the correct angle of attack and camber are maintained appropriately.

Any thoughts on this?

[Date/Time=05-28-2003 – 8:30 AM] Name:Ian Ward ianward@ozemail.com.au, [Msgid=442866]

re;
Ian,

I’m afraid that your question/comment about the relative benefits of a thin, curved foil (given the correct angle of attack and camber) vs an asymetric thick airfoil is entering territory incognita for me (I assume that you’re speaking from the standpoint of aerodynamic benefits–e.g. lift/drag ratio, max lift, etc.–as clearly a thick section has structural benefits). Clearly there have to be some benefits otherwise there wouldn’t be so many airfoil sections that have been developed. As far as whether they are major benefits, I guess that depends on your point of view. If one section has a max lift coefficient 0.1 greater than another, that can certainly be a major benefit if you can safely take off from a field with one, but not the other. Similarily, if the drag coefficient is 5% lower for one than another, that will be a major benefit if one with get you back to land, and the other won’t 🙂

Here’s some differences in properties (all at low Re) that I have seen mentioned 🙂

1. Except at low reynolds numbers (Re < 85,000) the max lift coefficients for asymetric thick sections appear to be significantly higher than for a cambered thin wing, or a flat plate. 2. The drag polars are also different for a cambered thin wing vs an asymetric thick wing. So I would imagine one section might be favored over the other depending on the lift coeffient necessary for the planned optimized configuration. 3. The lift-slope coefficient is significantly greater (at least for Re < 420,000--the highest value in the comparison I saw) for the thin cambered airfoil (followed by a flat plate, and then followed by several thick, asymetric airfoils). I suppose that these differences could be used if one is using mixed airfoil sections for pitch stability. Note: The sections compared were a flat plate, a thin cambered airfoil ("417A"), N60, N60R, 625. Original reference: Schmitz, F.W. Aerodynamics of Model Aircraft Wing Measurements I, R.T.P. Translation No. 2460, Issued by Ministry of Aircraft Production. The data I saw was a summary contained in: B.W. McCormick, Aerodyanmics, Aeronautics, and Flight Mechanics. John Wiley & Sons. NY. 1979. Hope this helps. [Date/Time=05-28-2003 - 12:28 PM] Name:Terry Hendricks thendricks@pacbell.net, [Msgid=443014] re; Ian, While I have been thinking about your questions and comments 'offline', I see that Jim and Terry have provided good feedback. Terry very neatly described in a few words what I was trying to say about downwash. All the same, since I have already done some more number crunching on the relative contribution to lift from the pressure on the bottom and top of a typical foil (for my own benefit too!), here are my additional comments: There has been another posted messages enquiry for which I have now provided data on the pressure distribution around a NACA 0015 section airfoil (or hydrofoil) but that also helps to answer your question. I hope you are able to open the Excel spreadsheet attached to my other reply. The pressure coefficients in that spreadsheet are from a numerical calculation rather than test data so would not be completely accurate. The NACA 0015 hydrofoil is a symmetrical one, that is to say it has no camber and so the top and bottom surfaces are a mirror image. This section is popular for use in constructing ships rudders. The ?15? part of the designation indicates that the thickness to chord ratio is 15%, ie the maximum thickness of the section is 15% of the chord length. The pressure distribution around a foil is often expressed in terms of the pressure coefficient (Cp). This can be thought of as a measure of the relative pressure around the foil. To get the actual surface pressure (P) at any location on the foil, use the following formula: P = Po + 0.5 rho V^2 Cp where: Po = Pressure far upstream away from the foil (Pa). rho = density of the fluid, which is around 1025 kg/m^3 for salt water V = velocity of foil through the fluid (m/s) If you integrate the pressure over the chord of the foil on both the upper and lower surface in the case of the NACA 0015 section, then you can estimate how much the pressure on each surface contributes to the total lift generated by the foil. The spreadsheet includes that calculation, though somewhat approximately. The results are shown in summary below: Key: "AoA" = Angle of Attack of the 2D NACA 0015 profile "Top" = shows the % of the total lift generated by the low pressure distribution on the top surface. "Bottom" = shows the % of the total lift generated by the high pressure distribution on the bottom surface. AoA Top Bottom (deg) (%) (%) 2 146.5 -46.5 4 101.2 -1.2 6 87.4 12.6 8 81.6 18.4 10 78.9 21.1 You can see that at 4 degrees angle of attack or less, the net pressure force on the bottom surface of the foil is still trying to suck it down rather than lift it. For such small angles of attack, the top surface is therefore the only side generating any net lift force. At 10 degrees angle of attack, you can see that the bottom surface is now contributing 21.1% of the total lift, but even at that angle, the pressure distribution on the top surface is still generating 3.7 times as much lift as the pressure on the bottom surface. But of course if you change the shape of either surface of the foil, you will not just influence the pressure distribution on that side, but over the whole foil. In other words, the whole calculation needs to be repeated for the new foil geometry. Many of the descriptions of how an airfoil generates lift that can be found in books are quite misleading as you have noted. There is always the suggestion that a wing needs to have a curved top surface and a flat bottom so that the fluid travelling over the top has further to travel than the fluid over the bottom surface. The reasoning is then the fluid travelling over the top needs to speed up and hence its pressure drops. This is too simplistic as Terry has also observed. As you observe, a flat plate (like the wing of a paper aeroplane) will happily generate lift if it is set at an angle of attack to the flow. This is possible because the sharp trailing edge of such a flat inclined plate forces the aft stagnation point of the fluid to move to the trailing edge in any real viscous fluid. This leads to a circulation of flow around the ?foil? and the strength of that circulation governs the amount of lift that is generated. It is not so easy to explain that in the average book (and I have far from described this properly here). A flat plate foil is however not the best solution if you want to maximise your lift for the minimum amount of drag. This is why cambered foils with streamlined thickness distributions are used on aircraft. Exceptions are aerobatic aircraft such as the Pitts Special which I understand has symmetrical wing profiles since the designer is seeking equal performance with the aircraft flying either upright or inverted! I don't have a good feel for the performance of thin yacht sail type foil sections, but if you consider the developments in hang glider design, the most high performance hang gliders have reverted to 'wings' with separate fabric upper and lower surfaces. These help to shrowd all the support beams and so reduce drag, but that thickness distribution of the foil profile is probably better than a single surface as well. Finally, returning to the discussion about the downwash effect of a wing. Terry has also noted that the amount of downwash is an effect caused by the entire wing and the amount of downwash is directly related to the amount of lift that the wing has generated. It may be worth illustrating what Terry said about Newton's law by using an analogy with water flowing around a corner in a pipe: Lets take a pipe with a one square metre cross section and assume the flow velocity of water in the pipe is a constant 5 metres per second. The volumetric flow rate of the water is therefore 1 x 5 = 5 cubic metres per second. For ease of analysis lets assume we have fresh water with a density of 1000 kg/m^3 (or one tonne per cubic metre) in the pipe. The mass flow rate of the water is therefore 5 x 1000 = 5000 kg/s (or 5 tonnes per second). Now, if the pipe has a bend so that it changes direction by only 5 degrees (similar to a typical downwash angle of fluid around wing), the fluid is now being redirected in that new direction of the pipe at a rate of 5 tonnes per second. Two of Newton?s laws have words to the effect that: 1. A moving mass will keep moving in the same direction and at the same speed unless it is acted upon by a force. The rate of change of momentum is equal to the force that is applied (F = M.a). 2. Every action must have an equal and opposite reaction. In this case, for the water to have changed direction, the pipe must have applied a force to it. In turn the water has applied an equal and opposite force back on the pipe. The constant force that must be applied to the water is equal to the change of momentum of the water and for pipe bends with a small angular change this is given approximately by: F = M?.V.sin(theta) where: M? = mass flow rate of the water (kg/s) V = water velocity (m/s) theta = the angle by which the pipe changes direction. So the force exerted on the pipe by the water is: F = 5000 . 5 . sin(5 deg) F = 2179 N (or 0.22 tonnes) Looking at this another way, if a hydrofoil travelling through water at 5 m/s was assumed to influence an area of one square metre of the water around it causing that water to have an average 5 degrees downwash far downstream of the foil, then the lift that the hydrofoil would have generated is likewise 0.22 tonnes. If the downwash angle was now increases to 10 degrees, the lift force doubles to 0.44 tonnes and so on. Hope that has helped and not made things more complicated!! [Date/Time=05-28-2003 - 12:29 PM] Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=443016] Thin sails vs Airfoils Hello Terry, Thanks for your response. I will check out the detailed info you have guided me to. I am a little surpised that it does not seem clear, even to relative experts as yourself, as to which foil types are likely to give the best performance. I guess that this science is not as cut and dried as I thought it would be. In particular, it would appear to me that a thin cambered section such as a sail should give the best lift/drag, but only at the correct angle of attack and appropriate windspeed. What seems to be unique about a sail is that both camber and angle of attack can be maintained at close to optimum by using a flexible mast and manually altering the rig controls, unlike for aircraft, hang gliders and hydrofoils. This does not seem to be well recognised and is probably why solid foils have rarely shown any significant advantage over conventional sails. Thicker foil sections appear to come into their own, because they offer a good compromise of properties over a wide range of angle of attack and speed, for a fixed section shape which cannot be readily adjusted. This is exactly what is needed for fixed wing aircraft because the angle of attack is usually high at take off and reduces as the speed picks up. Also, the required camber reduces as the speed picks up to reduce drag. [Date/Time=06-03-2003 - 9:21 AM] Name:Ian Ward ianward@ozemail.com.au, [Msgid=446269] Counter intuitive! ViewThread Hello Martin, Many thanks for your detailed information. I am still trying to digest the implications. I find it counter intuitive that there is a negative lift contribution from the underside of a symmetrical wing or foil at angle of attack below about 5 degrees, and that it remains so much less than the positive lift generated by the negative pressure on the upper surface at higher angles of attack. Will need to work through this, but I guess there is a natural tendency for the underside to displace fluid over the top, rather than being compressed and forced down. [Date/Time=06-03-2003 - 9:40 AM] Name:Ian Ward ianward@ozemail.com.au, [Msgid=446282] Variable geometry foils ViewThread I've seen many people ask about using various aircraft techniques to improve some aspect of a hydrofoil design. Somebody even went as far as to ask if a rotating foil design similar to a gyroplane might be made to work, although I can't imagine gaining anything from that exercise. One problem that seems to come up a lot is the need for high lift at takeoff, and reduced drag at cruising speed. This is made more critical for limited power applications like human powered craft. A common solution is an extra foil that retracts at speed. I wonder if variable geometry might be an answer. Two common aircraft applications are the 'swing wing' like the f-14 Tomcat, and the 'scissor wing', usually an elliptical wing that rotates as a whole on a pivot point above the center of the fuselage. Would producing a variable geometry 'swing wing' help to reduce drag at higher speeds and give better low speed lift? Or am I barking up the wrong tree? I've never heard of a hydrofoil design using this feature. [Date/Time=06-05-2003 - 4:35 PM] Name:Scott Smith ssmith@syntheon.com, [Msgid=447702] Paddlewheel Hydrofoil ViewThread My question is the subject line, i.e. : Has there ever been a paddle wheel hydrofoil? Is there a picture of such a craft? [Date/Time=06-08-2003 - 4:37 AM] Name:Mark Lape mlape@attbi.com, [Msgid=448885] Paddlewheel Hydrofoil Hi Mark, if you are talking foils applied to a Mississippi River Boat type of paddle wheel boat, I have not seen one. There is some interesting correspondence and photos about a "hydrocopter" with "autorotating foils" on our page at: http://www.foils.org/yourown.htm (see photos below). Maybe you could describe in more detail what you are thinking of, also whether you are talking about a motor-powered or human-powered craft? [Date/Time=06-08-2003 - 4:44 AM] Name:Barney C. Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=448886] Lift coeffs for surface-piercing vee foils ViewThread Can anyone provide me with values of lift coefficients for surface-piercing Vee hydrofoils of the type Gordon Baker used so successfully for his motorboats? He used the NACA 16-510 foil section, about 40 deg dihedral, and the lower corners of his foils had circular-arc curvature. Such lift values, with, of course, the associated values of aspect ratio and angle of attack, would be very much appreciated. [Date/Time=06-09-2003 - 10:16 AM] Name:Eugene Clement Eclement5@aol.com, [Msgid=449347] Foil-Borne Draught ViewThread I have a 14' fibreglass planing hull that I am considering adapting for use with a hydrofoil. The distance between the bottom of the keel and the horizontal centreline of the propellor is about 8". Is this enough draught to enable a hydrofoil to operate effectively? My boat has a 50 hp outboard on it and the speedo goes right up to 60 mph (52.6 knots). I know that a well-designed foil will increase fuel economy at high speeds. Will using a foil also result in greater acceleration and/or higher top speed? [Date/Time=06-10-2003 - 4:08 PM] Name:Mike K. ame2000@lycos.com, [Msgid=450211] Foil benefits ViewThread The good news is you do have enough water above the prop for foils, assuming mostly smooth water. Using foils will increase you fuel economy. The bad news is they may not increase your performance for this boat. Subcavitating foils are fairly simple to make, I can send you plans. But they are limited in speed. If your boat already does 60mph as indicated, you are already at about the highest speed you can expect to go on subcavitating foils. Adding them would help your fuel economy, but might slow your takoff a tad. Supercavitating foils might help you go faster, but there is less info available on them. You will be lucky to be able to make supercavitating foils that work for that boat. Had your boat had less power, say 25hp, then you would see real benefits in speed and economy. As it is, it won't gain you much to add foils, but will cause you trouble in shallow water, docking, etc. [Date/Time=06-11-2003 - 6:37 AM] Name:Scott Smith ssmith@syntheon.com, [Msgid=450522] Lift Coefficients for Surface Piercing foils ViewThread Hello Eugene, There are many effects that should be taken into account in calculating the lift (and drag) of surface piercing hydrofoils. These include for example lift loss of foils operating near or cutting through the water surface. I would recommend Chapter 3 of the book "High Speed Small Craft" by Peter Du Cane (1974 edition) as an ideal reference to use to prepare an estimate of the lift generated by a particular foil arrangement. In that chapter Michael Eames specifically considers surface piercing V foil arrangements. The various equations are too involved to repeat here but could be incorporated in a spreadsheet calculation or similar. The alternative is to back the overall lift coefficients out of the particulars of a known hydrofoil. What you need to determine is the speed, submerged planform area (at that speed) and weight of the boat. I have tabulated that for a few surface piercing hydrofoils of the Supramar type and the typical CL values for the overall craft are in the order of 0.26 to 0.43. I don't know the details of the foil profiles in those cases however. Regards, Martin Grimm [Date/Time=06-11-2003 - 12:03 PM] Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=450715] Paddle Wheel Hydrofoil Hi Mark, Now I just wonder whether the idea you are thinking about is the same as one I have had for many years but have not pursured sufficiently to apply on a full scale application? I coined the term "Rotorfoil" to describe the concept I had in mind and later stumbled across the article that described the very similar "Hydrocopter" concept that Barney has already pointed out to you. I am keen to hear more from you too... [Date/Time=06-11-2003 - 12:15 PM] Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=450724] Good News Really ViewThread Thanks for the reply, Scott. I plan to run mostly on lakes, and the engine is not working as of yet, so I haven't actually tested the boat as fit out. I got it for free. Sounds like I can get nearly the same big-engine performance with a much smaller engine and a foil. If I bought a new 25 hp engine, would it be worthwhile to get one with a longer vertical power shaft, so as to increase the distance between the hull and the foils? [Date/Time=06-11-2003 - 6:58 PM] Name:Mike K. ame2000@lycos.com, [Msgid=451045] performance I don't know if I would go so far as to say you'll get the "same performance as the big engine", that's really comparing apples and oranges. Your performance with a 25HP engine and foils will certainly be better that a 25hp and no foils, but different from the 50hp. With the 25 and foils you will get good top end, excellent fuel economy, and a cushioned ride. But you have to get it all working together. With the 50hp you will have more pulling power, docking will be easier, and take-off will be faster, it just depends on what you want. Anyway, yes you can put a long shaft on the boat to get more lift. I put a 15HP extra long shaft on my 14' aluminum boat for a hydrofoil experiment. Even with no foils it doesn't hamper performance enought to notice. But you may need to add some strategic sheet metal deflectors to keep the extra shaft length from entraining water up the tower and into your boat. Not a problem when foilborne. Trailering and shallow water operation can be a pain if the engine is really low, like in my case. Transom plates don't allow but a few inches of lift. In short, adding a longshaft won't affect you much, and will help with the foils, adding an extra long shaft will require some compromises. I found the easiest and cheapest way around the extra-longshaft problems was just to use a trolling motor for docking and shallow water. BTW, if you can afford it, I love my 4-stroke, and it runs forever on a tank of gas 🙂 Yes, if you are intent on getting this flying, a long shaft outboard will work really well, but if you never finish the project, it may hamper the resale value of the boat, being smaller hp and a longshaft. [Date/Time=06-12-2003 - 8:13 AM] Name:Scott Smith ssmith@syntheon.com, [Msgid=451290] New Info on Hydrofoil Sailboard Design Rich Miller has just published a photo-illustrated technical paper on his hydrofoil sail board. It is accessible from a link on the IHS webpage devoted to this subject: http://www.foils.org/miller.htm [Date/Time=06-15-2003 - 6:30 AM] Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=452967] Hydrofoil Surfboard Details Wanted ViewThread Can you steer me to a web site that shows a hydrofoil surfboard in detail? I want to know how this system works. [Date/Time=06-24-2003 - 9:11 PM] Name:Merv Rice MervLaura61585@aol.com, [Msgid=459271] Re; Hydrofoil Surfboard Details Wanted I don't have any design details unfortunately, though these surfboards appear from a distance to have something in common with the Air Chair and other hydrofoil waterskis. Laird Hamilton is the pioneer in this. He has a video out on DVD, and supposedly the bonus materials on the DVD have information about the hydrofoil surfboard. See our page at http://www.foils.org/popvideo.htm. I have not seen the video, so I don't know if the hydrofoil info is a little or a lot. We have some archived correspondence on this subject on our page at http://www.foils.org/sailbord.htm. [Date/Time=06-24-2003 - 9:24 PM] Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=459280] Hydrofoils ? Available I've been looking for alternative sources of foils for a small (28') powered boat. I've been looking for used Robinson R-22 helicopter blades and found these larger R-44 blades available. Larger than what I need, I thought I'd pass along the info. If interested, email me and I'll give you the seller's contact info. Put Hydrofoil in the subject line. Chord 10 " Thickness 1.5" They are not tapered, length aprox 15 ' each, I have 2. Leading edge is stainless steel D shape extrusion with aluminum skins bonded aft of that with a aluminum honeycomb core. Very strong and smooth, removed from a 1995 robinson R-44 4 passenger helicopter with 165 hrs since new due to factory recall. I was planningto use on an expermintal copter. Would sell pair for $500 plus shipping. They are located at Napoleon OH [Date/Time=07-14-2003 - 8:06 AM] Name:Barry Steele bsteele971@hotmail.com, [Msgid=462263] Re; Variable geometry foils ViewThread Scott I have been wondering the same thing. Is the fact that there are no 'swing wing' hydrofoils due to the operating speed of current hydrofoils not being high enough for it to be of any benifit? Aircraft speeds in the range from mach 0.5 to mach 1.0 (approx 300 to 600 knots) apparently benifit from increasing wing sweep angles. Is there a good corelation between aerodynamics and hydrodynamics? Could the above speed range be converted to the equivelent for a hydrofoil wing? One assumes the speed would be much slower given waters much higher density. How is caviation affected by a swept wing? It would also be of benifit for coming alongside as the wings could be over swept (as per the F-14) so the are in side the hull line. [Date/Time=07-11-2003 - 5:56 AM] Name:Graeme Paulin paulin@paradise.net.nz, [Msgid=468029] Re; Re; Variable geometry foils Hydrofoils wings have to be very much thinner than aeroplane wings to support the same weight, so they have to be proportionally stronger. It is therefore difficult to build in the sort of features that let aeroplane wings change shape, like extending flaps and droops, as they would weaken the wing too much. That is one reason why hydrofoils have a relatively small speed range (about 2:1 full speed to take off) compared to aeroplanes (often 4:1 full speed to take off). As for swing wings, they are fitted to supersonic aeroplanes to reduce drag and leading edge heating at supersonic speeds. Hydrofoils get nowhere near supersonic speeds, especially as the speed of sound in water is about 3000 mph. Hydrofoil top speed can be limited by cavitation, and swinging a wing would do very little to reduce that. Cavitation can only be reduced by making the foils even thinner, or, of course, slowing down. Many submerged foil hudrofoils have foils that can be swung up out of the way to reduce draft and sometimes beam for docking, but these usually swing the whole strut and wing assembly. Even small irregularities in a wing would cause cavitation which would damage the wing, so the designers have felt that it it best to keep the mechanisms at the top of the strut and out of the water. [Date/Time=07-12-2003 - 3:38 AM] Name:Malin Dixon gallery@foils.org, [Msgid=468623] foiling vs planing ViewThread A previous post provided a link to a gentleman that buids foiling sailboards ( I have since misplaced the link) In his design the forward foil is a supercavitating section that essentially planes on the surface to control the angle of attack on the main lifting foil. My question is: in terms of drag (ignoring waves and smmothness of ride) which is more efficient, a planing surface or a submerged lifting one? what order of magnitude? Steve Rhodes [Date/Time=07-28-2003 - 2:10 PM] Name:Steve Rhodes srhodes@domus-usa.com, [Msgid=477506] Re; foiling vs planing You are probably thinking of Rich Miller. He has recently published a nice guide to his hydrofoil windsurfer design. That document will be on IHS's Advanced Marine Vehicle CD-ROM #2 when it is released in the near future. In the meantime the document is posted on the web at http://www.exigent.info. There is an email link and a phone number in the document, so you could pose your question to Rich directly. Another person with an active interest in this subject is GœGard Delerm. See his website at http://gerard.delerm.free.fr/clair/b_page2a.htm [Date/Time=07-31-2003 - 6:56 PM] Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=479692] Force Calculation ViewThread Hey everyone, Could anyone point me in the right direction here? Im looking to calculate the optimal surface area dimensions and pitch of a triangular hydrofoil that would generate 550 - 650 pounds of downforce at around 22-24 miles per hour? And then, how would a minor (1-2 degree) increase in pitch affect the downforce? Any help or hints here would be greatly appreciated. Cheers folks. [Date/Time=08-01-2003 - 2:08 AM] Name:Dan daniel@cmmaustralia.com, [Msgid=479875] Re; Force Calculation Try out Xfoil. Cheers Mk markhh@fencepost.com [Date/Time=08-03-2003 - 6:19 PM] Name:Mark Hursthouse markhh@fencepost.com, [Msgid=481140] Re; foiling vs planing Hi Steve, You can read and compare the two NACA reports : http://naca.larc.nasa.gov/reports/1955/naca-report-1232/ and http://naca.larc.nasa.gov/reports/1958/naca-report-1355/ GœGard [Date/Time=08-04-2003 - 6:39 AM] Name:GœGard Delerm gerard.delerm@free.fr, [Msgid=481324] Re; Force Calculation Do you have the AMV CD #1? Chapter 2 of "Hydrodynamics of Hydrofoil Craft Subcavitating Hydrofoil Systems" is devoted to this subject. [Date/Time=09-01-2003 - 5:03 PM] Name:Tom Speer m3@tspeer.com, [Msgid=498264] Re; foiling vs planing As usual, the answer is, "It depends." The drag of a planing surface comes mainly from three sources: the skin friction on the wetted surface, the induced drag of the dynamic lift, and the wave drag. Hydrofoils also suffer from the same three. So for a hydrofoil to be a net benefit, you have to look at how it affects each of these drag contributions. A hydrofoil is wetted on both surfaces and the wetted area of the strut(s) has to be counted, too, so depending on the configuration, the hydrofoil may or may not reduce the wetted area below that which is immersed by the hull. Typically the area will be less unless you're trying to fly at low speed. Drag due to lift depends on the square of the span of the lifting surface. It's fairly easy to build a hydrofoil with an immersed span greater than the wetted width of a V-shaped planing hull. In addition, the drag due to lift at the surface is twice that of a very deeply submerged hydrofoil, so there's a gain in just getting away from the surface. This is possibly the hydrofoil's biggest advantage. Then there's the wave drag. Deciding just what is wave drag and what is induced drag depends a bit on how you set up your drag accounting bookkeeping, but hydrofoils generally produce lower waves and have a vastly smaller waterplane area, so the hydrofoil undoubtedly has less wave drag, too. To really answer the question, you'd need to estimate the drag of the planing boat's configuration using something like the Savitsky method, and then estimate the drag of the particular hydrofoil configuration. There's lots of information on this on the AMV CD's. [Date/Time=09-01-2003 - 5:17 PM] Name:Tom Speer m3@tspeer.com, [Msgid=498274] Re; Re; Variable geometry foils Simple sweep theory says that you can neglect the spanwise component of the velocity for the purpose of calculating the pressure distribution across the chord. So sweeping a subcavitating foil would offer some relief from cavitation, much like making the foil thinner would do. Wings are swept to reduce the local Mach number and ensure that the pressure disturbance from the wing's shape can propagate upstream and avoid forming a shock wave. I don't see this having a close analog with regard to hydrofoils. There may be some reduction in transverse wave drag from sweep, because the sweep would smooth out the cross sectional area distribution of the foils, like area ruling of a transonic airplane design. Spanwise flow may also help inhibit ventilation, especially for surface piercing foils that are swept forward, putting the foil station at the surface aft of the submerged stations. I've not seen much information on just how effective a given degree of sweep is in this regard, though. [Date/Time=09-01-2003 - 5:30 PM] Name:Tom Speer m3@tspeer.com, [Msgid=498276] Re; Thin sails vs Airfoils ViewThread You're right about an aircraft needing to operate over a wide range of lift coefficients, mainly because it can't change its wing area. So if the cruise speed is, say, more than 3 times that of the landing speed, the lift coefficient will vary over an order of magnitude. It's critical that the wing produce low drag at high speed. Drag at high lift on landing approach is actually beneficial because it steepens the approach path. A sail, on the other hand, needs to operate in a much narrower range of (high) lift coefficients, and produce low drag at high lift. It cannot operate at low lift coefficients at all because it will luff. This accounts for the use of solid wings and wingmast rigs on high-speed sailing craft that do operate at lower lift coefficients (ie, landyachts, C-class catamarans, ice boats). Sail area is reduced (by reefing and sail changes) to match the lift to the available righting moment at high apparent wind speeds. At any given deisgn point, a thin section will outperform a thick one from a purely aerodynamic perspective. Thickness in a sail is only desireable from the standpoint of providing the necessary structural support (mast) and for widening the operating range of angles of attack (wider "groove"). But it's not necessary or desireable to carry the thickness across the whole chord. For example, here's an XFOIL prediction of the flow around a tear-drop shaped wingmast and sail combination: http://www.tspeer.com/temp/wm10m35r10a08.JPG. The lee side contour is identical to that of the Clark-Y airfoil. Angle of attack is 8 degrees, the chord Reynolds number is 1.0e6, and natural transition is assumed. Lift coefficient is 1.8 - high but below stall. The white lines show the section contour and inviscid pressure distribution (no boundary layer effects), the yellow line the lee side viscous pressure distribution (with boundary layer effects) and boundary layer displacement thickness, and the blue line the windward side pressures and boundary layer thickness. At this angle of attack the lee side is fully attached, and stall will begin at the trailing edge at higher angles of attack. On the windward side, the shape is effectively distorted by the presence of a separation bubble behind the mast. The separated flow acts like a wedge, creating an adverse pressure gradient on the mast earlier than the inviscid prediction. This causes laminar separation, as seen by the short horizontal segment in the pressure distribution, followed by transition to turbulent flow indicated by the resumption of the increase in pressure coefficient. The viscous and inviscid pressure distributions come together again near where the flow reattaches to the windward surface of the sail. It's clear that the sail would benefit from a windward surface that would roughly correspond to the boundary of the separation bubble. This would have little effect on the pressure distribution about the sail but would eliminate the drag of the separation bubble. With regard to hydrofoils, a hydrofoil that operated most of the time at high lift coefficients could benefit from using a thin section. This might be a surface-piercing foil designed to lift the boat at low speeds. However, operating at high lift coefficients also means low pressures on the foil, and cavitation at low speed. Plus, narrow displacement hulls are far more efficient than hydrofoils in this speed range so there's no point to using hydrofoils. Hydrofoils are typically operated at high speed, and are necessarily limited by cavitation to low lift coefficients. Their thickness is dictated by the need for structural strength and stiffness, but the thickness ratio must be kept low, again to avoid cavitation. This leads to sections with roof-top pressure distributions, like the NACA 1- and 6-series sections, and small amounts of camber. Fully submerged foils have to operate over a range of lift coefficients, just like airplane wings. Surface piercing foils can operate over a narrower range of lift coefficients, and therefore might benefit from slightly more camber and less thickness. [Date/Time=09-01-2003 - 6:14 PM] Name:Tom Speer m3@tspeer.com, [Msgid=498303] Re; Counter intuitive! There are lots of ways to get at this. One way is to consider the superposition of velocities from a thick symmetrical section and a thin cambered section. This is what the NACA did in coming up with their families of airfoil sections. But a more physically grounded approach would be to consider the laws of conservation of mass and conservation of momentum. The law of conservation of momentum says that the net force exerted on a body is equal and opposite to the net change in momentum of the fluid. A hydrofoil creates lift by bending the flow, and this bend is a change in momentum. Just like driving a car around a bend is a change in the car's momentum and requires a side force on the wheels to make it happen. Where the flow is bent, there must be a radial change in the pressure, so that each blob of fluid has more force pushing in on it from the outside of the turn than from the inside of the turn. So the pressure on the inside turn must be less than the pressure on the outside of the turn. If you start far away from a deeply submerged hydrofoil, the influence of the hydrofoil has died away and pressure is everywhere the same. At the trailing edge of the hydrofoil, the flow comes off in the same direction as the trailing edge (assuming the hydrofoil is not stalled). So the direction the trailing edge is pointed largely determines how much the flow is bent by the hydrofoil. You can see that angle of attack and camber are essentially the same in this regard - both alter the orientation of the trailing edge. As you approach the hydrofoil from above, you are approaching it from the outside of the turn induced by the hydrofoil. So the pressure must be progressively decreasing. If you started from far beneath the hydrofoil, you would be moving from the inside to the outside of the turn, so the pressure is increasing. In both cases, the pressure where you started - far away from the hydrofoil - is the same; the pressure was being subtracted from the freestream as you approached the upper surface and added to the freestream as you approached the bottom surface. Thus, there is high pressure on the bottom and low pressure on the top, and a difference in pressure between the two sides of the hydrofoil. The amount of the pressure difference, averaged over the top and bottom surfaces, is the lift. And the lift is the same as the net change in the fluid's momentum due to the bending of its direction as it passed the hydrofoil. That's conservation of momentum. Now consider the effect of thickness. If you keep the upper side contour the same, the flow has to bend the same in order to follow it. But the flow on the bottom side does not have to bend as much, or locally is even bent the other way. So this reduces the pressure on the bottom side. If you kept the top contour fixed and filled in the bottom contour until it was the mirror image of the top, you'd have a symmetrical section and no lift at all at zero angle of attack. Both sides of the section would be toward the inside of the curve as the flow bent around the thickness of the foil. So if you are aiming for high lift, thickness is detrimental. However, high lift is rarely the objective in hydrofoil design. It's generally far preferable to add area to get the required lift than it is to go to high lift coefficients. Or better yet, to increase the speed without increasing the area. [Date/Time=09-01-2003 - 6:56 PM] Name:Tom Speer me@tspeer.com, [Msgid=498328] re; From a design perspective, I think you work the problem the other way. The designer chooses the lift coefficient, according to the dictates of the section, and sizes the foil area accordingly. The operator, on the other hand, doesn't have control of the foil area, and thus has to alter the lift coefficient to fit the conditions. So I think I can hazard a reasonable guess as to the lift coefficient: 0.3 (+- 0.1). [Date/Time=09-01-2003 - 7:05 PM] Name:Tom Speer me@tspeer.com, [Msgid=498332] Re; Foil-Borne Draught No way, dude. Do the math. You want to fly the boat completely out of the water, right? Say with the keel just 2" above the water. Prop diameter is, I'm guessing, 6" - 8". So even with absolutely flat water, the top of the prop is 2" - 3" below the surface. Don't you think it would ventilate like crazy that close to the surface? Remember, there's no boat in front of it to prevent air from being sucked down in front of the prop when you're flying. Now consider the effect of waves. Especially without the effect of the hull smoothing things out. Even with no wind and nobody else on the water, a couple of passes by your own boat will ruffle things up so there are waves more than 3" high. Your prop will be coming completely out of the water. Getting the power to a prop low enough to work while flying is one of the toughest problems in hydrofoil design. A normal short-shaft outboard isn't going to do it. [Date/Time=09-01-2003 - 7:20 PM] Name:Tom Speer me@tspeer.com, [Msgid=498339] Re; Re; Foil-Borne Draught ViewThread Tom, You have a series of interesting posts, but I can't find what you're responding to. Almost all speedboat props are intentionally ventilated above 50mph or so. I'm working on such a 'lowrider'. [Date/Time=09-02-2003 - 10:19 AM] Name:jim hynes jhynes@socal.rr.com, [Msgid=498668] Re; Re; Re; Foil-Borne Draught Jim, To see the messages that Tom was responding to, you should be able to click on the title of the earlier or original message that appears at the top of the screen where you are reading Tom's reply. That should automatically open the earlier message for you. Propeller ventilation may be intentional at higher speeds on some boats (to avoid cavitation damage to the blades), or in fact the propellers may be designed to operate supercavitating (water changing state to vapour - ie steam) so that the cavitation bubble forms right at the blade leading edge and collapses well downstream of the propeller and so does not erode the blade surface. But if you can make a propeller operate free of ventilation or cavitation at the intended speed of the boat, that is still likely to give a solution that requires less horsepower. In this case Tom describes, sucking in air will simply make the engine race at high revs and low torque while the propeller produces little thrust but lots of air bubbles! [Date/Time=09-03-2003 - 11:43 AM] Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=499571] Re; Re; Thin sails vs Airfoils Hello Tom, Thank you for your excellent contribution to this discussion and to my ever increasing understanding. You have now prompted me to raise a long standing observation to which I suspect you may have an answer. I am intrigued that texts on sailing boat aerodynamics extoll the virtues of using full wing masts, compared with normal thin foil sails. The impression given is that wings are always easily superior to conventional sails and more recently Dynawing have promoted asymetrical wings in a similar way. From what I can glean, most of these texts do in fact agree that thin foil "normal" sails are actually superior to symmetrical wings in light wings (low Reynolds numbers). They then go on to compare lift/drag characteristics of both symmetric and asymmetric aerofoils at varying angles of attack and camber to those of thin foils, and conclude that aerofoils have higher lift/drag ratios and are therefore significantly superior in moderate to strong winds to standard sails. What intrigues me is that in practice, the differences between thin sails and aerofoils do not seem that great, and in fact there are no thick full wing aerofoils being used on any racing classes, perhaps with the exception of C-class cats. Some of this is to do with existing rules, costs etc, but even in development classes and sailboards, which have no real limitations, full wing sections are not used today....why? Is this perhaps because the benefits are not really there? I would like to present a perspective, which does not seem to be addressed in the texts and seek your opinion..... My comments are based on the following observations & assumptions. 1) When I talk of "normal" sails, these days all performance dinghies, catamarans and sailboards use fully battened, stiff smooth sail cloth, relatively high aspect sails and mostly use over rotating small wing masts or pocket luff sails to fair the leading edge. They do not luff easily and should not be considered as "soft" sails as on Lasers etc. They are however, all thin foils. 2) When sailed properly, all "normal" sails are trimmed to optimise the angle of attack to roughly match the entry angle of the wind to the surface of the sail. ie: we use telltales and feel to trim the sail so that there is no stall either to windward or leeward at the sail luff. This means that the "optimum" angle of attack is effectively always maintained constant, but it is dependent on the sail camber. 3) As the wind increases, we maintain maximum power until this matches the maximum righting moment available. Thereafter, the mast is tuned to bend so that the top of the sail progressively flattens and twists as the wind strength increases. This maintains constant heeling force, while maximising forward thrust and means that at higher wind speeds, the camber of the sail automatically reduces. 4) Camber in thin sails typically ranges from 15% to 5% and is automatically controlled at the optimum value for the given wind strength. I would like to make the following comments: a) The comparisons in the texts I have reviewed present a lot of data at angles of attack varying from 0-40 degrees, much of which does not seem relevant to the situation I have described. b) Lift values for thin foils actually seem very high, almost twice that of symmetric foils of similar camber, but this fact seems to be neglected in ensuing discussions in the texts. c) Drag values for thin foils are generally higher than for symmetrical foils of the same camber, but are at a minimum near the "optimum" angle of attack. d) What seems to be missing in the comparisons I have seen, is that as wind strength increases, the camber of a thin sail is automatically reduced, which also significantly reduces the drag. This is not necessarily the case for aerofoil sections which are generally, for practical reasons unable to alter thickness with wind strength, hence their camber is not optimised and as a result their drag can in fact be higher than the much flatter thin sails as the wind strength increases. None of these effects seem to be addressed in the discussions and conclusions presented.....or am I missing something? e) I believe, that comparisons should therefore be made at different wind strengths between the lift /drag ratio of say a 15% camber assymetric foil and a thin foil with the lift of a 15% camber section at low speeds and 5% camber at high speeds. f) The net effect is that thin foil "normal" sails actually perform better than aerofoils in light airs and are exceedingly effective at reducing drag at high speeds by automatic camber reduction, which makes them very competitive with thick aerofoils. This may give a more realistic picture and perhaps explain why we do not see big benefits in using wing sails. I have tried to analyse data in the texts with this in mind, but always find the data lacking enough detail to make a proper comparison. Perhaps you have better data available and can make a good comparison. Looking forward to your valued comments, Ian Ward [Date/Time=09-05-2003 - 1:23 AM] Name:Ian Ward ianward@ozemail.com.au, [Msgid=501163] Re; Re; Re; Foil-Borne Draught "Almost all speedboat props are intentionally ventilated above 50mph or so. I'm working on such a 'lowrider'." -- jhynes@socal.rr.com Jim, would you mind pointing me to any design data on supercavitating/ventilating hydrofoils that's handy? [Date/Time=09-06-2003 - 2:35 AM] Name:Mac Stevens stevensm@earthlink.net, [Msgid=501924] re; Thin Sails vs Airfoils ...even in development classes and sailboards, which have no real limitations, full wing sections are not used today....why? Is this perhaps because the benefits are not really there? There are tremendous practical advantages to conventional sail rigs, for one thing. A rigid wing has to be "flown" 100% of the time. It can't be allowed to just sit there and it's a major production to raise and lower it. For example, when you park a rigid-winged landyacht, dollies are put under the rear wheels that have their axles pointed at the front wheel. This lets the yacht weathervane into the wind as though it were at anchor. It's also very difficult to transport and store rigid wings. Another reason is that most boats have a great deal of windage. There are three ways a wing can outperform a conventional rig of the same span - it can produce higher maximum lift, it can have less parasite drag, and it can have less drag due to lift. If you already have the windage of topsides, exposed crew, standing rigging, running rigging, etc., what you save in parasite drag isn't going to make much difference. In fact, reducing windage is probably the best way to improve sailing performance. Take a look at this outstanding article by John Shuttleworth: http://www.steamradio.com/JSYD/Dogstar50-article.html. The air drag of the hull alone is nearly equal to the total water drag of the hull. And this is for a design that paid extraordinary attention to reducing the windage of the hulls. The difference in drag due to lift cones in two forms: induced drag and leading edge suction. Minimizing the induced drag depends on the planform shape and the ability to control twist. Modern sails have planforms with square-heads that are not unlike the planforms of rigid wings, and the opitmum planform for minimum induced drag looks like a board sail, anyway (http://www.tspeer.com/Planforms/Fig08.gif). So controlling induced drag comes down to controlling the spanload distribution through twist. This was one of the big breakthroughs for Cogito at the last C-clas competition for the International Catamaran Challenge Trophy (unfortunately it was the last C-class competition for the ICCT, but that's another story). On a thick leading edge, the stagnation point lies on the windward side and the flow rapidly accelerates around the leading edge. This low pressure on the leading edge pulls the wing forward. In fact, at high angles of attack, the suction on the leading edge can result in the net load in the plane of the wing being forward. In the early days of aviation, this caused the collapse of several aircraft in flight before designers started adding diagonal wires to brace against loads in the forward direction as well as drag in the aft direction. With a sharp leading edge, the flow separates and (hopefully) reattaches short distance behind the leading edge, forming a vortex that lies just behind the lee side of the leading edge. This vortex produces low pressures on the surface that are comparable to the leading edge suction of the thick leading edge, but the force is oriented normal to the surface instead of pointing forward. This loss of leading edge thrust shows up as a lift-dependent drag that also scales as lift-squared, making it look a lot like induced drag. This is an area where a wingmast or a rigid wing rig can have an advantage over a wire-luff sail. ...d) What seems to be missing in the comparisons I have seen, is that as wind strength increases, the camber of a thin sail is automatically reduced, which also significantly reduces the drag. This is not necessarily the case for aerofoil sections which are generally, for practical reasons unable to alter thickness with wind strength, hence their camber is not optimised and as a result their drag can in fact be higher than the much flatter thin sails as the wind strength increases. None of these effects seem to be addressed in the discussions and conclusions presented.....or am I missing something? You're probably right. To me, what's almost universally missing are quantitative comparisons in the context of a systems approach to the design. Shuttleworth's article is a refreshing exception. A good question would be why does changing the camber change the drag? To answer that question, you'd have to know what is causing the drag in the first place. Here is the computed performance of a NACA 65-012 section for three different Reynolds numbers: http://www.basiliscus.com/ProaSections/AppendixD/N65012n.jpg. The profile drag is nearly constant with angle of attack near the design lift (zero, in this case). The graph on the right side of the figure shows why. As the lift increases, the point of transition from a laminar boundary layer to a turbulent boundary layer moves forward on the lee side, increasing the drag. But the transition point on the windward side moves aft by almost exactly the same amount, so the total amount of laminar vs turbulent surface area is essentially unchaged. Until the transition suddenly moves all the way to the leading edge on the lee side, producing the jump in drag that marks the edge of the "drag bucket". Camber really doesn't change this - it mainly shifts the behavior to a different lift range. For example, here are a number of sections plotted for comparison: http://www.basiliscus.com/ProaSections/Paper/FiveSection10n.JPG. Included along with the NACA 65-012 are the venerable NACA 0012, and three sections of my own design. The 0012 does not exhibit the drag bucket behavior of the other sections because its transition point moves smoothly toward the leading edge on the lee side while the windward side soon becomes almost fully laminar. The only difference between the P30012 and the the P30212 sections is the addition of 2% camber. You can see that adding camber simply moves the drag bucket without changing the drag appreciably. But all these sections have essentially fully attached flow. In a previous post, I referred to this prediction (http://www.tspeer.com/temp/wm10m35r10a08.JPG) of a wingmast-sail combination at an angle of attack of 8 degrees. Here's the same shape at an angle of attack of 4 degrees: http://www.tspeer.com/temp/wm10m35r10a04.JPG. Notice how much larger the windward side separation bubble is. At a low enough angle of attack, the separation doesn't reattach and, paradoxically, the windward side is stalled! This is really a negative angle of attack stall, but you can have so much camber that the "inverted" stall actually occurs in the positive lift range. So controlling the windward side separation bubble is the key to optimizing the performance of this section. This figure, http://www.tspeer.com/temp/mc10mxxr10.jpg, shows the effect of changing mast rotation. The previous figures were calculated at the ideal (smooth lee side) mast rotation of 35 degrees. These curves were generated by rotating the mast but keeping the sail shape the same. When under-rotated, there's a concave corner on the lee side at the mast-sail junction. This causes a separation bubble to be formed there, too. But the windward side separation bubble is smaller. So with the under-rotated mast and low angle of attack, two separation bubbles are formed, and the drag from the two is less than the drag of one big bubble - assuming the flow even reattaches on the windward side. As a result, the optimum mast rotation - the only camber control in this example - is lower for lower lift coefficients. XFOIL couldn't even compute a solution at low angles of attack if the mast was rotated too much. The flow is essentially fully turbulent both surfaces, so controlling the amount of laminar flow isn't the issue that it was with the thick sections. In both cases, changing the camber shifted the characteristics to different lift ranges. But the drag mechanisms were quite different between the sail and solid foil sections, as was the operating lift range. After all, the sail was operating at four times the lift! This has been a long-winded way of saying, "horses for courses." I think it's essential to understand what's really going on and what the aero- hydro-dynamic mechanisms are if you hope to improve performance in a rational manner. The conventional rig is the convention for very good reasons. I think it's worth taking the time to understand why it works so well and where it's real deficiencies lie. As the cliche goes, "If you're hunting elephants, you have to go where the elephants are." I think parasite drag of the entire boat is the elephant to hunt. e) I believe, that comparisons should therefore be made at different wind strengths between the lift /drag ratio of say a 15% camber assymetric foil and a thin foil with the lift of a 15% camber section at low speeds and 5% camber at high speeds. Yes, a comparison under comparable conditions is the way to go. Another factor that's often missed is to compare the actual lift and drag (in pounds or newtons) instead of just nondimensional coefficients. The coefficients can be misleading when the basis for nondimensionalizing them is changing. For example, if the planform area or span are different (as when reefing) the coefficients can give the wrong picture. f) The net effect is that thin foil "normal" sails actually perform better than aerofoils in light airs and are exceedingly effective at reducing drag at high speeds by automatic camber reduction, which makes them very competitive with thick aerofoils. This may give a more realistic picture and perhaps explain why we do not see big benefits in using wing sails. I have tried to analyse data in the texts with this in mind, but always find the data lacking enough detail to make a proper comparison. Perhaps you have better data available and can make a good comparison. I think you're right. Unfortunately, many books (Marchaj's for example) are long on phenomenology and short on systematic data that a designer can actually use. Books like Larsson & Eliasson's "Principles of Yacht Design" need to be augmented with more handbook data. Today, computational fluid dynamics is becoming more accessible (like XFOIL). While CFD still has major short-comings, it provides far more understanding into the "why" than does basic test data. I only have access to the sources that everyone else has. Where I can, I'm trying to generate the kind of systematic data that's useful for design. The figures I've cited are from a rewrite of my wingmast paper that's in work. I've rerun most of the old cases and added the effects of mast rotation, too. Frank Bethwaite has sent me tracings of Tasar mast sections so I can look into the stepped-wingmast approach as well as the teardrop shapes. Unfortunately, XFOIL can't handle the Tasar sections, so I have to go to a Navier Stokes code, and I haven't made much progress in that direction lately. [Date/Time=09-06-2003 - 2:35 PM] Name:Tom Speer me@tspeer.com, [Msgid=502133] Re; Foil-Borne Draught Ah, I hadn't caught that. I thought you were talking about an ordinary outboard and wanting to put foils on it. I guess I blew right past the speed you quoted because verybody claims their boats go fast! Surface piercing props are a different animal, of course. [Date/Time=09-06-2003 - 2:40 PM] Name:Tom Speer me@tspeer.com, [Msgid=502138] re; I'm sure the society has archived the Johnson/Tulin stuff from the 60's. Basically you want the section to look like a speedboat prop. These are inherently 'high speed foils' have been emperically optimized for decades. A flat pressure face with an arc on the suction side is a pretty good approximation to a NACA 16 series airfoil, so it does a decent job throughout the speed/ cavitation range. [Date/Time=09-06-2003 - 3:08 PM] Name:jim hynes jhynes@socal.rr.com, [Msgid=502153] Re; Paddle Wheel Hydrofoil First, please excuse the delay in replying to your answers. I live in Pittsburgh PA. Over the years, I've traveled down the Ohio River to Marietta, Ohio to watch the annual "Steamboat Races". Also, Pittsburgh is a departure point for the Delta Queen. Since these craft are relatively flat bottom craft with a paddle-wheel, it has always seemed to me that attacting hydrofoils with a pivoting paddlewheel would allow these craft to achive speeds that would make for an interesting experiment. Please comment. Thank you. Mark Lape [Date/Time=09-07-2003 - 9:37 PM] Name:Mark Lape mlape@comcast.net, [Msgid=502793] Re; Paddle Wheel Hydrofoil Hi Mark, My feeling is that the concept you have in mind would be more effective on a light weight low resistance craft, along the lines of a conventional hydrofoils. For a typical paddlesteamer, paddles operating as they currently do probably are the only way of generating the necessary thrust to move the vessel along at any sort of speed with a paddlewheel arrangement. [Date/Time=09-10-2003 - 9:58 AM] Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=504503] Re; re; Thin Sails vs Airfoils Tom, thanks for your rather comprehensive reply. I have noticed you are active in many forums, it is very good to have your contribution. If I may summarise to confirm my understanding of your comments. 1) The sheer practicality and low weight of conventional rigs is a clear advantage. Perhaps the real issue is that the efficiency gains of airfoil rigs have not yet been matched by our engineering expertise. After all, current aircraft with fixed wings and massive engines are pretty cumbersome when compared with the sheer elegance of the capabilities of birds. 2) There is little relative benefit from just fairing the rig to reduce drag as there is so much other drag around from the hull, stays etc. You refer to a 50ft catamaran, which is probably an extreme example, but definitely an eye opener! I presume a dinghy will have far less relative windage and operates at lower speeds, but still there is a lot that could be done. A sailboard would have least windage, but there is always the skipper of course! 3) It would appear that spanwise twist is inherent and in fact one of the most important features to control induced drag in thin foil sails. If I read you correctly, Airfoils have only just recently started to introduce similar features, and then only in C-class cats. Any idea how much difference this makes? 4) Modern dinghy and sailboard rigs have square top high aspect planforms similar to Airfoil rigs, they also have excellent twist control and faired masts. You have already confirmed that parasitic drag of the rig is a minor issue, I teherefore assume that it is the increased lift of an airfoil rig which would give a significant advantage compared to conventional rigs. You have stated that this is mainly due to the effect of accelerating the wind around the forward part of a thick foil. 5) It would seem therefore that to have a large radiused leading edge on the leeward side is beneficial. In practice we already achieve this by over rotating small wing mast sections, eg: Cats, Tasar etc. The limitation you have described is windward side separation, which I agree occurs often and forces a compromise with rotation angle. Perhaps these rigs really need a pocket luff as well to fair in the windward side. How would this compare with the 50% Wing sections you have proposed?. 6) Are you aware of any data comparing actual performance of: soft sail, fully battened sail with boltrope track on mast, pocket luff, over rotating small wing mast, large 50% wingmast and full airfoil solid wing? My own observation from dinghies, is that switching from a standard rig with boltrope track on a round mast to a pocket luff sailboard style rig provides about one minute advantage in a 60 minute race, ie: somewhat less than 2% improvement. An over rotated wingmast gives a similar performance increase, but at lower wind strengths, and is a disadvantage in stronger winds. ie it has more power but also more drag and less gust response. 7) I notice there is a significant difference in how we talk about airfoils and thin sails. As a practical sailor, I see that a thin sail has an entry angle, which is perhaps twice that of the angle of attack of the entire section (depending on the section shape). We try to sail with this entry angle at zero incidence to the wind, and often in moderate to fresh breezes it is the windward side which is stalling, not the lee side, which in fact has flow attached most of the time. Camber may be seen as determining the amount of deflection of the breeze and therefore controls the angle of attack of the section. As both lift and drag increase with angle of attack, this is why I see increased camber leading to increased drag. 8) I also agree that the situation is worst for headsails with fine leading edges. This is probably why they are so difficult to trim correctly. They also have a severe limitation in getting fuller with wind strength as the luff sags. I believe it is far better to have a flexible mast spar to bend and flatten the sail as the wind increases. If it weren't for the notion of "slot effect" I am sure we would find that mono rigs would be faster than jib and main across the wind range. 9) One possibility that is raised by your comments on the fundamentals is that it would seem an over rotating small wing mast as used on a Tasar etc contained within a pocket luff may provide the best of all worlds, ie: large solid radius on the lee side when fully rotated while maintaining a faired windward side, but still light and practical to handle. Any thoughts on this? The big question for me is: "Does the improved lift from the airfoil section outweigh the disadvantages? You have not been unequivocal about this, but the conclusion at the moment seems to be that airoil sections only work for special, purpose built craft. [Date/Time=09-12-2003 - 5:57 PM] Name:Ian Ward ianward@ozemail.com.au, [Msgid=506238] Journal of Fluids Engineering Article ViewThread Will you please to inform is it possible to read the article Dorange P., Billard J.-Y., Cid Tomas I., 2000, "Of cavitation inception and development on a two-dimensional Eppler hydrofoil," March 2000, Journal of Fluids Engineering, Vol. 122, pp. 164-173. [Date/Time=09-12-2003 - 6:27 PM] Name:Andrey Leonov aleon@aha.ru, [Msgid=506251] Source of Pressure Envelope Data Needed The information at your website is so useful to get knowledge while studying the hydrodynamics of hydrofoils for fins on windsurfers and sailboats. Will you please advise where is it possible to get minimum pressure envelopes via Internet for thinner than 817 Eppler (like maybe 818 series profiles) as it is suggested to have smaller -Cpmin? Are there any new such calculated profiles in recent years of cavitation studies? Also, it is of interest to know what foils are usually used for windsurfers... Fin brands like Fin's, Select, etc... and sportsmen intending to challenge speed records as on http://www.worldspeedsailing.com/event_fr.html. Were there any attemtps to use anticavitating nonsymmetrical profiles with higher possible effiiciency for speed windsurf runs? Finally, can you advise where to look for the up-to-date materials in reseach of planing boards? I will appreciate any useful information. I have been an amateur windsurfer over the ten years that have passed since I studied high-speed hydrodynamics at MIPT. [Date/Time=09-13-2003 - 9:04 AM] Name:Andrey Leonov aleon@aha.ru, [Msgid=506506] re; JFE and other ASME Articles You can buy a copy of the article on line from the Online Journal Publishing Service at http://searchojps.aip.org/. I did not check the price, but I expect it will be very expensive. If anyone were to put the full text of this article up on the internet, they would be in violation of copyright law. The best opportunity, I think, is to find a copy of the journal in a university library. Or, perhaps someone will see your posted message and mail you a copy of the article... this is not legal either, but it has been done between colleagues without legal consequences. [Date/Time=09-14-2003 - 3:39 PM] Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=507105] Re; re; JFE and other ASME Articles Thank's a lot .At last I've get it [Date/Time=09-15-2003 - 8:42 AM] Name:Andrey Leonov aleon@aha.ru, [Msgid=507445] re; Cavitation Inception As a follow-up to my previous reply: the cost to view the article on line is $25, and it will have to be charged to a credit card. As an alternative, why don't you contact Jacques Astolfi and ask him to send you a copy of the article? His email address is astolfi@ecole-navale.fr. It is worth a try... the worst he can do is ignore you or refuse to send it. You might get lucky and receive a copy free. Note J. Astolfi's cavitation page at: http://www.ecole-navale.fr/fr/irenav/cv/astolfi/astolfi_cavitation.htm For information, here is the abstract of the article (free!) An Experimental Investigation of Cavitation Inception and Development on a Two-Dimensional Eppler Hydrofoil J.-A. Astolfi, P. Dorange, J.-Y. Billard et al. University of Valladolid, Valladolid, Spain Received : March 6, 1998 Abstract Cavitation inception and development on a two-dimensional foil with an Eppler E817 cross section issued from an inverse calculus have been experimentally investigated. The foil is theoretically designed to have a wide cavitation-free bucket allowing a large range of cavitation-free angle of incidence (Eppler, R., 1990, Airfoil Design and Data, Springer-Verlag, Berlin). The inception cavitation numbers, the noise level, the velocity distribution, the minimum pressure coefficient, the cavitation patterns (bubble, leading edge "band type" cavitation, attached sheet cavity), together with the sheet cavity length have been experimentally determined. Effects on the velocity field have been studied too with a slightly developed cavitation. For angles of incidence larger than 1 deg, a great difference exists between the inception cavitation number and the theoretical minimum pressure coefficient. However it is in agreement with the measured one obtained from velocity measurements (for 0 deg [Date/Time=09-15-2003 - 9:13 PM] Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=507898] Hydroplane-foil R/C hybrid? ViewThread Iv been running gas rc boats for 8 years now & have been bitten by the speed bug. 🙂 Im building my second rigger now (3 point ellison) to increase my speed from my old 5 point cajun bullet rigger (hydro) which fastest speed was 69 mph gps. Iv been thinking about combining a surface drive rigger with hydrofoils under the sponsons. It would be three point. But the rear would remain at prop shaft depth (no foil) riding on the prop like it always has. But the sponsons would have foils under them.One on each side (2) Instead of the hull rising up & out of the water. The sponsons would need to move up & out of the way of the water to remain at the surface drive level 1/2 the prop above the water level. Or just live with a positive running attitude after foil born. My Questions are: If hydro foils are so fast. Why wont the world speed record holders use them? The latest design (quicksilver) is a turbine powered canard which is still a hydroplane. Seems to me that running under the waters surface would also be safer avoiding swells & unwanted chop at 320 mph. And is there a turn-key flying height controller available? Mr Dixon was kind enough to supply a drawing of a controller. But can anyone recommend specific hardware (sensors, schmitt trigger oscillator, and foil angle controler interface-servo's & linkage) to use for a R/C project? Where do I find a vertical acceleration sensor & the hardware above? Can Helicopter gyros work for roll control? Can anyone guess on the cost of the controllers needed? In my project I would need maybe only a level controller & roll controller since the rear would always ride at the same prop level. Thanks for your time. Mike Kolder [Date/Time=09-28-2003 - 2:13 PM] Name:Mike Kolder mikek13@netzero.net, [Msgid=516042] Re; Hydroplane-foil R/C hybrid? Mike, AT 70 mph in water, the dynamic pressure is 75 psi. At 100mph where a fast rigger can run on a straightaway, it's twice that. You couldn't build a small enough foil (~1/10 sq.in). The same thing goes for a 300mph full scale 'boat'. At those speeds, aero lift is almost free, the trick is to trim so the sponsons barely touch. Circle racing is another matter. Hydroplanes use a turn fin (bad hydrofoil) on the inside sponson. It pulls down and in around a turn, and usually has a blunt leading edge to help with stability. I've been wanting to add a second fin on the outside sponson, but bend them both to about 45 degrees from vertical. This passive, surface piercing setup would have height and roll stability. On the straights both would lift and the sponsons would come up a little, in the turn the angle of attack would change the load sharing so both could pull inward. I haven't gotten around to trying it (probably take a couple of hours), but I think Ken Cook has. [Date/Time=09-29-2003 - 10:59 AM] Name:jim jhynes@socal.rr.com, [Msgid=516453] FOIL ASSISTED CATAMARAN With the assistance of INTERNATIONAL HYDROFOIL SOCIETY users I added a foil to a cat I designed and built. Well have a look and tell use what you think happened.... [Date/Time=12-29-2003 - 5:56 PM] Name:Michael jaworski nmdesigns@sympatico.ca, [Msgid=564395] Image Attached: "foil1.jpg" Click Here To View FOIL ASSISTED CATAMARAN ViewThread Thanks International Hydrofoil Society users for there help in adding a foil to my catamaran [Date/Time=12-31-2003 - 10:53 AM] Name:Michael jaworski nmdesigns@sympatico.ca, [Msgid=565051] Image Attached: "2cat.jpg" Click Here To View Re; FOIL ASSISTED CATAMARAN Hi Mike, I would be interested in seeing what your final foil system looks like. Looking at the trim from the photos of your vessel at speed it looks like you have the boat quite well sorted out. best regards Gunther [Date/Time=01-02-2004 - 4:46 AM] Name:gunther migeotte gunther@cae.co.za, [Msgid=565671] Surface Ventilated Supercavitating Foils Does anybody know where I can obtain a copy of the paper by Gabor Dobay: "Hydrofoils Designed for Surface Ventilation-An Experimental Analysis" ...that he presented at the 1965 Spring Meeting of the Soc. of Naval Architects and Engineers (Seattle, WA)? Any suggestions on other more recent references on the same subject? Thanks. [Date/Time=04-23-2004 - 9:13 AM] Name:Terry Hendricks thendricks@pacbell.net, [Msgid=635624] building foils hi i have a 8 meter planing boat which weighs in at about 4000 kg it is running a 3 litre 200hp out board i need some imformation on how to lift the hull a bit higher out of the water when it is planning i dont want to lift it clear of the water but just to reduce the drag so as to increase speed and get better fuel economy if anyone can help with any imformation on this subject thanks WAYNE [Date/Time=07-10-2004 - 4:15 PM] Name:WAYNE deac@xtra.co.nz, [Msgid=677503] View Messages Search Messages Return to Home Page Frequently Asked Questions This board has been viewed 21675 times since Apr-20-2002 . (Total Views Since Board Creation on Mar-21-2002 is 22409.) Questions about this board, email: bbs@foils.org System Support, Email: support@bulletinboards.com To Learn About Bulletin Boards: Click Here Bulletin Board Management Site: Click Here (321) 984-9080 © 1997 - 2004 P.A. Corp. 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International Hydrofoil Society Correspondence Archives…

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HIGH POINT (PCH-1)
(More HIGH POINT Photos are in the Gallery)
Chat, Information Sharing, Lessons Learned, and Networking

IHS Member Bob Phillips is the new owner of HIGH POINT . He is restoring the vessel; see: http://rpstander.tripod.com/.

(Revised 26 Jun 03)

Return to Posted Messages Bulletin Board


History

The PCH 1 was originally intended to be the Navy’s first operational hydrofoil craft. On January 24, 1958, the Chief of Naval Operations requested the Bureau of Ships to perform a design study of hydrofoil craft for harbor defense and coastal patrol. Results of this study were reported to OPNAV on March 7, 1958 recommending that hydrofoil patrol craft replace PCs and SCs in the FY 1960 shipbuilding program. On July 25, 1958 the Ship Characteristics Board (SCB) issued ship characteristics for a Patrol Craft Hydrofoil (PCH). Bureau of Ships Code 420 was directed to provide a preliminary design of a PCH. This was completed on March 5, 1958 and turned over to the Hull Design Branch, Code 440, for contract design.

The PCH contract plans and specifications were approved on January 18, 1960, and a $2.08M fixed -price contract for construction was awarded to the Boeing Company in June 1960. Boeing awarded a subcontract to Martinac Shipbuilding for construction, and the keel was laid on February 27, 1961 at the Martinac Shipyard in Tacoma, Washington. PCH 1 was launched on August 17, 1962 and christened HIGH POINT in honor of the city of High Point, North Carolina. On November 13, 1962, CINCPACFLT tentatively assigned her to COMASWFORPAC with the expectation that she would be assigned to Anti-Submarine (ASW) forces.

After completion of Final Acceptance Trials on January 28, 1963, HIGH POINT was delivered to the Navy at the Puget Sound Naval Shipyard (PSNS) on August 15, 1963. On May 7, 1964, CNO approved the request of PSNS for a 9-month extension of HIGH POINT ‘s availability for special performance trials and, on October 22, a decision was made to effect extensive repair and refurbishment of the ship.

On March 28, 1965, the Bureau of Ships requested DTMB to become the Technical Agent for Navy hydrofoil R&D. This resulted in the establishment and staffing of the DTMB Hydrofoil Development Project Office (Code 050) under Wm. M. Ellsworth, reporting to the Technical Director of the Laboratory. Early deficiencies in HIGH POINT had made it clear that there was a pressing need for additional R&D before hydrofoil craft would be ready for deployment to the Fleet. To this end, DTMB established a Hydrofoil Special Trials Unit (HYSTU) as a tenant activity of the Puget Sound Naval Shipyard. HIGH POINT was placed under technical and administrative control of HYSTU and operational control of COM-13 for the conduct of an extensive R&D test program.

At this point, an extensive R&D effort, described in this book, was undertaken during which HIGH POINT became a prime platform for expanding the technology base for hydrofoil craft. This included an evaluation of the ship by the Coast Guard as a cutter (WMEH 1) in April 1975.

In the years that followed, the expanding knowledge base of hydrofoil systems design and application led to design, construction, test, and evaluation of a number of hydrofoil test craft. In the mid 1970s this culminated in the acquisition of a squadron of six Navy Patrol Hydrofoil Missile (PHM) ships. They were built by Boeing and deployed to Key West, FL. Working with the Coast Guard, they demonstrated the many advantages of these high performance ships, with heavy firepower, and the capability of very high speed in very rough seas. The technology developed in this program also contributed to the building of several types of commercial hydrofoils such as the Boeing Jetfoil.

HIGH POINT was deactivated on December 01, 1984, and her Navy crew was reassigned. She had spent twenty good years in making major contributions to the knowledge of how to design and operate military and commercial hydrofoil ships. Wm. M. Ellsworth, P.E.


Correspondence

Photo Update

[26 Jun 03] Here’s a pic by my son Michael Cline of the current state of the HIGHPOINT moored near Tongue Point, Astoria, Oregon. I worked for Boeing Hydrofoil Div. during the latter stages of the TUCUMCARI development. — Bob Cline (clinewlt@pacifier.com)

Response[26 Jun 03] Thank you for the excellent (and large!) photo of HIGHPOINT today that you posted in the history section of the IHS Bulletin Board (BBS). A smaller version appears below. This is a good opportunity to point out some of the HIGHPOINT information available on the IHS website and elsewhere. Archived correspondence on this subject appears on this IHS page devoted to the ship. Additional photos are in the IHS Photo Gallery . IHS Member Bob Phillips is the current owner. He has done good work on an interesting and folksy webpage for the ship at http://rpstander.tripod.com/. That site has photos, drawings, and other information that will be of interest to hydrofoil history buffs and modelers. The faces in the pictures will be an interesting update for people who worked in the US military hydrofoil programs.

Mast

[15 Mar 02] I am a bit confused as to your description about roundels and hydraulic cover [not posted here – Ed.], but I will give you what we had and maybe you could figure it out. If you need more help, please provide more details such as size and approximate location. The housing for the lower mast originally contained the hydraulic cylinder for the dunk sonar, which was in the round room of the instrumentation room. On the aft side, we had a TV camera mounted on a pan and tilt unit. The mast had the masthead light, secondary masthead light, towing lights, aircraft warning, and signal lights. I don’t recall if we chiseled off the original mounts when the international navigation light requirements changed, and we relocated the lights to comply. We had antennaes for Loran, UHF radio, marine VHF radio, test circuit VHF radio (Closed circuit with Boeing tower), pair of IFF, and radar. An air horn was below the radar platform. There were three locations for signal flags. I have suspicion that you might be looking at the foundation for the IFF antennas since the others were most likely left in place. On another subject, I would like to remind you that the outdrive retraction actuator has a built in brake inside the cylinder. You need hydraulic pressure to release it. We found that the brake could not withstand the load of the propeller thrust in a steered position, and thus it started to retract. Note the patch on the stern. Thus the pin was added to hold the outdrive in the extended position. The hydraulic fluid used is Skydrol and if you are changing fluid, most likely need to put in new seals. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Responses…[15 Mar 02] What I was referring to about the mast as roundels ( term for British and French war bird insignias, others too I think.) are the two round plaques, one pair port one pair stbd. the upper one has a dark blue border the lower one is light blue to gray with something in the middle (a drawing or number.), that’s what I can’t see clearly in the photos I’ve seen and downloaded so far. The alu. plates that apparently held the insignias are still on the mast ( about 1′ 6″ around I’d guess, one above the other.) but the insignias apparently screwed or bolted to them. I was very lucky to have gotten most of the original drawings and specs with her so I am becoming more and more aware of the layouts of the systems. I found out in last night’s reading about the locking cyl. also the servos are really servos ( most hydraulic people will call an electrically actuated valve a servo, kudos to you guys for being accurate!!!) that just makes the job easier. I had thought about using another fluid but I can probably dredge up some Skydrol as easily as change all the seals. But I think running the steering and release and rotator ram off the hullborne engine, as a completely separate system from the rest of the ss hyd. makes sense, don’t you? — Bob Phillips (rpstander@bigplanet.com)

[15 Mar 02] I now know what you are talking about. The ship was assigned to what was called David Taylor Naval Ship R&D Center (now Naval Surface Warfare Center, Carderock Division) and funded by NAVSEA. The two insignias (plaques) were on the mast. The DTNSRDC one has the compass version, whereas the NAVSEA one was the standard Navy version which has the eagle. There was some decals of the DTNSRDC version stuck to the bulkheads on the ship As for the ship service hydraulic system, at the present time, you do not need the strut/foil extend/retract system. Thus only the hullborne drive functions are left. CAPT Fraser bought a replacement anchor windlass, but I don’t know any details of it. You might make sure it is not hydraulic. Depending on the pump you find, it could be cheaper to change fluid and seals. Ron Ihle found an aircraft surplus store and was looking at replacing the pumps from that source. I am happy to hear you received all the drawings. We furnished CAPT Fraser a complete set of microfiche. The technical manuals were in the file cabinet forward of the Engineering console. If you got the logs, the manuals should be there also. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

New PCH-1 HIGH POINT Website

[10 Mar 02, updated 3 Nov 02] Here’s the address of the site on PCH-1 progress,  http://rpstander.tripod.com/. As far as foilborne operations: I’ve some ideas, other than as original (couldn’t afford the fuel or gas turbines, at least for very long.), such as shortening legs( weight advantage, lower sea state operation), water jet power ( pump in nacelle instead of gearbox and wheels more weight.), Diesel power foilborne (I believe that in your book it states that liftoff was successful as slow as 23kt. that should be able to be accomplished with about 500 hp per shaft.). But for the time being I’m just cleaning, repairing the electrical systems, installing up-to-date navigation gear, and re-doing the hullborne systems for dependable independent operation (I’ve decided there is no need to be able to unlock, raise, lower the stern drive from helm, so it will be done from engine room, with indicators only to show green board when all is well ) the mods I do should greatly simplify the hydraulic and electrical systems without endangering the redundancies or safety built into the ship. — Bob Phillips (rpstander@bigplanet.com)

HIGH POINT Changes Hands

[27 Feb 02] I’ve just finished purchasing the HIGH POINT from Mrs. Fraser (I know you are aware of the other deal that fell through, but I really bought). We moved her to Tongue Point for now, and she will be staying in the area for the foreseeable future as I live in Skamokawa WA. Should be able to maneuver hullborne soon. — Bob Phillips (rpstander@bigplanet.com)

HIGH POINT Update

[16 Dec 01] Great News [that Ron Ihle is planning to restore HIGH POINT]! When the HIGH POINT first became available, I went to check her out. In my opinion, she is a very restorable ship. Is it your plan to have her operational? If so foilborne, or strictly hullborne? I believe you are short some steering mechanism, as far as input goes anyway. But the bulk of the hullborne driving mechanism and the hullborne engine was still there when I inspected her. I really prefer the outdrive approach for hullborne propulsion used on HIGH POINT as far as our type of operations go. It enables you to keep the propulsion dry and not have to worry so much about corrosion. If you have read any of the info on the IHS site, you know our strong point is the technical side, especially where it comes to “field engineering” solutions to problems that are too expensive to solve conventionally. Our weak point is the administrative side, we are just now figuring out what we are going to do with her. Are you planning on ferrying her to San Fran Bay Area under her own power? As I recall, this wouldn’t be really difficult. I believe the HIGH POINT is “fly by wire” isn’t she? We have some extra helms from our ships that may work if you want to put together a helm control system like ours. I don’t know how far it is, but if moving a ship on the West Coast is as expensive as on the East, it could easily be more cost effective to put her under power. We have just begun to accumulate paperwork for the non-profit org, as well as the 501-c3 exempt status. We have applied for associate membership in the Historic Naval Ship Association, (HNSA). Is this the same organization you referred to as National Register of Historic Ships? Or is that something else entirely? Quite frankly, taking a ship that we or anyone else knows nothing about, have no documentation on, and have no engines for, and putting it back into ferriable shape with no budget, never seemed like much of an obstacle compared to the administrative tasks now before us. Any help you can provide would be very much appreciated and reciprocated wherever possible. — Eliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Responses…[16 Dec 01] Our plan is to have HIGH POINT as a fully operational museum vessel. We indeed hope that this includes foilborne also, at this early stage it all looks good. All this paperwork and corporate business is for the birds but I think we have to do it in order to preserve these vessels for the future. We put the cart before the horse with HIGH POINT, we started our 501-C3 paperwork and our National Register work before we even had a deal on HIGH POINT. I thought it best to try and be a step ahead, if all failed we’d just go “all stop.” We still have some paperwork delays, but I know all will work out. We hope to get HIGH POINT operational hullborne for her transit some 650 miles down the coast to the San Francisco Bay. I estimated that it would cost 30K to tow her home. Instead of just handing that money off, I’d rather put it into operational improvements on the ship. Engine wise, I’m sure we can light a fire under that 12V71 and get the outdrive system operational. I own a small tugboat company on San Francisco Bay, and diesels are part of the normal op for us (if you are in need of diesel parts or help please think of us, we’d be glad to help in any way possible). As far as our association goes I’m in the process of involving several youth programs into our group. These are older teenagers and the hope is to instill an interest in hydrofoils, engineering and the maritime fields. We are an open volunteer operation and I hope we can draw both young and old into this working side by side. Big hopes, but it has been done before. Anyway, more to come later. — Ron Ihle (ronihle@netscape.net)

[27 Dec 01] I am Ken Plyler, Master Chief Engineman USN ret, ex-High Point, ex Tucumcari, ex SeaFlite Hawaii, ex-Turismo Margarita de Venezuela. Was a plank owner on all these boats. Chief Engineer, HIGH POINT and TUCUMCARI, Director of Maintenance, JetFoils Hawaii and Venezuela. I know quite a bit about HIGH POINT during the first 3.5 years of her active/inactive life. I admire what you are trying to accomplish with HIGH POINT. If I can be of technical help in any way, please give me a shout. — Ken Plyler (Markskidmark@aol.com)

[13 Jan 02] My father, Alec McClair was a naval architect on the HIGH POINT. I have absolutely no doubt that he’d love to hear from you, and offer assistance in some way. I too would like to help if I can, you’ll find a message from me about the PLAINVIEW, proposing this very thing. As for Dad, you can reach him at: alecmcclair@yahoo.com. — Douglas McClair (doug.mcclair@bateswhite.com)

HIGH POINT Update

[16 Dec 01] My name is Ron Ihle, and I started the Hydrofoil HIGH POINT Association to first save, and than preserve, the PCH-1 HIGH POINT as a fully operational museum. We indeed hope that this includes foilborne also, at this early stage it all looks good. All this paperwork and corporate business is for the birds but I think we have to do it in order to preserve these vessels for the future. We have already applied for 501-C3 paperwork and have begun our National Register of Historic Ships work. We hope to get HIGH POINT operational hullborne for her transit some 650 miles down the coast to the San Francisco Bay. I estimated that it would cost 30K to tow her home. Instead of just handing that money off, I’d rather put it into operational improvements on the ship. Engine wise, I’m sure we can light a fire under that 12V71 and get the outdrive system operational. I own a small tugboat company on SFBay, and diesels are part of the normal op for us (if you are in need of diesel parts or help please think of us, we’d be glad to help in any way possible). As far as our association goes I’m in the process of involving several youth programs into our group. These are older teenagers and the hope is to instill an interest in hydrofoils, engineering and the maritime fields. We are an open volunteer operation and I hope we can draw both young and old into this working side by side. Big hopes, but it has been done before. Anyway, more to come later. — Ron Ihle (ronihle@netscape.net)

Response…[27 Dec 01] I am Ken Plyler, Master Chief Engineman USN ret, ex-HIGH POINT, ex-TUCUMCARI, ex SeaFlite Hawaii, ex-Turismo Margarita de Venezuela. Was a plank owner on all these boats. Chief Eng. HIGH POINT and TUCUMCARI, Director of Maintenance. JetFoils Hawaii and Venezuela. I know quite a bit about HIGH POINT during the first 3.5 years of her active/inactive life. I admire what you are trying to accomplish with HIGH POINT. If I can be of technical help in any way, please give me a shout. — Ken Plyler (Markskidmark@aol.com)

HIGH POINT Sold

[18 Nov 01] Negotiations have been completed between Janice Fraser, executor of the estate of CAPT Ronald Fraser, and Ron Ihle for a change in ownership of the HIGH POINT. Ron Ihle is establishing The HIGH POINT Association as an non profit group to restore the HIGH POINT to fully operational condition. Application is also being submitted to National Register of Historical Ships. Initially, some work will be done at Astoria, and eventually towed or propelled to San Francisco Bay for the restoration work. Ron estimates the tow to SF Bay at 30K, and would rather put the money into making HIGH POINT operational hullborne if at all possible. — Sumi Arima(arimas1@juno.com)

USS HIGH POINT (PCH-1) Veteran…

[16 Oct 01] I was promoted to Boatswain Mate 1st Class in the High Point at Bremerten, Wa. going on to a Career of 22 years. I retired in 1995 as a BMC and think back from time to time of the days in HIGH POINT. LCDR Daniel Mulhall was my Skipper, the XO QMC P. Henderson, CHANG, ENC James Mustoe. BM1 Barney and BM1 Huffman were there as were ET2 Ragzetts? SM3Christain MS1 Ray Shoquist, ET1 Turner, OS1 Tucker and others. I have a great picture of HIGH POINT that is showing its age any chance of finding another? — Stephen L. Heald, BMC(SW) USN (Ret) (bosnusn@starfishnet.com) 107 Heron Ct. Newport, NC 28570

HIGH POINT Offered For Sale, Last Chance…

[5 Dec 00] IHS received a call from Janice Fraser about her frustration with HIGH POINT. She says she’s just got to get rid of her by the end of this month (Dec 00). The cost of keeping the boat at the dock is too high, and apparently the lease runs out and needs to be renewed Jan 1, 2001. If interested, contact: Ms. Janice Fraser; 200 Harbor Drive, Apt #2703; San Diego, CA 92101; Tel: 619-233-3549

HIGH POINT Offered For Sale…

[12 Feb 00] After long discussions with a naval architect, I can’t find a way to put the HIGH POINT to any use. So I am going to put it on the market for one year at $100,000. If there is no interest by next January, off she goes to the scrapper. I don’t know what else I can do. — William Knuth (wil@pacifier.com)

Removal of Foils…

[17 Nov 99] Question; Can I jack the aft foil down all the way out of the boat? It seems to me that the HIGH POINT will cost to much to ever fly again and the operational costs are not cheap either. So if I were to remove the after foil and foil guards the boat could be docked easier and maybe even re-powered for twin screw hull borne operation. I’m trying to think of something other than scraping the boat. Suggestions? — William Knuth (wil@pacifier.com)

Response…[17 Nov 99] If you are thinking of removing the aft foil/strut while afloat, forget it. This operation could be done while docked in a high cradle with sufficient jacks and dollys. When Boeing removed the foil/strut for refurbishment, they had a house mover raise the ship to get the assembly to clear. You will have to recalculate the ship’s weight and balance. Removing the aft foils and struts would shift the LCG forward, probably not change the TCG, and would raise the VCG where with the other equipment removed, could make the ship very tender in anything but flat calm water. If you are going to pursue this thought further, I would suggest you contact a Naval Architect. A complete set of drawings on microfiche was given to Ronald Fraser. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Response…

[24 Nov 99] It looks like removal of the aft foils will be difficult. If it were accomplished, is it feasible to add an equal weight of ballast in the form of water in tanks or lead at that location to relieve its tenderness? — John Meyer (jmeyer@erols.com)

Location of PLAINVIEW and HIGH POINT

[11 Sep 99] I’m just curious if you know the current locations of the ex-PLAINVIEW and ex-HIGH POINT. I’m driving (from Eugene, OR) to Bremerton this weekend, and I’d like to head out to Astoria to photograph them if they’re still in the area. –Joe Lewis (lewi233@ibm.net)

Response…The location of the HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW are discussed in various e-mails on the International Hydrofoil Society web pages. The HIGH POINT is moored at a private dock in Astoria. The PLAINVIEW is anchored on the North side of the Columbia about a mile upriver. Take the road on the Washington side of the Columbia from Astoria bridge. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

HIGH POINT Questions…

[21 Aug 99] How is the HP steered when hullborne? I realize that the screw needs hydraulics to be let down into the water. Does the steering come as a function of the foils? Do the foils need to be let down for this? — William Knuth (wil@pacifier.com)

Response…[17 Aug 99] There is an emergency method of lowering the outdrive but at the present time, I cannot tell you exactly how. There is a book that I believe was given to Ronald on configuring various emergency conditions. This book use to occupy the bookshelf on the port rear of CIC. The hydraulic actuator that lowers the outdrive has a brake built into it, and cannot be seen. The brake needs pressure to release. A manual pin was installed after the brake failed and put a hole into the hull. The outdrive rotates 360 degrees when the unit is down. It needs to go 180 degrees to reverse. The propeller is a puller and the outdrive does not have bearings suitable for thrust in the opposite direction. The emergency steering is on the port side of the outdrive housing in the engine room transom. It is configured for a 3/4 drive socket. I don’t remember the ratio but it takes many turns to move it a few degrees. We have used an air drive instead of the provided crank. At this same location, a gear train with a hydraulic motor that sits vertical when extended is the normal method of steering. It is syncho controlled with the helm in the pilothouse. The indicator in the pilothouse, right side of helmsman, shows the outdrive position. The power is fed from the 400 hz power supply. The hydraulic pumps were on the two ship service diesels. Both of the original diesels were removed. The hydraulic system used Skydrol as its hydraulic fluid. This is an aircraft, non inflammable, and highly toxic fluid and should be handled with care. I originally suggested to Ronald that he consider replacing the helm with a lever control system like on the tugs and adapting a commercial marine hydraulic system motor to the outdrive. The hullborne drive can propel the ship with either the struts up or down. For least resistance, the flaps should be in zero position (straight back). The hydraulics for the foils and strut steering came from a separate system, and is not tied in with the outdrive and strut retraction hydraulics. –Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Where to Buy a Hydrofoil Legend…

[29 Jun 99] The HIGH POINT is now moored at a pier in Astoria Oregon. I was curious if there was an active restoration project underway. I would appreciate any current information. — Don Davis (yosimon@teleport.com)

Response…[29 Jun 99] Captain Ronald Fraser, owner of the HIGH POINT died a while back. The ship is available for purchase from the executor of his estate. The HIGH POINT was sold by the Navy with the two diesel generators, crane, anchor windlass, most of the electronics including radar and gyro compass, water maker, toilets, and miscellaneous other items stripped from the ship. The first buyer removed the two gas turbines, and then sold the ship to Ron Fraser. Ron Fraser’s goal was to get the HIGH POINT operational hullborne. With the diesel generators and gas turbines missing, the hydraulic pumps went with the prime movers, and thus was the major hurdle. Meanwhile, Ron bought an anchor windlass, diesel generators, and Incinolet toilets. He kept me appraised of the progress on HIGH POINT, which was minimal except for the purchasing of various replacement items. I have not seen the ship since he had it towed to Portland from Tacoma so I can not personally describe the present condition. The caretaker of the ship at the present time is Ron’s nephew. If you are interested in inspecting the ship, I will make arrangements for you with the executor. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

HIGH POINT Update…

[13 May 99] I was on the west coast last month where I met up with Will Knuth who is at this time tending HIGH POINT until a buyer can be found. I was able to get aboard and take an extensive tour. She is in very restorable condition. The layout is very usable as a live-aboard and with very little work the main deck could accommodate large windows and seating for sightseeing. The hullborne propulsion including engine and outdrive is intact and with one Detroit turning a prop I would guess very affordable to operate. the only thing that appears missing for foilborne operation are the turbines and I understand that these can be found reasonably priced compared to the LM2500. I know that this ship can be bought very cheap! I believe it would take less work to make her seaworthy enough to ferry than what it took us on PEGASUS (PHM 5 renamed). It would be a shame to see this fine ship scrapped! — Eliot James

Hydrofoils For Military and Ferry Use, Lessons Learned…

[28 Jan 99] I don’t know if there has been any discussion lately on the simplicity of using hydrofoils on the same routes that the smaller commuter catamarans are running on. These routes are mainly lakes, bays and sounds. There are very few open-ocean routes. Hydrofoils are more expensive to build due to the complexity of the things, something that the naval architects and engineers have built into the systems. [By contrast], the basic offshore aluminum crew boat is a reliable, lightweight, fast, and durable machine. No one has ever set a usable life on the things. There are 30+ years old boats out there running every day. It is a vessel that has evolved to carry out its mission. As far as I know, there are no hydrofoils operating in US waters. I believe in submerged hydrofoils with automatic control systems. Retractable foils have always been a joke. Mainly because the vessels with retractable foils were built to go anyplace. If a ferry vessel’s route normally has a maximum of 2′-3′ chop, there is no need for a 6′ gap between the keel and the water surface. If the water depth is sufficient over the entire ferry route there is no reason for retractable foils. The price of the boat can be reduced significantly. Short distance ferry routes don’t call for a Boeing 737 interior in the cabin. Commercial quality would do just fine. Get rid of the carpeting and plush seating. Concentrate on maintainability, speed and maneuverability. Too much high class, expensive, unproved machinery has been installed in the past that has given the American built hydrofoils a “bad rap.” PLAINVIEW and HIGH POINT are classic examples. I have often wondered if anybody ever sat down and figured out how much it cost per foilborne hour for the life of these vessels. Only a government could afford it. The PEGASUS class PHM was another boondoggle that cost the taxpayer a fortune to build, operate, and maintain. They were truly vessels without a mission. If some of that money could have been channeled into the private sector with an objective of building a hydrofoil passenger boat that would make money instead of spending money, we would have covered the world with US-built hydrofoils today. I hope you understand where I am coming from. Hydrofoils were my life for over ten years. I hate to see them die because of the bad reputation and the high cost of building one. Somebody will one day sit back and take a long look at where we have been and the knowledge that has been gained and come up with a viable, economical design. I hope so. I would hate to see everything that we have done in the past go down the tube. — Ken Plyler (Kfppfk@aol.com)

Response…[29 Jan 99] I read your comments and must reply in defense of HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW. When HIGH POINT was designed, there was limited knowledge of hydrofoils. It was originally built as an active patrol craft, but the Navy soon realized that it should be in a prototype category. With the original intent, many systems were designed light weight yet meeting the military specifications. In addition, since the concept was new, ABS and Coast Guard had inputs on safety considerations, etc. I recall considerable communications with the different groups which even included the sanitary features of the galley. As for the foils, struts, and foilborne propulsion, tests in the tow tank provided data which was not correlated to any actual data. The engineers used conservatism and thus had designs which later proved more than adequate. Meanwhile, with limited operations, (You should recall all the time sitting at the pier during your duty on the ship.) many operational problems were detected, and redesigned and rebuilt to provide in many cases a safe operation. Other things learned were when the foils and pods were strain gauged to determine load paths, revised fairings to try to reduce erosions, Although the foilborne transmission system was bathed in sea water frequently, it turned out that the gears were very reliable. Mod I changed the seal system which helped. Toward the end, no gearbox problems were noted for a period of about 3 years. As for the PLAINVIEW, the increased size required another set of design solutions that pushed into unknown territory. The hydraulic system required a couple thousand horsepower for the operation of the foils. Industrial hydraulic pumps did not have the continuous rating which proved to be a nemeses and subsequent redesign. Again, many areas of research and development in improving HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW and now used in other naval ships. In defense of the Jetfoil, I know that Boeing spent considerable time getting ABS and Coast Guard to accept alternatives in meeting their requirements. Some of the items that looks like frills in actually is based on ABS (American Bureau of Shipping) or Coast Guard requirements. For example, the seats need to be strong enough to withstand the g forces in crash landing. The cheapest was to use aircraft qualified seats. Coast Guard originally wanted a three man Pilot House crew. which Boeing successfully got Coast Guard to agree to two. For operations in other countries, Boeing had to certify that their requirements were also met. In summary, I hope I have changed your views on the earlier hydrofoils. The data collected has provided both engineering and operational information which are considered in new designs of all crafts, not just the hydrofoil ships. Meanwhile, with the experience, the regulatory agencies have changed their requirements. I’m sure the aluminum crew boats you talk of have benefited from the HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW trials. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

More About Lessons Learned…

[30 Jan 99] I spent 3 1/2 years on HIGH POINT. Most of my time was watching from the sidelines while various engineers, the Supervisor of Shipbuilding (SUPSHIP), Puget Sound Naval Shipyard (PSNSY), Boeing, and many more people than I care to think about turned the boat into a lifetime project. I was the Chief Engineer when we sprang the first gearbox salt water leak off Neah Bay and motored home hullborne. I was also the guy that turned the propellers by hand until the bearings finally froze while waiting for someone to make a decision to tear it down or not. I also watched as the powers that be installed the new spade rudder below the forward foil using 1/4-20 bolts that failed the first time we tried it foilborne. The new spade rudder was installed because the trailing edge rudder did not work due to severe ventilation of the forward strut. I watched as the stellite cladding for the after foil and struts was hand formed by a blacksmith using an anvil, a rosebud torch and a hammer. The cladding was installed using 1/4-20 nylon screws. This was an engineered fix to eliminate the severe erosion of the HY-80 caused by the propeller tip vortices. I was onboard during the testing of this installation. I was also under the boat, in drydock, during the inspection to determine why the cladding fell off. I was onboard when we tested the new stainless steel, five bladed propellers with paper thin blades. I was also under the boat, in drydock, to find out why they folded up like rose buds after only a few minutes of foilborne time. Sumi, I could go on and on but will not. I was assigned to HIGH POINT during construction, outfitting and trials. Our Type Commander was to be Commander, Amphibious Force Pacific. Our home port was to be San Diego. We never made it. I left the boat sitting on the barge under the Hammerhead Crane with gearboxes locked up. It had not run in months. Phase One was “in the mill,” and HYSTU was on the verge of being formed. I went away probably in disgust and returned as the Chief Engineer on TUCUMCARI 18 months later. TUCUMCARI was the ship that I had dreamed HIGH POINT was going to be. It was the vessel that proved that there was life after HIGH POINT. TUCUMCARI never belonged to HYSTU. TUCUMCARI unfortunately died doing what it was designed to do. It “died with it’s boots on,” so to speak. It never ended up intact at a DOD Surplus Sale. I wish I could be more positive when talking about HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW. Sorry. One good thing about the development of the HIGH POINT was the extruded aluminum panels that made up the hull plating. Unfortunately, no one is using the panel that I know of. — Ken Plyler (Kfppfk@aol.com)

Response…[30 Jan 99] If you read my original comments, I recognized your participation in the growing pains of HIGH POINT. You have precisely backed up my original comments. If it was not for all the engineering solutions of the various problems on HIGH POINT, the operational aspects of hydrofoils would still be floundering. In some cases, the solutions were cost constrained and were not approached in the manner that an engineer would really like to do. The trials on HIGH POINT provided proven design concepts which were incorporated in the design of an operational hydrofoil such as the TUCUMCARI and PHM series. This shows that the things learned from HIGH POINT did benefit the design of hydrofoil ships. How well I remember HIGH POINT being assigned to Amphibious Force Pacific. When Adm. James came to see the construction of HIGH POINT, Lt. Billerbeck questioned the Admiral of various aspects of Navy requirements. The reply from the Admiral was “Son, if I were you, I would throw away the book and do what you think needs to be done.” As I originally stated, HIGH POINT was reassigned since it became apparent to the Navy that this new concept required work to make it reliable. I know that a new class of destroyers has been put in the same category to resolve engineering and operational problems. The Navy has been building destroyers for years, yet finds that a new class requires engineering evaluations to make it operationally feasible. For a new concept such as a hydrofoil ship, I feel that we did very well. I do not feel that you should compare the Ford Model T with the Ford Thunderbird other than they are both automobiles. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

 


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PLAINVIEW Veteran

[28 Feb 03] I too was one of the last members of the PLAINVIEW crew. It is so sad to see her resting place. — Gary M. Mickelsen, Mt. Vernon, WA (Gary.Mickelsen@paccar.com)

PLAINVIEW Update

[3 Apr 02] I just wanted to let you know that I passed by her hull, yesterday, and found her condition just the same as on the photos you already have linked on your website. I was very surprised to find a historic ship in that condition, so I took a few photos, noted her name and looked her up on the web. The tide was in when I was there, so I couldn’t observe her bottom. I did not board her, just observed the condition. There is one orange foil on the beach beside her. Sadly, I concur with the opinion already published that recommissioning her would likely be nearly as expensive than a new build. She could probably be floated and made into a museum display, or similar… Very nice website; shows pride and honor. — Robert Jaeger (rnj@jaegerdesigns.com)

PLAINVIEW Veteran

[15 Mar 02] I was on the decomissioning crew and when we left on the last day they gave us all a large copy of the print that covered the ward room wall. However it has incurred some damage over the years and I am having trouble getting repaired or copied because of it’s size. I am still checking. (Relargo@cs.com)

PLAINVIEW Veteran

[3 Feb 02] I was a crewmember of PLAINVIEW AGEH-1 from Sep 1970 to Jan 1974. I am extremely saddened to see the end that this unique and versatile ship has come to. I was aboard her on her 100th foilborne flight hour on the 6 of Jun 1970 and was part the crew that loaded and fired the Sea Sparrow Missiles. My Capt. at that time was Lt. William J. Erickson. A lot the crew were support personnel. I was the supply Petty Officer, but stood watches in Navigation, Hullborne helmsman, Foilborne Lookout and Engineering room watches. I remember that one of the problems that caused the most down time, was that the hydraulic pumps were not designed to operate continuously. I would enjoy hearing from any member of the crew that served aboard this World’s Largest Hydrofoil and to compare experiences. — Gilbert Gibson SKC, USB, (Ret) (GilbertGib@msn.com)

PLAINVIEW Veteran Sought

[3 Feb 02] Does anyone know what ever happened to Chief Hayes? To my knowledge he was the last of the PLAINVIEW‘s Chief EN/GS types. I had heard that he had remained in the Bremerton WA area, but haven’t been able to track him down. — Greg Bender (GBender@Noesis-Inc.com)

Response…[20 Mar 02] I am pretty sure Chief Hayes died in the late eighties/early nineties. He was working at SIMA San Diego in the diesel shop at the time. — Frank Hudson (fwhudson@adelphia.net)

PLAINVIEW as Yacht Platform?

[5 Sep 01] I would like to find out all the information on the PLAINVIEW regarding plans, blueprints, photos, “action shots”, etc. This information will be important in evaluating the market for a luxury hydrofoil. — Vladimir M. Algin (v.algin@businesstalkfrance.com)

Response…[5 Sep 01] In direct response to your quest for information on the USS PLAINVIEW, I can provide the following information:

  • Following the decision to exit the hydofoil business, Grumman (now Northrop Grumman) shipped all hydrofoil files for “safekeeping” at the US Navy’s request to the Hydrofoil Data Bank at David Taylor Ship R&D Center. I personally supervised this transfer. Your best bet probably would be locate the information there. (Grumman never was reimbursed for the transfer effort.)
  • If you are unable to locate the information you seek from official sources, I may have some or all of the information you seek in my personal files; but it would take some time and effort to locate. I know I do have a reduced size mylar (11″ high) of the hull lines and offsets. If you go this route, I suggest you forward a list of your requirements.
  • As a professional Naval Architect, I would strongly advise against configuring the PLAINVIEW as a luxury hydrofoil yacht. I joined Grumman as a Naval Architect in 1963. The PLAINVIEW was originally designed at Grumman about two years prior, and the integration and balance of foilborne and hullborne functions in a ship design was not fully understood at the time. The design was almost totally biased to foilborne performance, particularly longitudinal weight distribution. In addition the hull density was low (i.e. the enclosed volume was too large.) As a result, the aft compartments of the PLAINVIEW could not carry any major weight without upsetting longitudinal distribution. These compartments were largely empty; their primary function was to connect the tail strut and foil to the rest of the ship.
  • Part of the beauty of the PLAINVIEW is the long slender aft main deck, cutdown from the forward portions of the ship. What is not well known, is that the aft portions of the hull design were cut down to the final configuration during design development as a weight saving measure and to improve the weight distribution. So the intrinsic beauty of the PLAINVIEW resulted from the necessity to correct original design flaws!
  • I wrote a paper about twenty years ago addressing the integration of the hullborne and foilborne functions in a hydrofoil ship, entitled “Hydrofoil Hullform Selection”. I think it is included in the new IHS CD-ROM, but I believe it is mistitled as “Hydrofoil Hullform Section”. If you haven’t already, I would highly recommend purchase of this CD, as it appears to contain a lot of potentially useful information in an easy to store form. It is a bargain at $5.00! I refer you to this paper to better understand the integration of hullborne and foilborne aspects of a hydrofoil. If you can’t get a copy, I may still have a copy in my personal files.In your interest in hydrofoil luxury yachts, are you thinking of a ship the size of the PLAINVIEW or a smaller scaled version? A hydrofoil the size and speed of the Plainview will certainly to expensive to design, build, and operate. If this is your objective, I would consider it to be an order of magnitude beyond “luxury”. — Charles G. Pieroth” (SoundTM@ix.netcom.com)

PLAINVIEW Print Wanted…

[2 Sep 01] I was one of the first members of the crew of the PLAINVIEW. During the time that I spent on the Plainview the crew members were given a print made from a picture of the PLAINVIEW while it was foilborne. Seattle was in the background and even Mt. Rainier could be seen in the background as well. If anyone knows where I could get a copy of that print or a similar print please let me know. The picture I have in mind would have been made in 1969, 1970 or 1971. Your help would be appreciated. — Terry Haynes (t_haynes@cybrtyme.com)

Responses…[2 Oct 01] I think I have a copy of that picture, but the print I have does not have any of the background that you referenced. It was the print that was passed out to all crew members when it was put In-Service in March of 1970. It is a shot of the port side, full length while flying. I am curious as to when you were aboard PLAINVIEW ? I am a plank owner and spend three years aboard her. — Ken Umbarger (kumbarger@portofsandiego.org)

[22 Oct 01] I have the photo to which you refer and can have it copied in digital color for you. I will also provide an excellent photo of the PLAINVIEW foilborne with the USS PEGASUS foilborne in the background. — Karl Duff (kduff@ix.netcom.com)

PLAINVIEW‘s End…

[4 Jul 01] I was stationed aboard the USS PLAINVIEW for 2 years from 1971-1972. I saw a picture of her on the net, and it was a sad picture. I think about her often. Do you know what her final days were like? I still have the picture of her during her glory, prior to my coming aboard. Thank you for any info you may be able to supply. — John Bass (jebass2@yahoo.com)

Response…[4 Jul 01] PLAINVIEW was fully operational and conducted some tests for the HYPAM (Hydrofoil pressure acoustic magnetic) trials up to the day that she was “decommissioned” and towed over to Inactive Ships. We had all the struts removed, the forward ones because of the gearboxes and the aft one because of the HY-130 steel construction. The aft strut was to be tested in the structures lab at DTNSRDC, and the gearboxes were saved for possible use in another project. Other than the diesels, I don’t know what other equipment were stripped before putting the ship on the auction block. My understanding was the ship was bought to convert her to a fish cannery tender. We turned over all the drawings to a naval architect firm in Portland. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

[4 Jul 01] See the IHS webpage dedicated to AGEH-1. — Barney C. Black (Please use the BBS to reply)

PLAINVIEW Status Update…

[26 Dec 00] I stumbled across your forum last week, and if I can be any help let me know. I am the son of the current owner of the PLAINVIEW, which is located in Chinook, Washington. The boat is partially scrapped, but only the rear half of the house was removed, along with the exhaust cowlings and some of the deck gear. In my opinion it will never run under its own power again; getting it to that point would be an extreme labor of love. I think this would have been the case when my father purchased it, but even more so now. My father’s original intent for the vessel was salmon processing in the Bristol Bay Alaska fishery, but due to falling salmon prices that never happened. It was indeed in the movie “Short Circuit” as I saw mentioned in the forum. It was moored in Astoria, Oregon for many years until my father sold his boatbuilding shop there. It was then moved to its current location 2.4 miles East of the Astoria Bridge on the Washington side of the river. The scrapping project was begun in 1996 and lasted about two months. It was halted due to a drop in aluminum prices and has never been resumed. I am not sure of my father’s plans on this matter, he is busy with a new business venture for a new rudder design, so I believe it is on semi-permanent hold. Feel free to check out the website regarding his business “Deflector Marine Rudder” at www.deflectorrudder.com. He does not wish to be contacted regarding the PLAINVIEW however, so please address comments to me. Now it sits, serving mainly as a tourist attraction. We can’t seem to keep the “No Trespassing” signs up, and I personally had to chase many people off of it when I lived at home. In my opinion, if someone was really interested in making it useful again as a hydrofoil, it could be used as an educational exhibit vessel. It would not be too difficult to make it appear to be in running condition… much easier than actually making it ever run again. It definitely has drawing power, but I don’t know if even that is enough. I hope this answers questions you might have had. Please do not contact my father. — Gusty Stambaugh (ggstambaugh@iappliedsolutions.com); Applied Solutions, Inc. phone: 415.276.3100 [Gusty Stambaugh’s email no longer functions… IHS is attempting to find out a current email for him. – Webmaster 9 Sep 03]

PLAINVIEW Today…

[12 Aug 00] Photos by Sumi Arima: Click Here (Photo 1) and Here (Photo 2)

PLAINVIEW‘s Owner Identified…

[5 Mar 00, updated 26 Dec 00] On a short trip to the Oregon coast, I stopped to take pictures of PLAINVIEW, which is located about 2 miles east of the Astoria bridge on the Washington side of the Columbia River. When traveling east, you cannot see the ship since it will be behind you. Traveling west, it is in plain view across the slight inlet. As I was taking pictures, a fellow stopped and started talking about the owner and the abandoned plans. I subsequently made an e-mail inquiry, and have been given permission to let IHS know that the current owner’s son may be contacted about the vessel. His name is Gusty Stambaugh. His email address is ggstambaugh@iappliedsolutions.com [bad email address – Webmaster 9 Sep 03] and his telephone number is 415.276.3100. I would like to be copied to: if anyone makes e-mail contact with Gusty. Working for the Navy Department, I was the principle engineer following the design and construction of the PLAINVIEW. Upon construction, I was hired by David Taylor Naval Ship R&D Center to conduct the Navy’s Hydrofoil R&D program using the PLAINVIEW and HIGH POINT. Trials of various types were conducted which included ship system improvements; analysis of torpedo, missile, and gun firing; and confirming modeling/computer techniques based on full scale measurements. The PLAINVIEW was especially useful in learning structural calculation concerns, large hydraulic system design, and foil system loads. The PLAINVIEW also provided the research bed for plastic piping, fiberglass piping, stainless tubing with automated butt welder, and many other features now found on many new Navy ships. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Location of PLAINVIEW and HIGH POINT

[11 Sep 99] I’m just curious if you know the current locations of the ex-PLAINVIEW and ex-HIGH POINT. I’m driving (from Eugene, OR) to Bremerton this weekend, and I’d like to head out to Astoria to photograph them if they’re still in the area. –Joe Lewis (lewi233@ibm.net)

Response…The location of the HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW are discussed in various e-mails on the International Hydrofoil Society web pages. The HIGH POINT is moored at a private dock in Astoria. The PLAINVIEW is anchored on the North side of the Columbia about a mile upriver. Take the road on the Washington side of the Columbia from Astoria bridge. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

USS PLAINVIEW Final Resting Place

[8 Aug 99] I went on vacation near the mouth of the Columbia River (Washington side), and I ran into the remains of the USS PLAINVIEW. It appears that someone is cutting it up for salvage and I was wondering if someone has more info on this hydrofoil. — Ed Bynon (EBynon3780@aol.com)

Response…[8 Aug 99] Can you give me more details on the PLAINVIEW‘s present condition? Your inspection might have given you the indication that a salvage operation is taking place, whereas it might judt be the way it is stored. The foils and struts are removed, with only the foils sitting on the rear deck. Some openings were made to remove major machinery. The hull has what looks like cutouts where the struts pivoted. If you have any particular questions, feel free to ask. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Hydrofoils For Military and Ferry Use, Lessons Learned…

[28 Jan 99] I don’t know if there has been any discussion lately on the simplicity of using hydrofoils on the same routes that the smaller commuter catamarans are running on. These routes are mainly lakes, bays and sounds. There are very few open-ocean routes. Hydrofoils are more expensive to build due to the complexity of the things, something that the naval architects and engineers have built into the systems. [By contrast], the basic offshore aluminum crew boat is a reliable, lightweight, fast, and durable machine. No one has ever set a usable life on the things. There are 30+ years old boats out there running every day. It is a vessel that has evolved to carry out its mission. As far as I know, there are no hydrofoils operating in US waters. I believe in submerged hydrofoils with automatic control systems. Retractable foils have always been a joke. Mainly because the vessels with retractable foils were built to go anyplace. If a ferry vessel’s route normally has a maximum of 2′-3′ chop, there is no need for a 6′ gap between the keel and the water surface. If the water depth is sufficient over the entire ferry route there is no reason for retractable foils. The price of the boat can be reduced significantly. Short distance ferry routes don’t call for a Boeing 737 interior in the cabin. Commercial quality would do just fine. Get rid of the carpeting and plush seating. Concentrate on maintainability, speed and maneuverability. Too much high class, expensive, unproved machinery has been installed in the past that has given the American built hydrofoils a “bad rap.” PLAINVIEW and HIGH POINT are classic examples. I have often wondered if anybody ever sat down and figured out how much it cost per foilborne hour for the life of these vessels. Only a government could afford it. The PEGASUS class PHM was another boondoggle that cost the taxpayer a fortune to build, operate, and maintain. They were truly vessels without a mission. If some of that money could have been channeled into the private sector with an objective of building a hydrofoil passenger boat that would make money instead of spending money, we would have covered the world with US-built hydrofoils today. I hope you understand where I am coming from. Hydrofoils were my life for over ten years. I hate to see them die because of the bad reputation and the high cost of building one. Somebody will one day sit back and take a long look at where we have been and the knowledge that has been gained and come up with a viable, economical design. I hope so. I would hate to see everything that we have done in the past go down the tube. — Ken Plyler (Kfppfk@aol.com)

Response…[29 Jan 99] I read your comments and must reply in defense of HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW. When HIGH POINT was designed, there was limited knowledge of hydrofoils. It was originally built as an active patrol craft, but the Navy soon realized that it should be in a prototype category. With the original intent, many systems were designed light weight yet meeting the military specifications. In addition, since the concept was new, ABS and Coast Guard had inputs on safety considerations, etc. I recall considerable communications with the different groups which even included the sanitary features of the galley. As for the foils, struts, and foilborne propulsion, tests in the tow tank provided data which was not correlated to any actual data. The engineers used conservatism and thus had designs which later proved more than adequate. Meanwhile, with limited operations, (You should recall all the time sitting at the pier during your duty on the ship.) many operational problems were detected, and redesigned and rebuilt to provide in many cases a safe operation. Other things learned were when the foils and pods were strain gauged to determine load paths, revised fairings to try to reduce erosions, Although the foilborne transmission system was bathed in sea water frequently, it turned out that the gears were very reliable. Mod I changed the seal system which helped. Toward the end, no gearbox problems were noted for a period of about 3 years. As for the PLAINVIEW, the increased size required another set of design solutions that pushed into unknown territory. The hydraulic system required a couple thousand horsepower for the operation of the foils. Industrial hydraulic pumps did not have the continuous rating which proved to be a nemeses and subsequent redesign. Again, many areas of research and development in improving HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW and now used in other naval ships. In defense of the Jetfoil, I know that Boeing spent considerable time getting ABS and Coast Guard to accept alternatives in meeting their requirements. Some of the items that looks like frills in actually is based on ABS (American Bureau of Shipping) or Coast Guard requirements. For example, the seats need to be strong enough to withstand the g forces in crash landing. The cheapest was to use aircraft qualified seats. Coast Guard originally wanted a three man Pilot House crew. which Boeing successfully got Coast Guard to agree to two. For operations in other countries, Boeing had to certify that their requirements were also met. In summary, I hope I have changed your views on the earlier hydrofoils. The data collected has provided both engineering and operational information which are considered in new designs of all crafts, not just the hydrofoil ships. Meanwhile, with the experience, the regulatory agencies have changed their requirements. I’m sure the aluminum crew boats you talk of have benefited from the HIGH POINT and PLAINVIEW trials. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Proposed PLAINVIEW Historical Project

[1 Sep 97] I enter this post in the attempt to generate interest and open a discussion on the feasibility of something near and dear to me. My life has been greatly molded by the events that many of you gather to discuss and review — the creation and improvement of the hydrofoil. I personally have never been directly involved in your field, but my father has. Many of you know him, Alexander M. McClair. In a recent series of discussions, we were reflecting on the hydrofoil program, the pioneering spirit of the men involved, and the tight bonds that were formed among the teams that were involved in the creation of the AGEH, PCH and PHM. I often take great pride when I see commercial hydrofoils in use (not that Alec was the father of the hydrofoil), our family lived a lot of years revolving around the boats and the shipyards that made them. We were all present at the launches of these ships mentioned. It was a long time ago. Since then the use and application of these ships has grown. As it continues to grow, there is an element that is missing from the early days of progress: a living example of early hydrofoil design and manufacture. This has been the topic of many conversations between me and my father (as well as a large number of you). Which has prompted me to begin a journey. A journey to look into the feasibility and logistics of resurrecting a ship, The AGEH PLAINVIEW. I have an interest in this to retrieve the AGEH, and restore it to operational status. The purpose is to preserve an early version of today’s accomplishments. Those of you who were involved in the early days of hydrofoil development are keenly aware of the pioneering spirit of your peers. I feel that it is worth saving in the form of a demonstrable vessel, one that stood apart in its day. The AGEH was the fastest ship in its class, and the world’s largest aluminum hull vessel in its day. Now it sits on a beach (I think in Goose Bay, Oregon). A number of people and associations have gotten together to restore other vessels in different categories; I would like to do this for a vessel that helped to develop an industry. Its use would be as a floating/traveling museum. There are pages of details and opinions that don’t need to be displayed here, but I am interested in your responses. For those interested in a project like this, I would ask you to respond to me directly, at my email address below. For those of you that think this is futile, please feel free to respond as well. Thank you for taking the time to read this. I look forward to hearing from you. — Douglas M. McClair (doug.mcclair@bateswhite.com).

Response…[3 Sep 97, updated 26 Dec 00] You have an interesting proposition but I believe the PLAINVIEW is beyond restoration as an operational hydrofoil for the following reasons:

  1. The PLAINVIEW was scrapped by the Navy with all the major equipment removed, including the struts, diesels, gas turbines, outdrives, and Automatic Control System (ACS) electronics. After storing the main struts on the HYSTU barge for a period of time, when HYSTU was preparing to close, the gear boxes were removed from the struts and the struts were scrapped. The gear boxes were below decks of the barge when the barge was turned over to the Acoustic Range on Fox Island. I do not know where the gear boxes are today. I also don’t know what happened to the struts. The tail strut was to go for fatigue testing at Carderock, but I don’t know if any funds were made available to do so. The tail strut was of interest because of the HY130 steel construction. [Some additional scrapping was accomplished by the current owner: the rear half of the house was removed, along with the exhaust cowlings and some of the deck gear]
  2. The HUDAP (Hydrofoil Universal Digital Autopilot) sat on the barge in storage without preservation. I believe that when the barge was cleaned of HYSTU parts, the HUDAP was sent to scrap. We have used a IBM PC with D to A (Digital to Analog) and A to D converters to provide flight control on the HIGH POINT as a feasibility demonstration. With considerable amount of programming, PLAINVIEW could possibly have a couple of PCs configured to provide the ACS function.
  3. The retraction actuators were left on the ship. I do not know if they are still there. I also do not know the final results of the incidence control actuators. To replace these actuators alone would be cost prohibitive.
  4. The PLAINVIEW hull is now located on the Columbia River east of Astoria. I suspect the hull could be had for a price, but the cost of moving it and mooring it at some location will also add to the restoration expenses.

My regards to your dad. We had quite a time together when he worked for Lockheed Shipbuilding and Construction Company and I worked for Supervisor of Shipbuilding, Construction, and Repair, USN, Seattle on the PLAINVIEW project. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

2nd Response…

[18 Feb 98] I had the distinct pleasure of being the PLAINVIEW’s Chief Engineer during the period Feb 1976 through Feb 1980 when the vessel emerged from its epic overhaul and conversion and during which it finally lived up to its designers’ expectations. I briefly envisioned the PLAINVIEW again majestically rising above the waters of the Pacific Northwest and banking into a turn. Then reality set in quickly. I remembered the monumental effort it took to get the ship through that overhaul, to train the crew and to solve the new laundry list of technical, budget and schedule problems that seemed to confront us weekly. I remembered my last glimpses of the PLAINVIEW on the mud flats in Astoria, Oregon in a photo sent to me by Dwain Sorenson of Boeing and in the background of the movie “Short Circuit” filmed in Astoria in about 1985. I quickly concluded, “Not likely to ever see that again!” I am afraid I must agree with Sumi, even if the hardware and hardware could be found, I doubt the technical data still exists or could be recreated. Better to try something a bit more achievable. If I can answer any questions, please feel free to contact me. — Greg Bender, LCDR, USN (ret) (glbender@erols.com) or (gbender@noesis-inc.com)

 


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Hydrofoils: Military
 

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Archived Messages

Count,MessageID,category,ShortTitle,Message,Date,UserName,MsgPswd,Phone,Email,ParentMsgId

“1”,”949402″,”6″,”Re; Re; pch 1||949402″,”PCH-1 Iss the USS High Point built in 1963 first used by the Coast Gaurd”,”2005-12-18″,”Marty”,”nopswd”,” “,”nomadness56@msn.com”,”942906″

“2”,”944319″,”6″,”Re; pch 1||944319″,”HIGH POINT (PCH-1) is presently tied up in Astoria Oregon, where it has been for the last few years.

“,”2005-12-07″,”S. Arima”,”theboard”,” “,”SA_IHS_1980@verizon.net”,”942296″

“3”,”942907″,”6″,”Re; pch 1||942907″,”Which one is PCH-1? Peter Squicciarini”,”2005-12-05″,”Peter Squicciarini”,”nopswd”,” “,”pdsquicciarini@msn.com”,”942296″

“4”,”942906″,”6″,”Re; pch 1||942906″,”Which one is PCH-1? Peter Squicciarini”,”2005-12-05″,”Peter Squicciarini”,”nopswd”,” “,”pdsquicciarini@msn.com”,”942296″

“5”,”942296″,”6″,” pch 1||942296″,” Wheres PCH-1 Now?”,”2005-12-04″,”Marty”,”nopswd”,” “,”nomadness56@msn.com”,”6″

“6”,”888235″,”6″,”Re; lycoming avco LVHX1||888235″,”Tom, you would likely find a ready market for it on eBay; however before listing it there, you should be prepared for the possibility that it is US Government property that was never properly surplused and disposed of. You may get a protest to eBay if someone thinks that is the case and wants to recover it for a government agency or museum. I can’t guess what the possibility of that happening is. It depends on who sees the listing. It wouldn’t hurt to go back to the house where you bought it during the garage sale and ask where it came from. This projects dates back quite a few years, so it is possible that the person who had it has died.”,”2005-09-04″,”Barney C Black”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”886399”

“7”,”886399″,”6″,”lycoming avco LVHX1||886399″,”I found at a garage sale a model with many moving parts of the LVHX1-1 mounted on a plat form board. Painted on the side is USMC 1 and 7321175 Plate on board says United States Marine Corps LVH X1 Bureau of Ships Lycoming Division,Avco Corporation Can take pics,and would like to sell it.”,”2005-08-31″,”Tom”,”nopswd”,” “,”tlambie@swfla.rr.com”,”6″

“8”,”886398″,”6″,”lycoming avco LVHX1||886398″,”I found at a garage sale a model with many moving parts of the LVHX1-1 mounted on a plat form board. Painted on the side is USMC 1 and 7321175 Plate on board says United States Marine Corps LVH X1 Bureau of Ships Lycoming Division,Avco Corporation Can take pics,and would like to sell it.”,”2005-08-31″,”Tom”,”nopswd”,” “,”tlambie@swfla.rr.com”,”6″

“9”,”882078″,”6″,”Re; Expanding Our Battle Space||882078″,”Peter. This is my second request for your telephone number. I do not want to chat with you on the website.

My name is Gerry Levine. I’m located near Boca Raton Florida. My phone number is 561 734-0192.

Please call me.”,”2005-08-23″,”Gerry Levine”,”nopswd”,” “,”gerrymega@adelphia.net”,”881219″

“10”,”881219″,”6″,”Expanding Our Battle Space||881219″,”I saw a terrific 15 minutes of hydrofoil development segment on History
Channel program “Mail Call”. That’s the show where the Gunny Sergeant
takes letters for interesting questions and then broadcasts the spots. Now
I know that most of you probably have seen this footage. But it was well
done in a positive and interesting spotlight. Great footage of PEGASUS (my
PHM experience) which still brought memories of excitement (tears too)!
Other PHMs footage also. Developmental hydrofoils included. My point of
sharing this with you is NOT hydrofoil technology (you guys invented and
proved it!) but the point is to pass along that the hydrofoil is not
forgotten and is now being shown to this new generation. The final
interview/quote was that as things go around and around, hydrofoils will be
back as the latest “new” idea (I said that before). Due and thanks to many
of you. Legacy. Those who said you couldn’t do it were shown you could
(and did!) accomplish it. Keep watching! How about THIS “creative” idea?
The high-speed catamaran is being embraced lately. My “warfare view” would be
to equip that CAT with a number of fast-fast-fast hydrofoil “vehicles”,
either manned (like ASW LAMPS HELO) or unmanned with artificial
intelligence, to act like multiple “stinger-bees” deployed from the CAT.
Force “multiplier”. More battle space covered, more situational awareness,
more intell, huge stay time, all weather, sensor platform (no weapons needed
as long range weapons delivered by CAT/other forces), and more benefits.
Think about it. A “hydrofoil Predator” both inshore (LCS?) and offshore.
Maybe riverine too?. Crazy? OK–would any of you like to send me their
(creative) thoughts, both technical and tactical?? If those inputs were
well thought out and articulated, I might (repeat “might”) draft up a short
article for NAVAL INSTITUTE /other submissions and perhaps their
publication. NO MATH FORMULAS! NO CURVES! “Realm of the possible
thinking ONLY”! Don’t want to hear about lift, laminar flow, how big it
can be made–but rather how “small” it can be made! If any takers and
interest, then Over To You Guys. Exchange of practical ideas and
applications is the only way-ahead, as I see it. Despite USN fixation on
mega-Defense Contractors “dinosaur solutions”, I think the time could be
good to get a think-piece in front of the folks who have been ordered to
think (wow, what a concept!). I know ADM Mike Mullen whom I’m somewhat
close to, would be interested to see this. Applications with USCG/HLS could
be foreseable despite their embalming circa 1939, pre-nuclear age. Q.E.D.
Cheers to ALL,

Peter Squicciarini”,”2005-08-22″,”Peter D. Squicciarini”,”nopswd”,” “,”pdsquicciarini@msn.com”,”6″

“11”,”856778″,”6″,”Re; Congratulations on IHS Progress||856778″,”We need to talk. I’m a IHS member, my patents are starting to issue, and I’m almost ready to start cutting metal. My name is Gerry Levine, living in west Palm Beach Florida. Can you call me late Thursday afternoon. Your name is familiar, but I have not been reading BB messages in a long time. Do you know William O’Neill? He is somehat familiar with my work, however he is covered by an NDA.

561 628 5940 or give me your number and I’ll contact you.

levinega@galusmarine.com”,”2005-07-06″,”Gerry Levine”,”nopswd”,” “,”gerrymega@adelphia.net”,”0″

“12”,”856036″,”6″,”Congratulations on IHS Progress||856036″,”All IHS Board Members and Hydrofoil friends,

I want to personally congratulate each and every one of you. Your interest and willingness, not often found in a volunteer group, keeps hydrofoils alive. And hydrofoils should be kept alive. All of us has seen (and I’m a relative newcomer from the ’80s”the hydrofoil go around and around in the advanced technologies for the sea. Well, what with the rise of more and more high performance technologies now being built to go to sea for lots of purposes, I believe hydrofoils are about due–and very soon, at that. Navies want a down and dirty “Street Fighter”. Well, the Cats are bumble bees compared to the “killer bees” of hydrofoils. Give it a bit more time, and especially IHS keepers of the faith, and we’ll all see hydrofoils back again as a “great idea” by the “Establishment”—“invented here” paradigm. Stand by folks! Cheers to all, Peter Squicciarini. (JOHN–PLEASE pass this on to the website for all to see–THX, Peter)”,”2005-07-05″,”Peter Squicciarini”,”nopswd”,” “,”whitewn@speakeasy.net”,”0″

“13”,”844511″,”6″,”Re; Lines/Plans for PHM Pegasus?||844511″,”You should visit http://www.foils.org/modelrc.htm and read the historical correspondence on PHM models that is archived there. Also see http://www.foils.org/models.htm . Here are some excerpts:

“The Mariners’ Museum’s Scale Ship Model Competition and Exhibition 2000,” Scale Ship Modeler (ISSN 1066-0275), Nov/Dec 2000 (Vol. 23, No. 5), pp. 36-37, 62. Features a 1:48 scale model of PHM-1 USS PEGASUS. Modeler Dean Leary of Statesville NC was awarded the Gold Medal under the Division I (Scratchbuilt) Class B (Powered Ships) category. “The Scale Ship Model Competition and Exhibition 2000 ran from June 17 until October 28, 2000. During these dates, visitors were able to see the top ship models in the world and participate in various activities associated with the exhibition on the opening weekend. For more information about the competition and exhibition, call The Mariners’ Museum at (757) 596-222 or (800) 596-2222, or write to: The Mariners’ Museum, 100 Museum Drive, Newport, VA 23606, or visit their Web site: www.mariner.org”

Marine Modeling Monthly, March 1991, contains photos and drawings of the PHM Class; purpose of the article is to provide details to modellers of the PHM Class.

We have a pretty good set of plans from “Floating Drydock” now. Floating Drydock is a Plan service company. They now have a couple different scale plan drawings and sets of PHMs: Hull, faired lines and stations USS PEGASUS Builders plans outboard profile and plan view, and deckhouse details, model builders set showing main deck, outboard profile bridge superstructure deck, platforms, some hull sections, general arrangements, and longitudinal cross section

White Ensign Models (WEM) offers a new 1:350 scale model kit for PHM 1 USS PEGASUS, and it’s a beauty. Click Here for details/photo. The company ships orders worldwide. Felix Bustelo has created a webpage devoted to this model with photos, hints, and reviewer comments. That page is at http://warship.simplenet.com/wem_pegasus.htm. [regrettably, Felix Bustelo’s site seems to have disappeared from the web. – Editor] Thanks to Steve Novell (steve.novell@av.com) for bringing this item to our attention. He notes that “The model thing is close enough that you can make just minor adjustments (adding H bits to the main deck, relocating the radar to the mast etc.)””,”2005-06-11″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,” “,”0”

“14”,”843267″,”6″,”Re; Lines/Plans for PHM Pegasus?||843267″,”Boeing Aircraft of Seattle, Washington designed the PEGASUS Class PHMs.
Jerry Grasmick
MK 75 Gun System Engineer”,”2005-06-09″,”Jerry R. Grasmick, E.E.”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”0”

“15”,”842578″,”6″,”Lines/Plans for PHM Pegasus?||842578″,”Dear Sirs,

I have recently built the Italian Hydrofoil Sparviero as none working
modell in 1/72nd. (see picture following).

(See attached file: Sparviero_frontsideview2.jpg)

I´d like to build next the PHM Pegasus also as none working display modell
scale 1/72nd.

Do you know where to get accurate plans / drawings including line drawings
of the hull?

Best regards

Markus Schott
Germany”,”2005-06-08″,”Markus Schott”,”nopswd”,” “,”Markus.Schott@LBBW.de”,”0″

“16”,”792473″,”6″,”TUCUMCARI||792473″,”Hello,

For the past 26 years I have served as a project supervisor creating museum exhibits in honor of U.S. vets and those of our allies. Some of the venues I have done work for include the USS Intrepid Sea Air Space Museum and the Museum of Polish Military Heritage in America, both in New York City. Load my name Mike Dobrzelecki into a Google Search Engine and you’ll see examples of some of my work on two continents over the years.

I saw your name & email on the IHS website and hope you can provide some help on a research project concerning the Tucumcari PGH-2.

I built the old Aurora kit when it first came out in the late 1960’s early 1970’s (?) and not too long ago picked up a derelict unpainted damaged built-up, as well as a pristine complete kit still in the original box. I even still have some parts from my original build model.

My intent is to build one ‘flying’ and one in the water with its struts and foils folded up and possibly write a good article on the Tucumcari.

I have everything available on the internet for this fascinating hydrofoil, as well as, the old Sea Clasics issue with the Tucumcari on the cover. Recently, I obtained a copy of the History Channel Mail Call episode with the world’s most famous D.I. narrating exquisite video of the this fast-fighting boat in action – great footage, BTW. I have even manage to track down some of its crew for personal interviews. Most frustratingly, the crew I talked to so far all stated that their photos went missing during moves over the years.

I am looking for more photos including details of the interior, the exterior fit on the cockpit/bridge and upper surface of the hull and an answer to what’s in the large opening aft of the .50 cals and masts/antennae. I would also like to track down some more crew and any other books or naval history magazine articles on the the Tucumcari. Any leads would be appreciated.

Mike Dobrzelecki
3040 Clayton Street
Easton PA 18045
“,”2005-03-07”,”Mike Dobrzelecki “,”members”,” “,”Michael_Dobrzelecki@fwc.com”,”0″

“17”,”779659″,”6″,”Re: Aries project?||779659″,”I suggest you contact Eliot James directly via the website at http://www.ussaries.org/ for an answer. I don’t think he monitors this BBS, and so would not see your question. If you find out anything, please come back and post it so the rest of us can have the update!”,”2005-02-10″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,”bcblack@erols.com”,”0″

“18”,”776047″,”6″,”Aries project?||776047″,”Is the Aries project going forward? The last update I can find was Aug 03. If not is there anything we can do to help?”,”2005-02-04″,”Chuck Shannon”,”nopswd”,” “,”ChuckE68@aol.com”,”0″

“19”,”770610″,”6″,”Refueling PEGASUS Pictures- 20 March 78||770610″,”Pete

Attached as a Adobe pdf file are the PHM Pegasus refueling at sea pictures I mentioned from my first post.

Jill Baron”,”2005-01-25″,” Jim Baron”,”foilsadm”,” “,” “,”0”

“20”,”770511″,”6″,”vs8 pictures||770511″,”I am looking for any pictures of the vs8 particularly on the prop rudder area – I can not contact challenge publications to see if they had an old copy of the scale modeler magazine from july 82 which showed photos of the 32nd parallel kit”,”2005-01-25″,”David Short”,”nopswd”,” “,”davidsh@internode.on.net”,”0″

“21”,”770150″,”6″,”Re: PHM Pegasus Refueling Pics 20 Mar 78||770150″,”Any possible way to send me Pegasus pix refueling as simple attachment? Cheers, Peter Squicciarini (p.s.>>>the bbs@foils.com is superb!)”,”2005-01-25″,”pdsquicciarini@msn.com”,”nopswd”,” “,”Pete Squicciarini”,”0″

“22”,”769886″,”6″,”PHM Pegasus Refueling Pics 20 Mar 78||769886″,” I was onboard USS OGDEN from 1978-1980.

Looking in my Westpac 78 Cruisebook – page 6 is titled “20 March – Refueling PEGASUS.”
I remember the day well. Was the strangest looking boat I ever saw!

Attached is the page from the 1978 cruisebook showing the refuleing operations.

Thanks – Jim. Happy to scan and send – Jim Baron (JOCS(SW), USN Ret.)

“,”2005-01-24″,” Jim Baron”,”members”,” “,” “,”0”

“23”,”746897″,”6″,”HMCS Brasd’or||746897″,”Thanks for the interesting webpage. Our Powers to be are making me laugh right now but cutting our forces down again even further and complaining of costs to outfit our fight forces with descent equipment. I suggested to them that they reconsider this design and get rid of the destroyers that require a staff of 250+. This little baby with today’s technology would be awesome for coastal patrols, even on the great lakes and for rescue.

Say what you want, I agree with your article, just like the Avro Arrow, that ship will still out do anything around today…. Thanks again.”,”2004-12-03″,”Walter Argent Jr.”,”nopswd”,” “,”wargent@msn.com”,”0″

“24”,”706035″,”6″,”Re: EX PLAINVIEW CREWMEMBER||706035″,”Did not know if you saw this…

http://www.foils.org/plainvw.htm”,”2004-09-09″,”Dan Schmidt”,”nopswd”,” “,”gse2schmidt@hotmail.com”,”0″

“25”,”703662″,”6″,”EX PLAINVIEW CREWMEMBER||703662″,”Just happened to stumble across this site trying to explain a hydrofoil to a co-worker. Most of the messages are extremely old but I do recognize several names.—-o to Skipper Hudson, Mr Bender and Mick and Sumi. I was the last Ship’s Yeoman of the mighty Plainview and one of the last to walk ashore. Seeing how she ended up was sad and I’m sure by now that is has been scrapped. One thing I will always remember that I was able to numerous things outside my rating, i.e. radar, plotting, and taking those darn soundings at 2 in the morning. YNCM(SW) Dennis Clark, USN, RET”,”2004-09-02″,”Dennis Clark”,”guest”,” “,”denbon@honeywell.com”,”0″

 

 

Archive; USN PHM Hydrofoil Missile Ships

Click below to Open.

http://www.foils.org/restore.htm
[Date/Time=03-24-2002 – 1:51 AM]

Name:webmaster@foils.org [Msgid=237503]
Archive; Sources of US Navy Photos
Click below to Open

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq22-1.htm
[Date/Time=03-24-2002 – 4:23 PM]

Name:webmaster@foils.org [Msgid=237702]
PHM Interior Paint Color

ViewThread

      • I have read the foils.org web site with great interest and have seen the responses that ET1 Desendi (USS Aquilla) was saying about the interior color of the Aries. Being stationed aboard her and being the lowest ranking member of the Combat Systems department (FC2) I did my fair share of painting. The interior color of the Aries, at decommissioning, was a color that Cmdr. Nichols had the Boats especially mix up. Boats called it Ticonderoga grey. It was white with just a tinge of Haze Grey mixed in. It wasn’t a bad color actually. The mess deck had the Rams Head. I don’t recall what happened to it after we decommissioned. I have some pictures of the Aries that might be of some help if you have specific questions. I also have some pictures of the running aground in Corpus Christie.

[Date/Time=05-04-2002 – 8:16 AM]

Name:Victor (Flo) Nightingale Victor_Nightingale@gbophb.org, [Msgid=255273]
PHM Interior Paint Color

      • Victor
      • Thanks for your input to the PHM history.
      • We would love to acquire any photos or other information you have that we can add to our PHM files, newsletter and our Photo Albums.
      • Bill White

[Date/Time=05-04-2002 – 9:11 PM]

Name:Bill White Asst Webmaster whitewn@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=255475]
Veteran of PHM-3 and HIGH POINT

ViewThread

      • I am a Plank Owner on the

USS TAURUS

      • (PHM-3). I worked in the engineering department a GSM2. I also worked on the

USS HIGHPOINT

      • (PCH-1) — Henry Jakobson GSCS(SW)Ret

[Date/Time=06-02-2002 – 2:14 PM]

Name:Henry Jakobson jakobson@bellsouth.net, [Msgid=266590]
Veteran of PHM-3 and HIGH POINT

      • Have you visited the foils.org/restore.htm part of the site? PHM-5 lives on PHM-3,4,6 hang in the balance…

[Date/Time=06-03-2002 – 10:36 PM]

Name:Dan Schmidt GSE2Schmidt@hotmail.com, [Msgid=267169]
Former Hydrofoiler

      • I just found this website so I haven’t had the opportunity to brouse through all of it. I’m pleased to see there are other “hydrofoil” sailors out there that were as proud to serve as I was. I had the pleasure of being one of the last crewmembers of the Boeing built Tucumcari PGH-2 which was assigned to the Little Creek Naval Amphibias base in Norfolk, VA. (We found out how hard a coral reef can be at 40 knots when operating down near Puerto Rico.) I was then assigned to be a member of the first crew of Pegasus PHM-1 and had the pleasure of being there to see it launched at the Boeing Plant in Renton, WA. What great duty! Thanks for the memories!!

[Date/Time=06-14-2002 – 3:37 PM]

Name:Fred Wieber fwieber@ionia-mi.net, [Msgid=271733]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

ViewThread

      • Need investors to back a project to design, build and present to the USN Special Warfare Group as an Unsolicited Proposal for a hydrofoil vessel that could deliver a Seal Team to the battle without breaking their bones or getting them deathly ill. Just attended the MACC, (Multi Agency Craft Conference at Little Creek. The timing is right. There were fast boats presented. None could perform their mission in anything other than a flat, calm sea. I am available to contribute my 10 years of hydrofoil experience through my company, American Marine Consultants, LLC
      • Ken Plyler, ENCM USN Ret.

[Date/Time=06-20-2002 – 7:32 PM]

Name:Kenneth F. Plyler kfppfk@aol.com, [Msgid=273911]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • MASTER CHIEF,
      • WASN’T THE WHOLE REASON BEHIND THE “PC” CLASS PROGRAM, LITTORAL WATERS BATTLE AND SEAL TEAM DELIVERY ?
      • THE PHM COULD DELIVER A SEAL TEAM IN LITTORALS AND IN ANY SEA STATE, OH, BUT THEY WERE TOO EXPENSIVE.
      • ROB DeSENDI, USS AQUILA PHM-4

[Date/Time=07-15-2002 – 12:31 PM]

Name:ROB DESENDI rdesendi@nsmayport.spear.navy.mil, [Msgid=282611]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • Master Chief,
      • I agree with Rob. I was onboard USS Gemini PHM-6. We were fast on the foils and did some test with SEAL Teams. The problems were encountered because we had to go “hullborne” vice “foilborne” to insert the teams. When hullborne, the seas rocked us around pretty good. Not much different than the current PC’s.

[Date/Time=07-15-2002 – 1:03 PM]

Name:ITC(SW) Rich Powell rpowe, [Msgid=282632]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • Master Chief,
      • I agree with Rob. I was onboard USS Gemini PHM-6. We were fast on the foils and did some test with SEAL Teams. The problems were encountered because we had to go “hullborne” vice “foilborne” to insert the teams. When hullborne, the seas rocked us around pretty good. Not much different than the current PC’s.

[Date/Time=07-15-2002 – 1:04 PM]

Name:ITC(SW) Rich Powell rpowe, [Msgid=282634]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • My two cents. I was a Naval Architect at the David Taylor Model Basin supporting the PHMS back in those days and my memory matches yours exactly.
      • A few years later in the mid 80s, I had the good fortune along with Cdr Dave Patch to work with the French Navy in Toulon Fr.
      • They showed us a Catamaran Hydrofoil design that they had experimented with that would be perfect for todays missions. The catamaran hull shape gave twice the volume inside as the PHMs on an equivalent length hull. This Catamaran Hydrofoil had a nice wide stern for carrying and launching RIBS etc. In addition, the craft was much more stable hullborne do to the wide beam and also could do 20+ kts hullborne with the foils up. The Foils were mounted in the four catamaran corners at the bow and stern. They could be raised and lowered vertically to dramatically reduce hullborne draft. I don’t remember if the height could be changed while they were foilborne for shallow water ops. With todays sophisticated control systems such a four foil system could be used while hullborne to reduce pitch and roll motions as well as when foilborne.
      • Other than possibly a Surface Effect Craft, nothing comes close in terms of performance (Speed, Maneuverability and Sea state) flexibility, Deck area and internal volume based on all my knowledge.
      • Most all the competion such as long slender hulls, Trimarans, Catamarans and other more exotic variants fail in one or the other military attributes. The problem is that none of the promotors ever let a one on one comparative analysis occur.
      • Even the US Navy’s own comparisons over the years have been no better. Though often the reason is a lack of knowledge rather than any particular bias of the participants. For an example, I can remember for years trying to convince people that just because the PHM was designed for under 10 kt hullborne on Diesels that there was no physical reason that said it had to be a true limitaion for all future Hydrofoils. And yet to this today a lot of people think that 20 kts is a very inefficient Hydrofoil speed. And this automatically eliminates them from consideration, since the Navy often cruises at that speed.
      • Anyway, Rob Best of luck. Wish I had the $ to help.
      • Bill White

[Date/Time=07-15-2002 – 2:24 PM]

Name:Bill White whitewn@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=282664]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • I think the issue would be the transition and noise factor, we were quiet till we got near someone with the FB engine but need an easy trans from H/b to F/b and a way to easily retract to give low draft!

[Date/Time=07-16-2002 – 6:14 PM]

Name:Mike Boyle EN1 USS Aquila mdboyle2@cox.net, [Msgid=283203]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • Mike
      • You make two good points.
      • We tried underwater exhausts, for awhile. They worked, but reduced engine life due to increased back pressure.
      • Bill White

[Date/Time=07-16-2002 – 7:01 PM]

Name:Bill White whitewn@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=283226]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • I had no experience with the PHM. I do rememer the original PHM-2. It was never built. When the FRG, (Federal Republic of Germany). pulled out of the program, PHM-2 was cancelled and the whole program was put on the back burner. Our PHM fleet consisted of Pegasus PHM-1. The pile of aluminum that was to be PHM-2 was sold for scrap, as I remember.

[Date/Time=07-17-2002 – 7:19 AM]

Name:Ken Plyler kfppfk@aol.com, [Msgid=283386]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • Actually, Ken, PHM-2 was eventually completed, delivering in about 1983, as I recall. We also built PHM-3,-4,-5 and -6 and operated the six ships out of Key West until their decommissioning in 1993.
      • PHM-2 was actually the last PHM to deliver. For details on that strange arrangement and a summary of the whole six-ship program check out my article on the history of the PHM program on the main IHS website, at

http://www.foils.org/phmhist.pdf

      • .
      • You are right in saying that PHM-2’s construction was back-burnered for a while. But the “pile of aluminum that was to be PHM-2” was not sold for scrap. It was actually used (quietly) as a spare parts locker for PHM-1 until construction started up on PHM-2 again.
      • All the best,
      • George

[Date/Time=07-17-2002 – 10:55 AM]

Name:George Jenkins Georgejj@aol.com, [Msgid=283458]
High Speed Hydrofoil Assault Craft

      • George, it appears that you have done your homework. Anyone interested in the real PHM story should, by all means, read your PHM History. WOW! I was glued to the article. Thanks.
      • Ken Plyler

[Date/Time=07-17-2002 – 12:26 PM]

Name:Ken Plyler kfppfk@aol.com, [Msgid=283501]

      • Thank you, Ken — glad you enjoyed the article. Good luck on your High Speed Assault Craft —
      • George

[Date/Time=07-17-2002 – 12:55 PM]

Name:George Jenkins Georgejj@aol.com, [Msgid=283517]
HIGH POINT Update

ViewThread

      • I just found out the web site is down or gone I’ll figure that out. I’ve been working on the electrical systems, what a mess, as I have
      • no intention of replacing the military electronics or the monitoring systems for test purposes that were originally on board. Just figuring out what is needed and what is not is a pretty good size job. Most of my time hasn’t been spent working on the boat; due to other projects so my time is very thin right now. I’ll see what I
      • can do to get the web site located or back up or whatever is wrong there and let you know.

[Date/Time=08-25-2002 – 7:35 PM]

Name:Bob Phillips rpstander@bigplanet.com, [Msgid=300986]
HIGH POINT Update

      • Let me know if I can assist you with your website. I have worked with Mr. Barney Black.
      • Regards.
      • Vladimir Algin

[Date/Time=08-26-2002 – 3:27 AM]

Name:Vladimir Algin valgin@ltsu.net, [Msgid=301121]
Vietnam LPH-5 Info Needed

      • Do you know anything about the USS Princeton LPH-5 in the area of VietNam 1961-62-63-64? Please contact me…

[Date/Time=09-07-2002 – 6:31 AM]

Name:Mike Mikemarine4@aol.com, [Msgid=306491]
Tested HIGH POCKETS

      • I was on the crew that tested

HIGH POCKETS

      • at Little Creek in the 1950s. It was pretty basic at that time and had to be adjusted by hand-cranking a series of small wheels that were mounted across the cockpit. It was fast but not too stable. I can’t remember who was on the crew with me, but the ride was exciting. I remember we took a trip to Patuxent Naval Air sta. on the 63 ft. Avr’s and shortly thereafter

HIGH POCKETS

      • arrived at our base at Little Creek. We took her out in the bay just outside the jetty and opened her up. I don’t think I ever envisioned going that fast over water? “wow” she was fast! We hit a paper bag, and the foil on the starboard side got out of trim. The boat dug in and popped back like a cork. We got thrown around but no injuries, so we continued the run. It was a blast. I believe we had it on operations at Moorhead City also, although I don’t remember just how it was used there. This picture was included in an article I wrote for the Blast Magazine, October 2001 edition.


[Date/Time=09-14-2002 – 8:22 PM]

Name:Jake McAndrew PLIERS2222@aol.com, [Msgid=309794]
Pictures if you need them

ViewThread

      • Hello, this is GSCS Brian Markey, I was stationed on USS GEMINI (PHM-6) from 89-92. I have pictures of the foils with the Coast Guard and the LCAC’s. I remember those crafts well. They did a hell of a job and it was a shame that they were retired. If you need any information on the SSPU’s or the LM 2500, let me know.

[Date/Time=11-07-2002 – 7:34 PM]

Name:Brian Markey bfm@carney.navy.mil, [Msgid=335073]
Pictures if you need them

      • Senior,
      • I am in the process of putting together a short presentation on PHMs for the American Society of Naval Engineers. I would very much like to include some of your pictures of PHMs with the USCG, if they can be sent to me electronically. My email address is

georgejj@aol.com

      • .
      • Thanks!
      • George Jenkins

[Date/Time=11-08-2002 – 9:37 AM]

Name:George Jenkins georgejj@aol.com, [Msgid=335242]
Pictures if you need them

      • Senior,
      • I am in the process of putting together a short presentation on PHMs for the American Society of Naval Engineers. I would very much like to include some of your pictures of PHMs with the USCG, if they can be sent to me electronically. My email address is

georgejj@aol.com

      • .
      • Thanks!
      • George Jenkins

[Date/Time=11-08-2002 – 9:37 AM]

Name:George Jenkins georgejj@aol.com, [Msgid=335243]
Pictures if you need them

      • Found an GE YTF-39(experimental TF-39) on E-Bay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1872694883

      • Might be possibility for engine on PHM5 restoration. Take a look at the pictures. Especially the oil system and fuel manifold. Tell me what you think.

[Date/Time=11-23-2002 – 10:48 AM]

Name:Dan Schmidt gse2schmidt@hotmail.com, [Msgid=342359]
Attached File  “i-4_B_L~jpg.zip” – size 72081   Click Here To Download
Replacement GTE for PHM-5

      • Thanks, Dan, I will pass this on to Eliot James to make sure they see it immediately for PHM-5

[Date/Time=11-24-2002 – 8:43 AM]

Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=342701]
USS Plainview (AGEH-1)

ViewThread

      • re: USS Plainview (AGEH-1) in the mid to late 1970’s
      • Wondering if anyone knows what ever happened to:
      • (1) Sib Lebeau, the Puget Sound Naval Shipyard Pipefitter Foreman assigned to assist HYSTU and the Plainview during the overhaul / conversion that finally fixed the hydraulic system problems?
      • (2) MS1 John DeRosa the Plainview’s cook?

[Date/Time=11-26-2002 – 7:35 AM]

Name:Greg Bender glbender@erols.com, [Msgid=343547]
USS Plainview (AGEH-1)

      • Hi Greg,
      • Sib lost his eye sight and retired from PSNS. He died a few years after retirement.
      • Sumi

[Date/Time=11-27-2002 – 3:38 PM]

Name:S. Arima arimas1@juno.com, [Msgid=344267]
Pictures if you need them

      • Dan,
      • —-o this is GSCS Brian Markey, I was on the USS GEMIN PHM 6 for 3 years. I am presently on the USS Carney DDG 64. The engine that you found looks fine. The egg oil system looks about right but it was mounted on the opposite side on the module wall. They might need more piping to accomodate this as an install. The fuel manifold looks fine from what I can tell in the picture.
      • Respectfully,
      • GSCS Brian Markey

[Date/Time=12-02-2002 – 3:25 PM]

Name:Brian Markey bfm@carney.navy.mil, [Msgid=345791]
HIGH POINT or HIGHPOINT

ViewThread

      • Is the correct name of PCH-1

HIGH POINT

      • (two words) or

HIGHPOINT

      • (one word)? The IHS newsletter is not consistent on this.

[Date/Time=12-30-2002 – 8:20 AM]

Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=356665]
Re; HIGH POINT or HIGHPOINT

      • High Point (PCH-1) is named for the city of High Point North Carolina and is two words. I retired from High Point in 1965 and recently donaterd to the city my plaque pictures etc. Dale K. Beresford, QMc, USN (ret)

[Date/Time=12-31-2002 – 2:57 PM]

Name:Dale Beresford dalkar1@msn.com, [Msgid=357211]
PEGASUS Crew During Development

ViewThread

      • I was wondering if you have or know someone who could provide me a crew list for the PHM-1 PEGASUS. My father Robert Sobota was a crew member during testing and development. Any information would help.

[Date/Time=01-29-2003 – 9:40 PM]

Name:Jamie E. Sobota Jamie.Sobota@edwards.af.mil, [Msgid=369328]
Re; PEGASUS Crew During Development

      • You should take a look at the correspondence on our page at

http://www.foils.org/restore.htm

      • and see if there are any individuals there that you could contact directly for information based on what they said in their posting. Also, you might be interested in the following unfortunate notice from our announcements page:
      • [22 Dec 02] It is with regret that IHS reports the death of CDR Erich H. Ashburn, USN [Ret]. CDR Ashburn was OINC of PEGASUS throughout the Operational Evaluation (OPEVAL) process.

[Date/Time=01-29-2003 – 9:42 PM]

Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=369330]
Want a ride on Hydrofoil

      • I have been studying HYDROFOIL designs, and think I have “nailed” it. Now need to ride on someone’s craft. I live in South Florida but am willing to go anywhere in NA for an extended ride. Any one have an operating Hydrofoil Boat who can accomodate my request?

[Date/Time=06-03-2003 – 7:31 AM]

Name:Gerry Levine gerrymega@adelphia.net, [Msgid=446221]
Model of the VS-8( schell-1 )

      • New compamy with RC model of the Schell-1 hydrofoil!!
      • Als know as the VS-8!!
      • Look at:

http://www.harhaus.de/neuheiten2003.htm

      • Good luck modelers!!

[Date/Time=06-04-2003 – 6:16 AM]

Name:Capt M van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=446821]
Attached File  “schell05~jpg.zip” – size 50254   Click Here To Download
USS Pegasus

      • Goto

www.classmates.com

      • , you will find anumber of the old gang from various years listed under USS Pegasus

[Date/Time=06-16-2003 – 4:35 AM]

Name:steve novell (Jolly-OS1, PHM1) sjnovell@mindspring.com, [Msgid=453349]
PHMRON 2 Veterans

      • This July 30th will be the 10th anniversary of the PHM squadron decommissioning. I wish to extend all best wishes to our shipmates, the veterans of the PHM crews, MLSG and PHM Squadron 2 staff. I look forward to raising a glass (splice the main brace)at Turtle Krawls in Key West on this date, to you all.

[Date/Time=06-16-2003 – 4:59 AM]

Name:steve novell (Jolly-OS1, PHM1) sjnovell@mindspring.com, [Msgid=453351]
Titan Aluminum X-Craft Experiment

ViewThread

      • According to a July 11, 2003 article in

Financial Times Limited

      • , which was sent in by IHS member Nat Kobitz, Titan Corp is the US Navy’s Office of Naval Research (ONR) prime contractor in a USD 59.9m project to produce an all aluminum, 73 m catamaran X-Craft as a test platform. The vessel will be constructed by Nichols Brothers Boat Builders of Washington state. According to the article, the X-Craft will be “capable of making 50 knots at its full 1,100-ton displacement” and “will be capable of carrying its own weight in payload.” The article goes on to state that “The design philosophy is based on the requirement to carry heavy modular payloads,” and fuel for “a range of 4,000 nautical miles.”

[Date/Time=07-25-2003 – 7:28 PM]

Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=476274]
Re; Titan Aluminum X-Craft Experiment

      • I hope there is no expectation within ONR that the 50 knots speed AND
      • 4000 nautical mile range will be achieved at the same time, not unless
      • the payload is Helium!?

[Date/Time=07-25-2003 – 7:30 PM]

Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=476278]
Re; Titan Aluminum X-Craft Experiment

      • I’m fairly certain that the 4,000 n miles is at 20 knots or less. The only way you can make the 4,000 miles at about 30 knots in a small ship with a 10 to 20% payload, is with HYSWAS (esecially in any kind of a sea state). I believe MAPC’s 2200 ton HYSWAS design shows this.

[Date/Time=07-25-2003 – 7:35 PM]

Name:John Meyer editor@foils.org, [Msgid=476280]
Re; Titan Aluminum X-Craft Experiment

ViewThread

      • The HIGH L/B SES we developed after the 3Kses program in the mid 1980s (such as the Medium Dispacement Combatant MDC) came very close to this. I have studies and Model tests getting 4000 nm at 1100lt FLD at an average speed of 50 kts with two LM2500 GT or four Allison 571 GTs. This design was equipped for full ASW with LAMPS helos with hangar and Sonar system as well as Harpoon missiles. We were getting 5-6000 nm at 20 knots.
      • It is doable at 1500lt as reports show. High L/B SES with proper attention to structure limits, respond very favorably to overloading with extra fuel that usually fits easily in the sidehulls.
      • The SES 200 was modified and tested a couple of times to verify the MDC design numbers very successfully.

[Date/Time=07-25-2003 – 7:40 PM]

Name:Bill White Whitewn@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=476282]
re; Titan Aluminum X-Craft Experiment

      • I’m sure that the selection of an SES (Raytheon-Umoe team) as one of the three LCS concepts chosen for further developement had something to do with the speed/range and draft requirements/objectives. The next phase should be interesting since it is highly likely that the other two concepts will incorporate dynamically assisted lifting technology – foils and/or lifting bodies – to try and meet the same overall performance objectives.

[Date/Time=07-28-2003 – 2:47 PM]

Name:Bill McFann bmcfann@islandengineering.com, [Msgid=477526]
Re; Titan Aluminum X-Craft Experiment

      • Hi, Where can I pick up this article? Thanks Vincent

[Date/Time=07-30-2003 – 3:49 AM]

Name:vincent browne vincent_himself@hotmail.com, [Msgid=478643]
SIZING PROCEDURE OF HYDROFOIL SHIP

ViewThread

      • Dear readers, I am doing my project on hydrofoil ship and really got stuck up in sizing of hydrofoil ship. Basically the hull. Please can somebody help me with it. If I can get a flow chart it would be wonderful, is it same as displacement ships, its really urgent so reply as soon as possible, you can also contact me at

shankar_navy@yahoo.com

      • thank you.

[Date/Time=08-04-2003 – 11:59 PM]

Name:Shankar shankar_navy@yahoo.com, [Msgid=481857]
Re; SIZING PROCEDURE OF HYDROFOIL SHIP

      • Shankar,
      • It would be hard to describe the sizing / design process for a hydrofoil boat via correspondence on a bulletin board as a lot of parameters would be involved. Al the same, it would be helpful to anyone who may be able to reply if you provided more specific details about your project and identify particular areas of the design you need assistance with. For example, what speed, payload, range etc do you require for the project? Is it a passenger ferry or a military patrol craft? etc.
      • The process of sizing a hydrofoil is similar to a displacement ship. When a hydrofoil is hullborne, the hull displacement has to equal the weight of the ship and its load. When foilborne, the hydrofoils instead have to carry the weight of the ship. The performance of hydrofoil vessels is fairly sensitive to weight, so an accurate weight estimate is essential, and means of keeping weight to a minimum are very desirable.
      • Usually, the best starting point for a ship design process is to work from a design that already exists and is known to work well. This is often referred to as the “basis ship”. You can do the same for a hydrofoil. For example, if you wanted to develop a design for a 40 knot 250 passenger hydrofoil with a range of 200 nautical miles, you could get a copy of “Jane’s High-Speed Marine Transportation” and look through that until you found a hydrofoil with similar performance. For this example, the Rodriquez Foilmaster at 38 knots and seating 240 passengers would be a close match. To get the two knots extra speed, you now have to bump up the installed engine power from the 2x 2000 kW Diesels that are fitted to the “basis ship”. You also have to increase the passenger deck area a little to accommodate 10 extra passengers and so on. At least you have a starting point in terms of the overall dimensions and arrangement from which you can make changes as you find are necessary. Starting with a clean sheet of paper is far more difficult and means you will need to go around the “design spiral” far more times until you converge on a design that meets the requirements you set for it.
      • The nearest I can think of to a flow chart for a hydrofoil design process would be the code that is embedded in the “HANDE” program for development of hydrofoil concept designs which had been prepared by the US Defense Department. There is newer code than “HANDE” available now, but it wouldn’t be readily available. Some papers have been written about “HANDE” and how it works, but I guess you are not in the business of trying to re-write such a program in time to support your project?!
      • Good luck with the project.

[Date/Time=08-05-2003 – 8:49 AM]

Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=481992]
Sizing of Hydrofoil

ViewThread

      • Actually I am doing my project in Hydrofoil Missile craft, I am at present stuck on the initial sizing of the hydrofoil craft. I would be really greatful if you can provide information on the weights of different weight groups of already built or designed hydrofoil crafts. The details of my project are
      • displacement : 250 t
      • max speed : 55 knots
      • endurance : 600 knotical miles in foil borne mode

[Date/Time=08-08-2003 – 5:05 PM]

Name:Shankar Swaminathan shankar_navy@yahoo.com, [Msgid=484412]
Re; Sizing of Hydrofoil

      • The particulars of your hydrofoil are not very different to the Patrol Hydrofoil Missile (PHM) once operated by the US Navy. >From the 1978 issue of Jane’s Surface Skimmers, the following information is given regarding the PHM:
      • Full Load Displacement = 235 tonnes
      • Foilborne Range = in excess of 500 Nautical Miles
      • Speed = in excess of 40 knots in 8-12 ft seas.
      • More information about the PHM can be found in early copies of Jane’s Surface Skimmers which should be available in your library. Some details of the PHM are also contained on the IHS website.
      • As I have never designed a hydrofoil myself, I don’t have any weight breakdown for such a craft or anything similar. It is possible that there is some information about weight breakdowns for hydrofoils in the February 1985 issue of Naval Engineers Journal (see details below) which covered the features of hydrofoils in quite good detail, including design and production of the PHM. Perhaps you can obtain a copy of that Journal at your library? I don’t have it myself. To re-scale any weight data you find from one size of hydrofoil to another, I could suggest you use “Fundamentals of Naval Surface Ship Weight Estimating”, a technical paper which was also once published in a copy of Naval Engineers Journal. Unfortunately, I don’t know the names of the authors of that paper or which issue of the Journal that it appeared in.
      • Naval Engineers Journal, Volume 97, Number 2, February 1985. ISSN 0028-1425. Published by the American Society of Naval Engineers, Inc. (ASNE). This special edition features comprehensive reviews of a range of ‘advanced naval vehicles’, including hydrofoils, Surface Effect Ships (SES), Wing-in-Ground Effect (WIG) craft, Air Cushion Vehicles (ACV), Small Waterplane Area Twin Hulls (SWATH), planing hulls, and modern monohulls. This is an ideal source of background information in considering the merits of different craft types for particular roles.
      • Regarding design flow charts in your follow up message, I am sorry I do not have any such charts myself.

[Date/Time=08-08-2003 – 5:07 PM]

Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=484414]
historical justification

      • Try connecting with boeing and their work on the Highpoint and the continued evolution the Tarus class represent. Also research the very active role the PHM’s had during the Hatian/Cuban boat people crisis. The exploits of the PHMs during the war on drugs until they were decommisioned. Don’t forget the role of coastal patrol around Grenada. Request deck logs from the Naval Arcives under the freedom of information act and you should be able to get enough information from these areas. Uther items of interest are the innovative use of electronic charts introduced with HYCATS. This is probably the precursor to the current use of digital charts on most commercial and military vessals in the US.

[Date/Time=08-12-2003 – 2:34 AM]

Name:Brian Stone stoneb001@hawaii.rr.com, [Msgid=486298]
PHM-3 USS TAURUS

ViewThread

      • The PHM’s were a proud and unusually tight-knit community of sailors. They were excellent ships, killed before their time by a short-sighted Navy bureaucracy. I was privileged to serve as XO of PHM-3, and think back on those days with great pride. USS TAURUS was a great ship, with a fantastic crew, and an enviable operational record. She was the best of the lot, more reliable than most and often called upon to pick up commitments missed by broken siblings. No brag, just fact. From 1988-1990, she busted a lot of dope, and quickly saved the five survivors of a USCS helicopter crash in bad weather at night during a high-speed pursuit (which she was engaged in at the time.) She subsequently acted as SAR On-scene Commander of an eight-ship and multi-aircraft search group for the next 16 hours, winning the USCG MUC for that excellent performance. She also rescued several Cuban refugees from the Florida Straits. In 1988, her forward foil nose cone broke off in heavy seas due to repeated overstressing of the mounting tangs, caused by an immature and rash CO frequently hard turning and rapid landing her in fits of boyish abandon. A new nose cone was fabricated at Runyan Shipyard, Pensacola, FL out of 4″ thick aluminum plate stock, and machined/welded/bent into shape. Other units of the class showed early symptoms of these stresses when inspected after the casualty, but it failed first on TAURUS for the reasons stated above. Ask any crew member from 1989 about being beaten severely by the anchor while foilborne at midnight off Panama in 15+ foot seas! She won the PHMRON-2 Battle “E” during that extended competitive cycle, and rightly so. Am I proud of her crew and her record? You bet.
      • David Lloyd
      • LCDR, USNR (ret.)

[Date/Time=01-03-2004 – 6:02 AM]

Name:David Lloyd KristiHdrx@aol.com, [Msgid=566066]
Re; PHM-3 USS TAURUS

      • Oops, nose fairing casualty was 1989, not 1988.

[Date/Time=01-03-2004 – 2:01 PM]

Name:David Lloyd KristiHdrx@aol.com, [Msgid=566210]
Re; Re; PHM-3 USS TAURUS

      • FYI The Uss Aries still lives.

http://ussaries.org/

      • Pictures of PHM(3,4or6)conversion to Yacht

http://blondiesmachinery.com/phm/5.html
[Date/Time=01-04-2004 – 7:01 AM]

Name:Dan Schmidt gse2schmidt@hotmail.com, [Msgid=566442]
 Image Attached:  “Phm-5.jpg”   Click Here To View
Re; PHM-3 USS TAURUS

      • “Give me a fast ship for I intend to go in harm’s way.”
      • John Paul Jones would have loved to have any one of the PHMs under his command! All the ships were a bit unique and tempermental, and each crew loved theirs the most. Being from the Gemini crew I am pretty partial to her, but IMHO serving on any of the PHMs was better than being on any other surface combatant.
      • Besides a PHM, only the sight of one of the Battleships passing close aboard would pull the crew out of their racks to line the rails on whatever warship they were on, just to get a glimpse of a PHM flying past.
      • It was a funny thing to encounter another PHM at sea. At first, all you could see would be a white smudge on the horizon. As she got closer slowly this gray form would take shape, perched atop this mountain of white froth. As she passed, the wake kicked up by the aft struts, combined with the main propulsor output, left a clear indication with the dramatic rooster tail of foam that something special had just flown by. Nothing else like them. Very sad that they are gone. If you served on a PHM you will really enjoy a visit to the last one left in Brunswick, MO.
      • Very respectfully,
      • Jon Coile
      • former LT, USN
      • Chief Engineer
      • USS GEMINI (PHM 6)

[Date/Time=01-05-2004 – 10:56 AM]

Name:Jon Coile jon@coile.com, [Msgid=566857]
RC PHM-1 Pegasus

      • I am in the process of undertaking the construction of a 6′ Radio Controlled PHM-1 Pegasus. My father was a Chief (ETC Nosek was his rate I believe) on the first crew, and I stood on the pier as a 9 year old kid on her first arrival to Key West. (Man, how the Coast Guard scratched their heads when she broke the horizon!) I would like to know if anyone has a copy of schematics, or technical drawings for her or the others. Due to the fact that she’s gone and I’ll never see her fly again, I want to build one that will. Also, since some of the correspondance on your pages are dated, what ever came of the others that were due to be scrapped. Are there anymore out there. Feel free to contact me at

laseredgt01@aol.com

      • . Thanks, TDM

[Date/Time=03-04-2004 – 3:54 PM]

Name:T.D. Mehl laseredgt01@aol.com, [Msgid=607826]
PHM-1 Pegasus

ViewThread

      • Gentlemen,
      • Progress has come along nicely on the 6’6″ PHM-1 Pegasus. I know have a 24″ wide 6’9″ block of foam in order to to start shaping the Pegasus. I have secured the required HydroJet engines to push the boat once she is 14.4″ out of the water. I will build her out of carbon fiber. If the real Pegasus would do 60-70mph, I won’t rest until mine will do at least that! I have the radar guns ready. I will supply pictures once ready of the boat as she progresses. If I get a RC hydrofoil to do 70mph she make the cover of magazines, everybody get ready for the stir! Anyone here remember my Dad? ETCS Lawrence Nosek, he was a Class in Bremerton, then picked up Cheif, and Snr Chf before we left Key West in approx.’83. Thanks, and all of your suggestions, and pointers have beem most helpful. Thanks, Troy Mehl

[Date/Time=03-17-2004 – 12:30 AM]

Name:T.D. Mehl laseredgt01@aol.com, [Msgid=615561]
Ships That Fly

      • To All Fellow Hydrofoilers;
      • About 10 years ago I collected a lot of material about hydrofoils and put it all together in a book called Ships That Fly. It became a story of the modern hydrofoil covering the early days of hydrofoil inventors and experimenters and taking the reader through over 150 pictures and illustrations of hydrofoils leading to those of recent years. I recently had the pages of the book scanned and put in a pdf file and placed on a CD that is being offered for sale.
      • You will note that Chapter 6, The US Navy Fleet Hydrofoil-PHM, ends with a very optimistic view of PHMs in the current US Navy, and larger hydrofoils in its future. However, this was not to be. Several years following the completion of my book, Ships That Fly, there were events surrounding the US Navy PHM program that are described in an Addendum to Chapter 6. All six PHM ships were decommissioned on July 30, 1993. This was the only time the US Navy has decommissioned an entire class of ships on the same day. This addendum describes some of the events leading to this sad day for the US Navy and the hydrofoil community. Also, documented are the many attempts to save the Ship, the day of the ceremony, attempts to save the ships even after the decommissioning, and finally the subsequent disposal of the ships and their status today.
      • I also collected a series of over 140 hydrofoil pictures and illustrations, and created a Hydrofoil Slide Show, entitled: A Century of Hydrofoil Development.
      • All three of these files are on the CD. To find out more, log onto:

http://themeyers.org/ShipsThatFly/index.html

      • Best regards,
      • John Meyer

jr8meyer@comcast.net
[Date/Time=03-17-2004 – 4:57 PM]

Name:John R. Meyer jr8meyer@comcast.net, [Msgid=616016]
Re; PHM-1 Pegasus

      • I knew your father. He was assigned to Training when I got to Key West in ’82. He taught classes on the PHM unique Electronics such as the SPS-63 radar. He was also the resident ACS expert(knew the ACS roadmap like the back of his hand).

[Date/Time=04-19-2004 – 3:24 PM]

Name:Chuck Shannon ChuckE68@aol.com, [Msgid=633466]
Plainview Vet

      • I found this forum on a Google search after I came across the Plainview’s hulk on a recent vacation. As a member of the last active crew (Operations Specialist) I was shocked when I sighted the instantly recognizable hulk while driving west along the Columbia enroute to the Oregon coast. I pulled the car over and managed to get down a mud slick bank on a windy and rainy day to confirm that it was the Plainview. I was able to climb up the tail strut mount and board the ship, it is in sad shape. There are holes and tears in the aluminum hull and superstructure. The tail foil is laying on the mudflats aft of the ship. What a sad end to a once marvel of engineering. Although the Plainview suffered many problems as documented on this forum (mainly transmission and hydraulic systems) when it was fully operational it was an amazing ride. I personally can attest to experiencing 65 knots as a member of the navigation watch during one trail. It literally flew. Thanks for maintaining this website and answering my questions as to how this happened.

[Date/Time=04-22-2004 – 1:56 AM]

Name:Michael Temple onedog@nventure.com, [Msgid=634838]
GEH1 Plainview being scrapped

ViewThread

      • From the Chinook Observer, Wed. May 19 with permission:
      • Derelict Ship Being Scrapped
      • A landmark along WA SR 401 will soon be a thing of the past. The Giant Experimental Hydrofoil 1 (PlainView), at 200 feet, the world?s largest aluminum ship when it was launched in 1969, is being dismantled for scrap by its owners, the Stambaugh family.

[Date/Time=05-24-2004 – 1:48 PM]

Name:Bob Cline clinewlt@pacifier.com, [Msgid=653124]
 Image Attached:  “hydrofoil_Plainview_scrapped.jpg”   Click Here To View
Re; GEH1 Plainview being scrapped

      • Don’t know which is more painful…seeing the old battle-ready Plainview sitting in the mudflats or having it disappear entirely. With its passing, the memories of the Navy’s hydrofoil program will get a little dimmer. When will they go out entirely?
      • Greg Bender
      • Plainview Chief Engineer ’75-’77

[Date/Time=05-25-2004 – 6:50 AM]

Name:Greg Bender GBender@Noesis-Inc.com, [Msgid=653536]
Re; GEH1 Plainview being scrapped

      • Thanks for providing this notice. For those who do not know, the IHS site has archived posted messages, photos, history, etc. about this ship at

http://www.foils.org/plainvw.htm

      • .

[Date/Time=05-31-2004 – 7:52 AM]

Name:Barney C Black bblack11@cox.net, [Msgid=656319]
AGEH-1 Plainview Plans

      • Hello, I am looking for ship builder plans, or scale views/profiles of the U.S.S Plainview hydrofoil ship. I have looked around alot, and have yet to even come across some simple line drawings of the hull. Can anyone help me please? I am considering doing a radio controlled model, but would like to look over a few of the ones that had been done. I was going to do a PHM-1, but it wasn’t very practical on such limited resources. The Plainview looks more practical, but I would like to see it in views/scale profiles to the scale(s) I would need before considering it completely. Any help please? Thank you much! -James H.

[Date/Time=07-17-2004 – 10:49 PM]

Name:James H. Valkyrie@whoever.com, [Msgid=681311]

 


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FLAGSTAFF:

International Hydrofoil Society Correspondence Archives…

FLAGSTAFF (PGH-1)
(More FLAGSTAFF Photos are in the Gallery)
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History
Beginning in 1952, the US Navy sponsored a research & development program to construct & evaluate a number of hydrofoil test-craft. As a result of this program, in April 1966, the Navy’s Bureau of Ships awarded contracts for two competing hydrofoil gunboats, the PGH-1 to the Grumman Corporation, and the PGH-2 to the Boeing Company. The PGH-1 was completed in March 1968 and christened FLAGSTAFF in honor of Flagstaff, Arizona. She completed acceptance trials and was delivered to the Navy Amphibious Force Pacific on November 7, 1968. In November 1969, FLAGSTAFF was transported to South Vietnam and deployed as a patrol craft for river operations out of Danang in Operation Market Time. In 1970, after completing her Vietnam tour, she was returned to San Diego for operations with Boat Support Unit One, Amphibious Forces Pacific.

On November 4, 1974, she was loaned to the U. S. Coast Guard on the West Coast for a period of testing to evaluate the utility of a hydrofoil craft as a Coast Guard cutter. This testing continued until February 1975 when FLAGSTAFF was returned to the Navy.

On September 29, 1976, the Coast Guard again took possession of FLAGSTAFF to enable the Service to do a long-term evaluation in an actual operational environment. The ship was dispatched to Boston, MA where she underwent repairs and cold weather modifications. On March 2, 1977, at the Coast Guard Support Center in Boston, wearing Coast Guard colors, FLAGSTAFF was formally commissioned as the Coast Guard cutter (WPGH-1). Lt. Terrance Hart assumed command of the cutter and her crew of 12 enlisted personnel. On July 17, 1977 she was placed in active status and home-ported in Woods Hole, MA. She operated out of her homeport for a period of 16 months. As part of the Coast Guard Fleet, FLAGSTAFF performed duties of law enforcement, search and rescue operations, and enforcement in the new 200-mile fisheries economic zone.

FLAGSTAFF was decommissioned on September 30, 1978. This decision was based, in part, on the cost of needed repairs and the fact that the Coast Guard felt that sufficient information on the use of hydrofoil craft had been derived from the evaluation program.

FLAGSTAFF and the other Navy R&D hydrofoil ships and craft served to lay a solid technology foundation for the design and deployment of a squadron of six Navy Patrol Hydrofoil Missile (PHM) ships that were later built by Boeing.

FLAGSTAFF Characteristics

  • Length………….………………73 feet
  • Beam…………………..…….…21.5 feet
  • Draft, Foils Retracted…….……4 feet, 4 inches
  • Draft, Foils Extended…………18 feet
  • Displacement………………..…69.5 long tons
  • Design Speed, foilborne…….…45 knots
  • Design Speed, hullborne………..8 knots
  • Propulsion Systems:
    • Hullborne: Two General Motors Diesels with waterjet pumps.
    • Foilborne: Rolls Royce Tyne gas turbine with super-cavitating propeller.

Wm. M. Ellsworth, P.E.

The US Coast Guard first evaluated FLAGSTAFF from Nov 74 thru Feb 75
 

USCG Official Photos  

In Sep 76, USCG again took possession of FLAGSTAFF
 

Correspondence

Condition of FLAGSTAFF

[18 Jul 00] I have viewed FLAGSTAFF and shot 4 rolls of film. The ship is in very good condition. Does not have 2 diesels for generators, 2 main diesels for propulsion or the jet drive units for HB operation. The turbine is present and seems untouched since it was surplused. The flagstaff only has one turbine. At the time it didn’t occur to me to get the numbers off its data plate. The hull/deck is sandblasted 85%. The plumbing has been completed about 80%. The wiring needs a good electrician but the majority is intact. Foils are in good shape, although the rear foil might need a bearing housing. Front foils have minor rust. John Altoonian (father) accomplished quite a bit. Sand blasting, cleaning and painting would be very light except for the propulsion room, generator/jet drive room and manual hydraulic room. For the money asked, US$30,000.00, the ship is worth at least that. Unfortunately, Mr. Altoonian (son) has set a firm 1 Aug 00 scrapping date. — Duane A. Leiker, Pres/CEO; International Submarine Museum, 4230 Trumbo Ct.; Fairfax VA 22033; phone: (703) 359-7266 (DLeiker@cox.net)

Classic Thunder…

[18 Aug 98, updated 22 Nov 00] Just noticed that FLAGSTAFF is being sold as a partnership and will be used as a promotional gimmick for boat shows and races on the East Coast of the USA. — Ken Plyler (Kfppfk@aol.com) [project discontinued due to death of the owner – Editor]

 


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Letters and photos are the property of their authors and photographers. No reproduction in any form is permitted without permission, which may be requested by contacting IHS at the above address.

International Hydrofoil Society Correspondence Archives…

US Navy PHM Archive

PHM

Click Here to download the original PHM Brochure by Boeing Marine Systems

Hydrofoil Missile Patrol Ship Saved From the Scrap Yard, Plus Other PHM-Related CorrespondenceClick Here to read a history of the PHM Program by George Jenkins

Click Here to visit the website of the USS ARIES PHM-5 Hydrofoil Memorial, Inc.

(Last Update: February 12, 2015)

Correspondence

Click on Your Choice Below, or… Scroll Down to Browse

PHM Veterans and Websites

A Quiet PHM Get Together on July 30?

[17 Jun 03] PHM Anniversary: This July 30th will be the 10th anniversary of the PHM squadron decommissioning. I wish to extend all best wishes to our shipmates, the veterans of the PHM crews, MLSG and PHM Squadron 2 staff. I look forward to raising a glass (splice the main brace) at “Turtle Krawls” in Key West on this date, to you all. Turtle Krawls Bar & Grill, 1 Margaret Street, Key West, FL, 305-294-2640. — Steve Novell (Jolly-OS1, PHM1) (sjnovell@mindspring.com)

Response…[10 Jul 03] Is it still on??? I am a staff guy from 88-92 (et1 white from training; mate of duplechain)… Have been in contact with some of the folks…they are interested… – Don White (bigbadraddad@mindspring.com)

Classmates.com

[17 Jun 03] Goto www.classmates.com, you will find a number of the old gang from various years listed under USS PEGASUS — Steve Novell (Jolly-OS1, PHM1) (sjnovell@mindspring.com)

Response…[3 Jul 03] Each of the PHMs has its own section in classmates, as well as PHMRON TWO MLSG and the Squadron( under shore commands). — Chuck Shannon MLSG 82-86 (ChuckE68@aol.com)

Wants PHM Photos

[27 Apr 02] Is there any way to get some copies of some of the photos on this site? I was with the hydrofoil program from 1981 to 1985. Due to theft all my photos are gone. I do have a black and white photo of the USS GEMINI (PHM-6) that I can send you. So if there is any way that I may purchase any 8×10 photos please let me know. — Steve Stratton(sstratton@prodigy.net)

Responses…[27 Apr 02] I have no actual photographs of the PHMs, as everything is sent electronically. I have some of the photos in higher resolution as I try to cut them down to look OK on a web page, and if you would like a copy of those, I can send what I have. They would probably look better that what is on the web if printed out. — Malin Dixon (gallery@foils.org)

[27 Apr 02] Try the Navy’s page on obtaining archived photos: http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq22-1.htm. I have also occasionally seen PHM photos go up for auction on the eBay site www.foils.org. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)

[31 May 03] I remember working in the engineman shop with you. Not too many ENs on this site. I have a couple pictures that I can scan and send. Its hard to come across hard copies. There are some sites I have stumbled across with some pretty good pics but I never think about writing them down. Then I can’t remember how to get back to them. I ran across one picture with Chuck Shannon on the pier in front of one of the PHMs, again I didn’t think to bookmark that site. I keep searching though. I can’t believe that all the ships are gone. I’m glad there are some restoration projects going on though. — Steven Matkovich, EN3 MLSG 1983-1985 (danimatkob1@msn.com)

ARIES CO

[31 Mar 02] Former CO of ARIES here (’91-’93), Capt Chris Nichols, now CO, USS PHILIPPINE SEA (CG 58) in Mayport, Fl. — Nichols, CAPT Chris (ctn@CG58.Navy.mil)

Refueled PEGASUS

[31 Mar 02] I was onboard USS OGDEN from 1978-1980. Looking in my Westpac 78 Cruisebook – page 6 is titled “20 March – Refueling PEGASUS.” I remember the day well. Was the strangest looking boat I ever saw! Would you like me to scan this page and send to you folks for posting? Would your members appreciate seeing this… ?? It’s not much, but you never know until you ask, right? That’s why I am writing in advance. Please email me back if interested. Happy to scan and send – Jim Baron (JOCS(SW), USN Ret.) 1976-1999 (jimb@atssa.com)

Going to Sea Again

[15 Mar 02] I’ve been sitting behind a desk for 3 years here at Coast Guard headquarters am transferring to Charleston this summer, and I’ll be underway on the mighty Coast Guard Cutter GALLATIN — FT1 R. Lee Madson Jr., Non-rate assignment officer, d1, d5, LANT Area cutters and various HQ hq units (RMadson@comdt.uscg.mil)

Concise and to the Point

[15 Mar 02] Was GSE up till decom. — Timothy M. Dougherty, I&E Technician, Androscoggin Energy LLCT (tdougherty@calpine.com)

PHM Maintainer

[2 Feb 02] I was stationed at PHMRON II MLSG from 1987-1993 as a DS (Data Systems Technician) working on all six PHM hydrofoils. I still can’t believe that they are no more. I enjoyed my time at the command, and don’t think I will ever work on a more interesting platform. — Stephen C. Smith (formerly DS2) (stsmith@smitty.homeip.net)

PHM VETERAN Roundup

[2 Feb 02] I have been trying to locate some of the crew for awhile just to see how things are going. I got stationed in the Mayport area 1994-98; during that time I have run across a few of the old crew, GSMCS Smith was on the Mayport waterfront for awhile, GSMCS Denali was on a SPRUANCE class, and MSCS Hurley was on the PHILLIPINE SEA, then transferred to do recruiting duty in the Jacksonville FL area for another year or two, then plans to retire. Leendert Hering was the CO on the DEWERT 1994-96 and tried to get me cross-decked from the STARK. Chris Nichols just took over the PHILLIPINE SEA. Flo (Victor Nightingale) got out of the Navy in Great Lakes after getting married there to a local girl and is doing great. Those are the only guys I have seen or heard from other than guys here in Mayport area that were at MLSG or on the other boats. The ET1 that was on the AQUILA is stationed here at Mayport were I work (civil service). Maybe we can find everyone and plan a reunion. — Reggie White (RWhite@nsmayport.spear.navy.mil)

Response…[20 Apr 02] I think that you are ET1 White, if this is correct we went to HYCATS training together. I am Merv Turner (ET2 Turner). I was proud to be part of MLSG and the hydrofoils. I am currently working at Barksdale AFB as a system engineer for General Dynamics. After the decom I went to Iceland, then back to Key West where I received an injury that prompted me to leave the Navy. I have a website with a few photos of ‘our’ great ships. http://computrez.no-ip.com I also have a video of the final flight. (Someone needed some video of the ships in flight.) It’s good to hear from people that are 2.2 meters above the rest! — Merv Turner (merv@computrez.no-ip.com)

ARIES VETERAN

[26 Jan 02] – I got on the USS ARIES in Key West FL in Sept 1982. I was EN1 and worked on the gas turbine engine. I have pictures of us flying by the USS NEW JERSEY(BB-62). We of the hydrofoil navy have but one thing to say {TO ALL AERONAUTS, LAND LUBBERS, SEA LAWYERS, AND SURFACE-BOUND BEING, GREETING: KNOW YE THAT ________________ HAS LEFT THE PRIMATE REALM OF WIND-JAMMERS, NUCLEAR CARRIERS, SUBMARINES AND ALL SUCH ANCIENT CRAFT AND HAS FLOWN ABOVE THE WAVES IN THE ULTIMATE COMFORT OF USS ARIES ( PHM 5) THEREFORE, ALL YE SHALL TREAT THE AFORESAID WITH FULL DEFERENCE AND HONOUR AS IS JUSTLY DUE ONE WHO BEARS THE HONORARY TITLE OF HYDROFOIL MARINER. — Roger Barker (roger050@msn.com)

PHM History Appreciated

[13 Jan 02]  Thank you to George Jenkins for such an informative, well documented account of the history of PHMs. For myself I served onboard USS PEGASUS (PHM-1), as CICO (OS1) back in the early 1990s until decommissioning. A number of the old crew members keep in touch and have found each other via the internet over the years. I know I can speak for my shipmates in expressing our gratitude for your article. Every Foil-Mariner you meet will say with pride that serving with the officers and men of the PHMs, was one of the high points of their lives. One additional note, the year of the PHM decommissioning, every PHM was awarded the Battle “E”. Further USS HERCULES completed a successful CN interception of a drug shipment a week before our departure to Norfolk. To the end this squadron of small fast fighting ships continued successfully to the last with their assigned mission. For July 30, 1993 has a double meaning, the squadron decommissioning fell on my birthday. Remember the old Navy joke of “What are the going to do? …take away my birthday?” Well CINCLANT did! — Steve Novell (steve.novell@av.com)

USS ARIES Veteran Finds IHS

[13 Jan 02] I have stumbled across this web site and found it to very interesting. I was stationed aboard the USS ARIES from 87 to 90 as one of our three engineman. Duty aboard sure beat the old minesweeper I was first stationed aboard. Being on board the USS ARIES during foilborne operations was an experience I will never forget. I have some old training manuals from some of the PHM engineering schools I attended if you would like them. Has any other USS ARIES crew members contacted you? If I could be of any help or you have any interest in “USS ARIES stories” such as what happened when the names “Polaris” and “Polar Ice” get mixed up during Drug Ops, drop me a line. EN2 Dave Redston, USS ARIES (caron40@optonline.net)

PHM Veteran Remembers

[16 Dec 01] Just wanted to know that, although I haven’t read everything on PHMs listed on the site, very good information here! I was stationed onboard the USS PEGASUS from 1989-93 when we decommissioned the six of them. That was my all time favorite duty station. It’s nice to know that there are a lot of people out there that still have a high interest in the PHMs. Thank You for helping to keep them alive. — Tony Larson (tlarson@newulmtel.net)

Response…[16 Dec 01]Great to hear from you Tony. I worked on the PHM program from the early studies in 1971 through the lead ship OT&E and also on the follow-ship specifications and design reviews with Boeing. Got to ride on PEGASUS several times and it was fantastic, including a drag race with a Boeing commercial JETFOIL on Puget Sound. I was there for the decommissioning, and it was a sad day indeed. — Mark Bebar, Naval Sea Systems Command, Total Ship System Concepts Division, Washington Navy Yard, DC (bebar@foils.org)

PHM Memories From Mayport

[16 Nov 01] I have thoroughly enjoyed all the PHM stuff/ theories. I can feel y’all’s excitement! So let me put in my 2 cents. I think we have SOOMMs here in the Mayport FL Basin, at the SUPSHIP facility. I will poke around and see what I can locate. There is quite a stable of hydrofoil mariners here in the Jacksonville FL area. We run into each other frequently and reminisce. There are: CO AQUILA, CO GEMINI , CO PEGASUS , CO ARIES, CO HERCULES, PHMRON 2 CHAPLAIN , 2 CHIEF STAFF’S , ET , GSE , RM , OS , FC. My opinion on the cavitation issues is that you will be able to attain 60kts with the current foil configuration with minimal cavitation if any, due to the overall weight decrease from 240 metric tons. What do you calculate your finished weight to be? There are many factors involved to maxing out your performance, i.e. drag on the foils and struts, ours were painted and were kind of rough in texture. Can you obtain a silicone-based varnish type of finish possibly? There is also the drag of the foil ailerons as they compensate, which will have an impact on the cavitation. I have been prone on the fo’c’sle watching the foil ailerons in action peeking over the bull nose, and the aileron action causes “some” cavitation anytime you’re foilborne. Good luck with the ACS and sonic/radar height sensors! Speaking of ACS, your speed over ground will definitely be affected by your heading hold operation. When heading hold is disengaged even the best helmsman cannot be as efficient as heading hold, you can see the wobble in the wake. Just FYI, heading hold will disengage if it exceeds more than 3 degrees deviation. Also, if you can produce propulsor output of 103 kgpm plus keep in mind that there is a happy medium between foil depth and max speed. Yes, the less foil depth (1.5mtrs min) = less drag, but it also increases the distance of the water jet, decreasing effective thrust. Maybe y’all can figure out a better conduit than the flexible bellows between the inlet and propulsor. If you can, than you can jam the high torque limiting, and increase your horses by approx.15%. And not have to worry about inlet/ output pressure differential. Also, it might help to erect some type of aerodynamic aid from the gun mount site to the deck house. I did not read where anyone talked about fuel consumption, you will burn about 7% per hr foilborne of JP-5 or DFM at 63k ltrs full. Y’all should bring her to the St. Johns River here in Jacksonville. There are plenty of crew and yard birds that worked on all 6 of them over here. If y’all need a helmsman let me know, if I could bring her up on the sticks one more time I would die a happy squid. If y’all are interested in the tale of the whale, I’m happy to share. Also, I disagree with the comment from Mr. Coile that AQUILA was a dog. Once, we left Key West and arrived at Ft. Lauderdale mysteriously way ahead of PIM, with no missiles or bullets on board, turbine at 95%, foil depth at 2.0m, the EM log had us at steady 48kts and HYCATS at 52 kts over ground. After we secured sea and anchor detail the navigator, QM, and myself went over the deck logs for foilborne to hullborne, reviewed the HYCATS tape, and recalculated the track 3 times. Our calculations came up with 63 kts! We shrugged and went on with business. AQUILA collected the most battle efficiency awards… coincidence? I think not! — Robert N. Desendi, Robert ET1 (NSMAYPORT) (Rdesendi@nsmayport.spear.navy.mil) USS AQUILA PHM-4, 89-93 ; PARATUS PULSAR

Response…[16 Nov 01] The 60-knot opinion is probably close to the mark. I recall that when the first production PHM was delivered and tested at light load, (with reduced foil submergence in relatively calm water), the ship hit around 58 knots, with little cavitation. Production PHMs were built to a foil contour tolerance requirement developed jointly by the Navy and Boeing, and this worked very well. — Mark R Bebar (bebar@foils.org) Mark Bebar NAVSEA 05D1; Total Ship System Concepts Division, formerly PHM-3 Ship Design Systems Engineer (1975-1980)

Commodore Remembered

[1 Nov 01] Captain Ronald C. Berning, USN (Ret.). died on 2 August 2001 at his home in Norfolk VA. following a most courageous battle with cancer. He was buried with military honors at Arlington Cemetery on 23 August 2001. He graduated from the US Naval Academy in 1968. Following graduation, Ron began a long and distinguished career as a surface warrior that was to include four commands, including command of Patrol Hydrofoil Missile (PHM) Squadron 2 (COMPHMRON TWO) in Key West FL. A donation in Ron’s name can be made to Children’s Hospital of the King’s Daughters; P.O. Box 2156; Norfolk, VA 23501

PHM Gunner Checks In

[30 Oct 01] I was the Gunner on AQUILA when she was decommissioned. I saw your picture of the ARIES, and I still can’t believe they are all gone. Let me know if you need info on the gun or harpoons. — “Gunz”, (vogelmeierma@thirdncb.navy.mil) GMC(SW) Mark A. Vogelmeier; R-75 Armory Chief; 31ST NCR, Port Hueneme Ca; DSN 551-5968/(805) 982-5968; Fax 982-4230

Responses…[27 Jun 02] Dude, how goes it? If you remember, we served onboard USS AQUILA! Hope you are doing well. — Mike Boyle RN1 Ret! USN (mdboyle2@cox.net)

[22 Nov 02] Hey there Mike! Or excuse me EN1 or that’s how I remember you anyways) I was on the Aquila from July 1991 to Decom. Remember a SCRAWNY little ICman named Dennis Burback? Well I hope you do, Cause I sure remember wiping alot of oil from the bilge underneath your diesels 😉 . I ended up doing 9 years in the Navy, got out after a recruiting stint at NRD Denver. So you by chance have any video of the Aquila, like possibly on the way up to Little Creek when all 6 ships were steaming foilborne in formation? I remember seeing a video but didn’t get a copy. Hope all is well with you and all the old Aquila guys. — Dennis Burback (burback@attbi.com)

PHM People and Memories

[29 Sep 01] I too am a former PHM’er. MLSG / PHM-3. I was an ET assigned to MLSG (1983 -86) and gapped a billet onboard the Taurus, (PHM-3). I received my Enlisted Surface Warfare Specialist designation while assigned to the TAURUS in 1985 / 6. What can I do to help? If you need money, labor, or Moral support, let me know (I don’t have much money, But…). There is a lot of People who would love to see any of the old ships FLY again. Some of the people I remember the most from my time in Key West, Fl. are:

  • ET1 Ferdinand Rezecka: Left the 3 boat and made me gap his billet. I hated it at first but it changed my life!! Thanks Ferd. Loved your Fiero!
  • LT CDR Vincent P. Mocini (CO PHM-3): Probably one of the most influential character in my life.
  • LT CDR Kelly Plate (XO PHM-3): Heard he had his Own Command on a DDG. (No Finger Prints!). Thanks for everything!
  • LT Steve (Combat Systems Officer on Taurus) Said he was going to a seminary. Excellent man!!! (My biggest advocated Ever!) THANKS!!!!!!!!!
  • ETC Doug Couch: Loved your boat!
  • ETC/S Wilbur Hawkins, Should be a high paid Psychologist by now
  • ET2 Keith Chothier Called me “PoDunk,” which I think was derived from somewhere between Poor Old & Petty Officer Dunk!
  • ET2 Chuck Shannon: Knew everything! Hope he made it though (9/11/01)
  • ET3/2 Lester Andresen: Hey Buddy!
  • Gunners Mate Chief Robert Adams: Who made Warrant Officer. Bob was a Plank Owner onboard Taurus as a 2nd Class. Bob made Warrant before he left. Bob was a Viet Nam Vet and had a PT boat shot out from under him. I remember grabbing his toe; shacking it; and running as I woke him for watch.
  • EMC George Driver: (Flammo) Taught me the engineering plant on the Taurus. I still remember Monsarate and $40 worth of Banana flavored Rum Milk Shakes. Or was that Bob Adams?
  • ET3 Earl Vermilion? (Vern) Beer
  • ET3 Bob Olef? (New Jersey) We went to “A” School together, Our Wives gave birth 2 days apart in Great Lakes, IL. 5/5/83(Bob Jr.) and 5/7/83 (Zachary N.)
  • ET3 Jeff Johnson: Do you still race cars, and what ever happen to your wife?
  • ET3 Carter?: Hope you found what you we’re looking for.
  • ET1 Randy

And Everyone Else!!! — (sysmon@home.com)  

PHM-2 USS HERCULES Plankowner

[1 Jul 01] I was the gunner’s mate on the commissioning crew, but was discharged in 1983 shortly after going to Key West. Would appreciate any info on the ship’s status, or on fellow plank owners.– GMG2 John Drozdowski (horndog114@hotmail.com)

Response…[17 Feb 03] …had to laugh when I saw your name on this page……I remember the “wild ride” we took on your bike in downtown Bremerton WA……good to see there are still some of us out there that are still alive…..I had taken my wife to K.W. just before they decommissioned the boats….we were eating at the Turtle Krawls and the Gemini was just coming back in the channel…..last I saw of it until now………..never seen or heard anything from any one else……would like to find Terry Kurts….BM….from commissioning crew…….get back with me if you have time. — FC1SW Karl James (karl.james@polk-fl.net)

PHM Veteran works for the AltaVista Search Engine

[29 May 01] Being a member of the USS PEGASUS Pegasus (PHM1) crew was one of teh most rewarding experiences of my life. Great ships and proud crews. I was glad to read to comments regarding the break-up of PEGASUS, she was a fighter to the last! — Your shipmate, Steve (Jolly) Novell (steve.novell@av.com), former OS1 (1991-93) USS PEGASUS (PHM1), Systems Manager, Information Technologies, AltaVista The search company www.altavista.com.

PHM Plank Owner and Webmaster

[4 May 01] I was a Plank Owner on the USS TAURUS PHM-3. I am building a personal web site and am building a section on the TAURUS, it’s not finished, but coming up fast. Maybe your members would be interested. — L.R. Hargis MSCM(SS/SW), NAS Whidbey Island, WA; email: (HargisLR@aol.com) website: http://www.members.tripod.com/masterchiefscorner

PHM Decommissioning Crew

[20 Mar 98, updated 08 Apr 01] I was on the PHM hydrofoils from 1991-93, I was on the decommissioning crew. See photos on my website. — Merv Turner (merv@computrez.no-ip.com), website: http://computrez.no-ip.com/

Former PEGASUS ET

[20 Mar 01] I served on USS PEGASUS from about 1979 – 82 as the ship’s ET. I was part of the crew that brought her down to Key West and helped reopen the base there. How can I get updates on the progress of the restoration? And what kind of help can I offer? — John Rebori (JRebori682@aol.com)

Former Tech Rep finds the PHM Page

[2 Mar 01] This is a great site which brings back many memories. I was a Field Engineer for the Sperry Corp for the MK92 Fire Control System (FCS) on PHM 3 and 4. I was there when the MK92 FCS’s were installed at Boeing. I was in Bremerton for the commissioning of PHM 3 and 4. I was considered part of the crew on may cruises in Puget Sound. The ships would not leave unless I was on board. I don’t know if that was good or bad :-). I ultimately escorted both of them from Seattle WA to Key West, FL through the Panama Canal. In fact, one of the pictures on this site was taken by me from the deck of the support ship USS FREDRICK prior to an Underway Replenishment (UNREP). I would love to know who you got it from. I have the negative. I then supported all activities on both ships for the next 9 months after their arrival in Key West. It is a time in my life I can never forget. I have numerous documents from PHM 3 and 4, commissioning brochures, a certificate declaring me a Hydrofoil Mariner as well as many pictures from the cruise from Seattle to Key West. I was also the first civilian to drive a PHM after commissioning! I live in San Diego, which makes assisting in restoration of ARIES difficult, but I will be more than willing to help in anyway I can. — Howard Kukla (Sperry Field Engineering 1979 – 1986) (hkukla@kyocera-wireless.com)

Looking For an ex-Coastie

[9 Feb 01] Maybe you can help me run down a former hydrofoil guy. When I was in Annapolis for the Chesapeake Sailing Yacht Symposium, I met a former Coastguardsman who lives in Annapolis not too far from the Eastport Yacht Club and used to be involved with the Navy PHMs. I didn’t get a good look at his nametag, but I think his name was Phil Donough or something like that. He had some design concepts and patents he wanted to show me, but when I tried to find him later in the party he was gone. Can anyone give me a lead on who I was talking to? — Tom Speer (tspeer@tspeer.com); website: http://www.tspeer.com

Response…[10 Feb 01] I don’t know what type of design the coast guardsman talked to you about, but I have designed several hydrofoils sail and power. The small two or four man boats should have a market where someone needs a whaler sized boat but finds the water too rough to go over a few knots. My design will do 28 knots in seas that the whaler could not take. It is self righting and fuel efficient. Let me know if you are interested. — John Slattebo (raptor16@sbcglobal.net)

A Test Engineer Finds the IHS Website

[15 Sep 00] I was there when we laid the keels for PHM boat 2 through boat 6, worked on all functional tests, for all systems. I have not read your page completely; Ii will do it later. I will also call a few of the test people and engineers to let them know about your site. — Charles A. Stearns, Boeing Marine Systems (retired) (cstearns@wolfenet.com)

PHM Vet on Lake Erie

[15 Sep 00] I have been reading about the new PEGASUS I spent 6 years as a gas turbine technician in the Navy and had the opportunity to repair and ride PHM 2 the HERCULES. My neighbor is also ex navy and is from an older destroyer background. He spends a few days a year going to an old tin can with the old timers to fix things up. Things like lights, toilets, painting, and so on. Have you ever considered having a long working weekend for some of us not-so-old timers to help do the pain and non-critical system work? I am very interested in your power distribution rework. I have experience with VFDs, LM2500s, Diesels, Generators, Pumps, & some HVAC. I have also noticed this month the other four PHMs have had their prices brought down to the US$40,000 to 75,000 price range. I would like to see the other PHMs not be destroyed. I live east of Cleveland Ohio and right on Lake Erie. I would like to see them in a maritime museum even if they never become more than hullborne. How can I get the ball rolling (most museum types think of hovercraft or whatever when I say hydrofoil)? Do you have any PHM pictures that aren’t already on the web site? — Daniel R. Schmidt (GSE2Schmidt@Hotmail.com)

Response…[15 Sep 00] We are trying to figure out how we can push forward at a faster pace with the restoration of our PHM. We have done everything “out of pocket” so far. The most significant problem is our lack of administrative experience. We are very technical people, which has been very useful in getting done what we have, but if this baby is to fly again, it will take some administrative help. We have ended up with the only one of the ships that still had her foils attached. CSI owns and is trying to do something with the rest. We were contacted by a rep for CSI a few weeks ago and were asked what it would take to get one of them going again hullborne with basic systems the way we did ours. I quoted supplying the technical expertise, as well as basic controls. They decided against the plan. I was told that two of the ships, were damaged during a storm, unfortunately, I believe they were two of the best ones. I have been looking into a non-profit org such as a museum, I really believe that this may be our best chance at flying again. We have decided that we would donate the ship to such an organization, knowing that it will keep us from ever making money on the sale of the ship. We decided that we couldn’t do that anyway and we also know that without donations in time or money, it will take longer than god gave us to get her flying again. Donations are nearly impossible if they are not tax deductible. I have been trying to find someone that could point us in the right direction, I understand that many old fighter aircraft are restored this way. We would love the opportunity to purchase one or more of the remaining ships for at least parts. It would make the restoration much easier. CSI also purchased the foils, which could be reinstalled at least for static display. One of the ships, sitting on the extended foils on dry ground would indeed make a very impressive display. I haven’t got any other pictures at the moment, but as they get taken I will add you to the list I email them to. Since you have VFD experience, can you see any problem with our plan on using them for power supplies for the 400 hz? I have yet to locate large used ones at a price that I can afford. We need at least two 75 hp units. I would prefer 3 of the same units, we could use one to drive the 60 hp motor we hooked to one of the hydraulic pumps. With a VFD driving it, we would significantly reduce starting current, and be able to take the motor/hydraulic pump to near 100 hp for short duration which would be perfect for the hydraulic bow thruster, not to mention make the bow thruster variable which might be handy. We also installed a crane where one set of Harpoon missiles used to be mounted. This will make installation of the generator sets (among other things) considerably easier. It will also be use as a davit to float the launch, very important in a ship that sits 13 feet off the water and doesn’t easily dock. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

More PHM Vets

[27 Jun 00] I served onboard GEMINI 1989-91 as one of the Radiomen. I found it a very rewarding tour of duty. We had a very tight knit community down there in Key West. I wish those ships were still around as I would gladly go back there for more 20-hour work days. Good site… keep it up. Let’s not forget these hard working ships. ITC(SW) Rich Powell (rpowell@salts.navy.mil)

[30 Nov 99] I spent 4 1/2 years (1982-1986) working in the MLSG. As an Engineering Technician (ET), I was responsible for maintaining all the Communications, radar, nav aids, and HYCATS (High speed collision avoidance and tracking system) on all 6 ships. Most of my time was in Key West, but I spent a few months in Bremerton before making the transit with USS ARIES (PHM-5). Maybe if a few more of us stumble in to this site we can start making plans for a reunion in Key West (I can hear Durty Harry’s calling). — Chuck Shannon, Engine Co. 68 FDNY (ChuckE68@aol.com)

[24 Nov 99, updated 01 Dec 01] Interesting web site. I spent 2 years (1990-1992) aboard USS GEMINI PHM-6. I was the ET (Electronics Technician) and spent most of my time taking care of the communications gear, navigation, electronic warfare (EW) and nearly anything with electronics! We did one overhaul during those 2 years at Bender Shipbuilding in Mobile AL. Otherwise we were always underway in support of Fleet exercises and counter-narcotics operations. I only have 2 pictures one is of the GEMINI flying high, and one of all 6 PHMs flying. I left as the Navy was starting to downsize and just prior to decommissioning. — Todd Spates (spatest@mindspring.com)

[29 Oct 99] I kind of stumbled across a web site devoted to the old Key West PHMs and was surprised to see that folks still talked about ’em. I was in the MLSG (Mobile Logistics Support Group) in Key West FL from 1983 to 1987, spending time in the 51A & G electrical shops, and 31T turbine shop. I also did a couple of stints on USS PEGASUS, USS HERCULES, and USS TAURUS. In 1991, I went back as a crewman on TAURUS, but left because of surgery. If anyone wants to talk foils, I’m teaching at Surface Warfare Officer’s School. — John R. Andersen, Master Training Specialist, Surface Warfare Officer’s School Command; Newport, RI 02841-1209 (andersen@swos.navy.mil )

[19 Sep 98] US Navy PHMRON2 REUNION! Hi, Shipmates. Any former US Navy Hydrofoil Mariners from PHMRON2 interested in a reunion in our old home port of Key West ? or you’re looking for old shipmates? If we get enough interest hopefully we can get a reunion going for the old gang, or at the minimum get in touch with an old buddy? — Steve Novell, USS PEGASUS (PHM1) (sjnovell@mindspring.com)

[26 Mar 98] I found IHS while surfing the web and will be joining shortly. Didn’t know there was such a group. Short Resume:

  • Plank Owner and Chief Engineer of High Point. 1962 – 1966
  • Plank Owner and Chief Engineer of TUCUMCARI. 1968 -1969
  • Employed by Sea Flite, Hawaii. (3) Boeing 929 Jetfoils. 1974 – 1978
  • Employed by Turismo Margarita, Venezuela. (2) Boeing 929 Jetfoils. 1978 – 1979

I probably qualify as a Hydrofoiler. — Ken Plyler (Kfppfk@aol.com)

[6 Oct 97] Need some help with the LM2500 gas turbine engines? I used to run the turbine shop (31T) on the west coast for the US Navy, maybe I can be of some help. Let me know. — Denis Hill GSCM(SW) USN ret. (dionysius@home.com)


PHM Ships Service Power Units (SSPUs)
[28 Jun 00] I am presently working on the conceptual design of an integrated electrical power plant for a naval warship. While researching options for producing emergency power, I was interested to learn of the SSPUs used aboard the PHM class ships. I am attempting to learn more, so that I don’t champion the “reinvention of the wheel”. Could you tell me who I could contact that would have detailed technical insight into the design of the SSPUs, the systems that they were used in, and the integration into the PHM class ships? Any contact information or insight may be very helpful. — Wayland Comer (wscomer@visto.com) Office: (408) 735-2644

Response…[28 Jun 00] Most of the personnel that worked on the PHMs have retired from Boeing. The SSPU for PHMs were manufactured by Garrett Airesearch, in Phoenix AZ. They might have someone that can spell out the particulars. The PHM SSPU powered a 400 hz “Y” connected generator, an air start compressor, and hydraulic pump. I am not aware of any other use than the PHMs, but contacting the manufacturer would be your best bet. My only contact was a one-day visit to witness the ongoing qualification tests for the Navy. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)


Restoring a PHM in Missouri

ARIES Update

[25 Feb 02] It is our intention to open the ARIES (ex-PHM-5) to tours this summer. Our plans are to cruise downstream and are going to be stopping at larger cities that have waterfront festivities. Tours of a docked vessel have a significantly lower risk factor than chartering. How far we go, will depend on the success of the tours to put fuel in the tanks. We are planning on using the Combat Information Center (CIC) as the main display area where we will have artifacts as well as video, still pictures, and text documenting hydrofoil development. We have a lot of cleaning up to do. We are also in need of some painting. In my investigations, it seems there are many types of paint that can be used. Could anyone tell me the best to use over the paint that already exists? Am I correct in assuming it is enamel? Is there an “official” color? Can someone explain the markings on the bridge exterior to us? The three big “E” and what the “campaign ribbons” mean? We are going to use the 25 hp aft ship hydraulic system to operate the crane we added as well as provide for back up for the steering system. We are going to tap in a 5 hp self contained hydraulic system to power the steering in normal operation. This keeps us from having to have all systems charged when we only need them at small intervals. The 60 hp forward system powers the bow thruster and capstan. We figure on being able to raise and lower the foils with this amount of hydraulic power. (We will have the capability of the 3000 psi but not the volume, which will significantly slow the hydraulic response time.) All the pumps are still on the main gearbox supplying foilborne hydraulic power. The oil I believe is a synthetic as there are warning signs stating that, it is red in color, can anyone tell me what it is and where to find some more of it? How much was the Automatic Control System (ACS) used, or more importantly, how effective was it in hullborne travel? Does anyone know how much power was required for the foil system? Foilborne or hullborne? I am wondering if we have enough to test an ACS in the hullborne mode without the main turbine in operation. — Eliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Responses…[25 Feb 02] I know what all the deck house art is, but not specifically ARIES. I know AQUILA‘s. If you can get me a picture of ARIES’ deck house I will translate the markings for you. Also, I think the internal color of ARIES was called “sea foam”. As far as the external paint that was utilized, we used standard navy “haze gray” and “deck gray”. They came in the standard 5-gallon can with the generic white label. When the “non-skid” on the weather decks became a little sun faded, we used a “deck gray” wash which was diluted with mineral spirits to freshen it up to black. I can re-create for you the systems in CIC by function and location. So you can say “over in this corner was the blah blah blah, which was used for…” if you would like? Let me know if there is anything I can help you with. — Rob DeSendi (RDesendi@nsmayport.spear.navy.mil)

[25 Feb 02] The big “E” markings on the bridge signify areas of excellence used during a grading cycle of the ship. These areas of grading were used to determine which ships would be awarded the Battle “E” award. The color signified the area….red for engineering, green for ship handling and such, white for combat system functions. (I may have the colors wrong). The hash marks underneath are for multiple awards in each area. As to the ribbons, they are not campaign per se, they are awards the ship as a whole has earned for example…Meritorious Unit Commendation (MUC), Coast Guard Meritorious Unit, Battle “E” award. If they are still painted on the bridge wings just go to your local Navy recruiting office and ask for the All Hands magazine issue which list all the ribbons and what they look like. Be careful of that synthetic gear lube, the number the Navy used was 23866 and it was highly toxic. — FCC(SW) H (ret.) Kevin Hufnagle (khufnagle@stonel.com) Decommissioning crewmember for USS GEMINI

[15 Jun 02] The answers, as best I can put them together, are as follows:

  • The “Es” are annual awards for efficiency made to ships for outstanding performance during the year. They are competitive award and is based at least in part on performance in certain standardized exercises and inspections.
  • The white E is the overall battle efficiency award and pertains to the whole ship. It is painted on the superstructure and stays there for a year until the next year’s award is made. Subsequent awards are indicated by a “hash mark” (small diagonal stripe) under the E. Personnel attached to the ship — and the ship itself — are awarded a ribbon signifying the achievement.
  • The other Es are departmental awards signifying competitive achievements by one or more of the ship’s “departments.” (Engineering, Operations, Combat Systems, Supply, etc.) These Es are different colors – red for engineering, blue for supply (I think! Memory fails me). There is no corresponding ribbon award.
  • The “campaign ribbons” you are mention are actually awards given to the ship for unusual and praiseworthy service. ARIES holds the following awards (Name of award/Dates of service encompassed by the award):
    • Joint Meritorious Unit Award: 6 Apr 92–30 Apr 92
    • Navy “E” Award: 1 Apr 86 — 31 Sep 86; 1 Jan 92 — 31 Dec 92 (2 Awards)
    • Coast Guard Meritorious Unit Commendation: 1 Nov 85 — 28 Feb 86; 1 Oct 86 — 30 Jun 87 (2 awards)
    • Secretary of the Navy Letter of Commendation: 12 Jun 87– 1 Aug 87
    • Coast Guard SOS Ribbon: 1 Oct 87 — 31 Dec 87; 1 Jan 90 — 31 Mar 90 (2 awards)
  • Second and subsequent awards are represented by a small gold star on the basic ribbon
  • These awards are shown in the order of their “precedence.” The most senior ribbon (JMU) goes on the upper left as you look at it, the most junior (USCG SOS) on the lower right.

Hope this helps. — George Jenkins (treasurer@foils.org)

 

PHM Update

[23 Jan 02] We had the opportunity to purchase some parts we needed for our restoration project. Jim Lovelace, the current owner of the PHMs- 2, 3, 4,& 6 is in the process of scrapping PHM 2, HERCULES. My father in-law Art Winkler and I drove out to Wilmington NC and spent three days removing parts. We accumulated 1500 lbs of parts. This wasn’t the first time we gathered parts from the sister ships, we accumulated many when CSI owned them. We have many parts from all the ships, from seating, pumps, lockers, to electrical panels, railings, lighting, and hatches etc. This project would have been impossible without that source of spare parts. We intend to end up with many more. I have included a couple pictures showing the bow of HERCULES which has been severely damaged along side TAURUS (PHM-3). — Eliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Responses…[22 Mar 02] You need to put a warning on the site when you show such photos… It pains my heart…… what a great ship… she got our last bust. — Steve Novell, OS1 PHM1 (snovell@mindspring.com)

[27 Apr 02] Out of curiosity, what happened to the hull of PHM-2? When we decommissioned her there wasn’t any damage to her hull. — IT1(SW) G. E. Countryman, NAVCOMTELSTA Jacksonville FL, CWO/Tech Control LPO N32 (CountrymanGa@nctsjax.navy.mil)

Need PHM Video Footage

[18 Jan 02] I am looking for any film footage, or video taken of the USS PEGASUS or PEGASUS Class Hydrofoils, known as PHMs for Patrol Hydrofoil Missile. These include, PHM-1 PEGASUS , PHM-2 HERCULES, PHM-3 TAURUS, PHM-4 AQUILA, PHM-5 ARIES, PHM-6 GEMINI. I have been told that the show Beyond 2000 once did a story on these ships. I am willing to pay cost associated with the procurement of any footage. — Eliot James, PHM Memorial — The PEGASUS Project (esjames@cvalley.net) (PHMmemorial@yahoo.com)

Responses…[27 Jun 02] I was stationed aboard USS AQUILA from 1990 to 1993 for decommissioning. I have a VHS tape of out ship flying around our Rigid Inflatable Boat (RIB) boat as well as an 8MM tape of our final flight out of Key West! I found this site from a friend; we were both onboard the AQUILA when it struck a whale in Apr of 91. Maybe I can get a copy made on VHS of the Final Flight! — Mike Boyle (mdboyle2@cox.net)

[26 Jan 02] Beyond 2000 did make an episode about the PHMs, so if you can track that down that would be a good piece. It was kind of basic as it’s designed for the average viewer of television. If you want more involved stuff, Boeing made some great marketing videos to sell the Navies of the world on the PHM concept. From Boeing Marine Systems in Seattle, I would think that the Boeing Museum folks out there might be able to dig deep in their archives and possibly come up with something for you. Final suggestion is to look into NAVSEA videos. We had a helicopter hover over us with a NAVSEA camera crew in it while three PHMs flew in line abreast at 45 Kts, 100 yard separation and did a Search Turn! Now if you don’t know what a search turn is, that might not sound too crazy but let me try and explain. You line the ships up, side by side, and let’s imagine the ships are numbered: 1 – 2 – 3 And let’s imagine that the top of this e-mail is due north, so the ships are heading up the page at 45 knots like this:

1  2  3

The turn starts when ship number 1 turns HARD to the right, directly toward ship number 2. Since ship numbers 2 and 3 are still heading due north at 45 knots, the theory is that by the time ship 1 completes her turn to the east, 2 & 3 have moved up the page and ship 1 is directly in the wake of ship 2. It should look like this

2  3
1

At that point ship 2 turns HARD into ship 3 and since ship three keeps heading north she clears out and 2 ends up in her wake, when ship three throws the helm hard right turns east to parallel the others and the formation ends up line abreast again, heading due east toward the right side of the page. The formation now looks like this:

3
2
1

Got it? It’s actually a maneuver for destroyers to use to clear their baffles of submarines sneaking up from behind in the blind spot of their sonar. No tactical use for PHMs except to look cool. And destroyers normally do it at 15 knots with 1,000 yard separation between ships line abreast. Anyway, in 1987 somebody at NAVSEA wanted to make a video of us doing a search turn at 45 knots and 100 yard separation. They hovered over us in a helo while we got ready to do it. It is an intimidating maneuver because at the beginning you are turning right into the side of the next ship over, before relative motion takes effect and she pulls ahead. When we lined up, my ship, the USS GEMINI (PHM 6) was ship number 1. The OOD (I wasn’t driving so it wasn’t me!) had gotten in a little close to ship number two, and we were only about 80 yards off when the command to execute came over the radio. Not having ever done this at foilborne speeds, or at these insanely close distances, the OOD ordered the standard command of “Right 3 degrees per second”. We slewed over toward ship number 2, the USS AQUILA (as I remember it), and it became clear we weren’t turning fast enough to clear her stern. The OOD quickly yelled “Left full rudder!” and we banked hard away from a certain collision. We backed out to the full 100 yards and tried it again using full rudder this time, which gave us 6 degrees per second of turn and it worked slick. Anyway, the NAVSEA guys got both the first aborted attempt and the final perfectly-executed foilborne search turn on video, if you can find those anywhere. — Jon Coile, (Formerly) LT USN, Chief Engineer, USS GEMINI (PHM 6) (jon@coile.com)

[3 Feb 02] In connection with your request for video material on PHMs, I recommend you contact Tom Warring at the Naval Surface Warfare Center, Carderock Division (NSWCCD). I was recently given his name from Jim Scott (Head of Public Affairs) for such requests. You need to explain what you want the videos for, etc. You should ask for the following:

  • PHM – PM Magazine Clip
  • PHM Drug Operations
  • PHM – “Ship Whose Time Has Come”
  • PHM – Key West
  • PHM-1 “Rough Water Trials”
  • PHM Granada Deployment
  • PHM Last Flight (All six in formation)

— John Meyer (jmeyer@erols.com)

[22 Mar 02] Contact CNN News. They were aboard PEGASUS filming during the last trip out of Key West. Should be in June time period of 93. Also they filmed CIC, Bridge and other ships in formation! They rode PEGASUS (designated flagship for the trip) — Steve Novell, OS1 PHM1 (snovell@mindspring.com)

Update on PHM ex-ARIES in Missouri

[1 Dec 01] We have been doing quite a bit of work on the ship lately.

  • Most notable has been the replacing of the two temporary deck mounted diesel gen-sets, (one 60 cycle, one 400 cycle) with a single 60 cycle, 150 KW John Deere powered Kohler set in the location once occupied by the very fuel hungry turbine powered generator in the aft most compartment of the platform deck, Aux. Machinery room No.3. Future plans are to install a much smaller genset in Aux. Machinery No.1 for low load times. The 400-cycle power is being supplied from 3 variable frequency drives. One of which drives the panel powering all ventilation fans forward of the diesel/pump machinery room so that they can be slowed down independent of the rest of the 400-cycle system. We have found that these fans move a lot of air at high speed, subsequently they are very power hungry and noisy. By reducing the speed with a VFD to 200 Hz, it substantially reduces both. The reduced settings are more than adequate for nearly 80% of operations.
  • We have mounted, and are in the process of installing a 10hp 60cycle seawater pump. By running this motor on its own VFD, and tying in the seawater pressure sensor, we can have closed loop control. Originally, seawater which is restricted with orifices at each piece of machinery to control flow, was left pumping overboard. With the closed loop control maintaining the pressure, when we shut the overboarding valves at the engines, or other coolers that are not being used, the pump will run at a lower speed, reducing power requirements. Another advantage of VFDs is that the current to start each motor can be reduced to no more than it’s full load amps instead of the usual 5 times that much. We will be able to start any load with the exception of the 60-hp hyd. Pump, with a 30kw genset. I expect that we will be able to reduce fuel consumption when moored to about 2.5 gal. per hour, underway, at 12 knots consumption will be approx. 52 gph.
  • We also mounted a hydraulic crane where the starboard set of Harpoons was mounted. We have used this crane to remove the old gensets, and install the new one. It will be very useful in off loading the launch. One main pain in the butt on the trip home!
  • The galley is operational, as is the head. We don’t have much fresh water capacity, but will be adding some tanks until we put the desalinator back on line. We have bought a new computer and 4 screens, one a LCD touch screen for the pilot interface, a second LCD for the co-pilot spot as well as two down in CIC for the navigation station. This is basically our IBS (Integrated Bridge System). Now we have a lot of programming to do.
  • The original hydraulic system was powered when foilborne by four pumps mounted on the foilborne gearbox, and hullborne by four pumps mounted on the SSPUs. Since we removed the SSPUs we mounted one pump on a 25hp electric motor which runs system 4a, (aft system, including steering and trust reversers, rear foil, as well as the crane). We are currently mounting a 60hp electric motor to a pump to run system 1a, (forward system, including bow thruster, capstan, and forward foil). This will complete the hydraulic system to sufficient degree that we can raise and lower the foils as well as operate all other systems hullborne as well as all systems when we are able to go foilborne.

Diana and I went to Wilmington NC to the Historic Naval Ship Association conference which was held in conjunction with the Maritime Heritage Association conference this year and came away with a bit better idea of what would be necessary to start a non profit organization that would help with the restoration / rehabilitation of our ship. We have a few ideas that we would like some feedback on. We intend to form the PHM Memorial, a not for profit, 501c-3 tax exempt, organization. This is an organization dedicated to preserving the history of the only military hydrofoil fleet. As well as the history, technology, and related artifacts of hydrofoils, both military and civilian that pushed forward the development of the technology that made these ships possible. That which made them the most advanced and successful adaptation of hydrofoil technology to date and still represents the “state of the art”. The focal point of the PHM Memorial will be the USS ARIES, PHM-5. It is the intention of this organization to restore and rehabilitate the PHM to a state that will allow her to cruise hullborne, and eventually foilborne. This will allow the Memorial to travel and display the history, technology, and artifacts in locations that would not normally be able to support a permanent display. Can anyone help and give reasons why, the marine industry, naval history, the general public, or anyone else would benefit, from the formation of this organization? How might such an organization be useful in the education of our country’s youth or “At Risk Youth”?

After taking a ride on Harry Larson’s hydrofoil TALARIA III, all I could do is wonder, “how can anyone spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a personal yacht and not spend 40 and make it a hydrofoil?”. I asked Harry why people weren’t beating his door down for him to make more, he replied “Because this is the only one.” He cited Personal Water Craft (PWCs). They were invented decades before they actually became popular. 30 years ago Sea Doo modeled a prototype they never sold that could be mistaken for ones they produce today at a rate of thousands a year. Doesn’t it make sense that this is why there aren’t more hydrofoils? Education and exposure. Isn’t this reason enough for such a Memorial? Why, or Why not?

Is there anywhere in this country for a naval architect, marine designer, commercial pilot, or deck hand to gain hands on experience with hydrofoils? Wouldn’t such experience expand his knowledge and capabilities, subsequently enhance his marketability? I suppose there are Universities and trade schools that specialize in that sort of thing. Who are they? What sort of program could be put together that would entice those institutions to spend money on them. What of the other technical aspects of the ship, fly by wire, automatic stabilization control, advanced material used in construction, turbine power, waterjet propulsion? How could they be utilized in the education of all those formerly mentioned?

Why shouldn’t we just scrap the whole idea, turn the ship into beer cans? If the people who see this letter to have no ideas, then there is no real reason to mess with it. — Elliot James — The Pegasus Project (esjames@cvalley.net)

Responses…[9 Dec 01] I have some ideas in response to the question “Can anyone help and give reasons why the marine industry, naval history, and ….” There is so much happening these days with high speed ships and craft, and there is some recognition now that some transportation modes are fast approaching gridlock; examples: the interstate highways in major metropolitan areas, the advice now to seek other modes of transport for trips of 500 miles or less due to the airline issues. On the government side, we have:

  • Naval Transformation push from Congress and OSD and now N76 in OPNAV starting an initiative on Littoral Combat Ship (LCS) under the re-structuring of DD 21
  • Recent business relationships put into place by Bollinger and Bender to build Incat and Austal designs in the US
  • Army plans for near-term procurement of Theatre Logistics Vessel (40 knot catamarans) (Press Release: Click Here)
  • Joint lease of Incat and III MEF lease of Austal (Photos: Marines Loading and Inside WestPac Express; Press Release: Click Here )

It is incumbent on all of us to promote advanced naval vehicle technology and get the word out to the general public. By looking at the attached briefing on Norwegian surface Effect Ship (SES) Fast Patrol Boat (FPB) KNM SKJOLD, you can see that the PHM-3 series ships met or exceeded all SKJOLD operational capabilities in the 1970s/80s. So there is a good story to tell on the successes of the PHM program. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)

[9 Dec 01] Reasons for staying the course: It’s fun. As long as it is not burdensome, stay with it, but don’t expect too much. Regarding a use for the ship: Skipping over the cost of an LM2500 gas turbine engine, the more serious cost is that of flying the vessel. At about 1000 gallons per hour, serious gas money is needed just to fly. Without that money the ship will be a museum. That is OK, but we have greater aspirations. The only place I know of where $1000/hour is spent for operations outside of the military or commercial passenger service is for cruise ships, yachts and small cruise vessels for yachting-like purposes. I had the experience of flying down the inland passage from Ketchecan to Vancouver on a Jetfoil about 15 years ago. There were fewer than 2 dozen people on board. The trip took two days. We stayed overnight at hotels. If we had taken a few days longer, we could have stopped at many of the more scenic locations over that 800 miles. Around the world there are at least a few places where small (more expensive) cruising is done. Of course suggestions are easy. Making one happen is not. Regarding software: I might be able to be of some assistance, particularly if the software could be written in VB. — Harry Larsen (talaria@foils.org)

Update on PHM Ex-ARIES

[31 Jul 01] We have been spending as much time as possible working on the PHM. We are having some difficulty figuring out the wire numbering. Thanks to a note book from John Monk, we were able to learn how all the equipment and compartments are numbered. We are having less luck with the wiring. I am going to be in Key West next week, I would like to talk to someone there that may have had experience with the PHM fleet operations, maybe even see what may still be around, like the hauling carts or other support equipment. If anyone could guide me in the right direction I would be very appreciative. The red tape involved with forming our non-profit organization is taking far longer than hoped but once established, we will be able to offer tax deductions for donations toward the restoration and preservation (technically “rehabilitation”) — Elliot S. James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…[31 Jul 01] The wire numbering system is standard Navy. As far as power, the number starts from the source, voltage, and then the circuit 1S would be switchboard #1. (2-13-5)-4P-2 would be the second circuit off of a power distribution breaker or fuse panel located on second deck frame 13, and would be of 450 volts. Interior communications, fire control, and electronics use a abbreviated nomenclature designations which identifies what type of circuits they are. This info is in the Electrical Information Handbook put out by Puget Sound Naval Shipyard for electricians. I don’t know if the Navy put out a design data sheet on cable numbering. Maybe someone at NAVSEA could help you. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Update on PHM Ex-ARIES

{28 Feb 01] Here is an update:

  • This is the first real winter we have had here in Missouri for a few years and it has been a real pain as far as tending the ARIES. We were ice bound in a low river for several weeks, actually about 8 inches of ice let us walk completely around the ship, at one point, the pressure on the hullborne jet nozzles caused a small leak that sealed back up when we freed and kept free the nozzles from the ice. I have attached a picture of our tender we use to work on the ship. It is the amphibious portion of a MAB, (mobil assault bridge). When the ice thawed and it begins to rain the river floods, which brings down drift that pulls the anchors we use to keep the ship away from the bank of the river, this lets the ship drift in, then when the water recedes the ship can hang up on the bank. So we use the MAB to pull it out and keep the drift clear of the bow among other things. The picture of the ship shows the drift that was stuck between the ship and bank which we had to remove before the water started to go down.
  • We were approached by a company that wanted to use the ship in a movie, they seemed very interested and had a really interesting script but this project seems to have stalled as we were supposed to hear something by January and didn’t. So we are back to establishing a non profit organization. We are applying for, and been told we are welcome to, the Historic Naval Ships Association (http://www.maritime.org/hnsa-guide.htm) as an Associate member. It is quite an organization that it seems will be very helpful in helping us establish an organization for the preservation and rehabilitation of the ARIES. Next is the establishment of a non-profit organization and applying for tax exempt status, this will let donations be tax deductible. From there, plans are to apply for accreditation with the American Association of Museums (AAM) as well as being listed in the National Register as a National Historic Landmark. I have obtained the definitions and standards from the US Department of the Interior, National Maritime Initiative and I believe we meet enough of the National Register criteria. This would open up a lot of opportunities including qualifying for grants for the preservation and rehabilitation process. We continue to be frustrated at the ineffectiveness of our FOIA requesting copies of the SOOMs that we know to exist. We have been trying since September ’97 and what we have so far is that the documents while they do exist, and are of no use to anyone other than us, in fact should have been thrown away long ago since the only applicable ships are long gone, are still stuck behind a wall of red tape. If anyone has any idea how we can get our hands on the SOOMs, or know of anyone to talk to about same, please let me know. We are working on being ready for hullborne cruising this summer and and hitting some of the larger waterfront events to sell tours of the ship to help put fuel in the tanks so that next fall we can venture south. We hope to obtain dockage someplace a lot warmer than Missouri for next winter! — Elliot S. James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Update on PHM Ex-ARIES

[15 Mar 00] Here is an update:

  • We have been working on an Integrated Bridge System (IBS). We are creating our own due to the lack of knowledge of commercially available systems. This will enable one person to monitor all ship functions, conning, and navigation from the bridge, the navigation station, or EOS. Our experience is based on industrial automation and “Man Machine Interfacing” (MMI). The commercially available marine control units that I have seen, electronic steering systems or engine control for instance, have all been based on this technology but often use proprietary hardware packaged in a nice enclosure and carried an astronomical price tag with less functionality.
  • We have solved a big hurdle in power generation. there are about 40 different 400 hz motors on the ship from fuel pumps to vent fans as well as nearly that many florescent 400 hz lights. These units save significant space and weight above commercially available 60 hz units , are far superior in construction (and should be for the price of new ones), are cheap on the surplus market because few others use them, and most importantly, are all in place, and in good working order. The challenge has been in constructing a power plant to power both the 400 hz as well as the new 60 hz loads. We had quotes on having inverters built but the cost was nearly $150,000.00. All the surplus motor generators we have found are for lower voltage and are extremely heavy. We were just about settled on building a custom gearbox to drive 2 generator ends from one diesel engine. Again, we found our answer in our own industry. Variable Frequency Drives (VFDs) have been in use to change speed of 3 phase motors for many years. They are made to ramp up and down but if we compensate with a large enough unit, we can drop motors on and off line with no problem, we consulted the factory on this and while they never heard of using a VFD for a power supply and they were a little tentative in saying it was OK, their engineer could not give any reason that it wouldn’t work fine. We purchased a small one (off of www.Ebay.com no less) that would go up to 400 hz. It is rated for 20 kva and only weighs about 40 lb. We took the 400 lb. 12 kva motor generator and the 200 lb. of transformers (needed to boost output to 440 volts), that run basic ship systems, (lights, fresh water pumps etc.) off line and wired in the VFD. In testing it works great. These units are made for integrating into MMIs and will be far easier to incorporate to the IBS that any other unit. New, a unit to run the entire ship 400 hz equipment would cost $50,300.00, but because these are so prolific in industry, I have found 2, three year old units for $5,000.00 each and think I can do better. I can enclose them in a NEMA 12,stainless steel, enclosure and be far more “marinized” than what was originally aboard.
  • The lights still hum at that high freq. but being a VFD we can “tune” the resonance out and quiet them a bit so they are now quieter than when we used the generator. We have not been able to tune out the hum from the lighting isolation transformers that change 440 v 400 hz to 110 v 400 hz. Since the VFD is not quite as “clean” as a generator, the resonance moves in and out between the three transformers like three flutes almost in tune with each other. There is no extra heat building up, just noisy. Is there another way to quiet the hum in the transformers?
  • We are mounting the hydraulic pumps on electric motors. By running them through their own VFDs. we can reduce idle horsepower requirements as well as add the ability to have a fully variable bow thruster instead of just on or off as it was originally (again through the MMI). One of the major advantages to this approach is that instead of building a custom diesel power unit, we can use a common commercially available 60 hz. gen. set. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Update on PHM Ex-ARIES

[13 Jun 99] We had visitors Sat. June 12. Jon Coile, LT, USN, Chief Engineer, USS GEMINI (PHM-6) 1987-1988; Tony Martonosi, LCDR,USNR, Combat Systems Officer, USS GEMINI 1987-1988; Stan Cook, CDR, USNR, Combat Systems Officer, USS GEMINI 1985-1987, Combat Systems Officer, COMPHMRON 2 1987. And Eric Wuebbles all flew up to a local airport in Jon Coile’s plane and spent the morning going over the ship. They were very enthusiastic to say the least! A lot of great stories were told, and a lot was learned about day to day operations of a PHM. As far as an update on the restoration:

  • We are currently calling the job: “The PEGASUS Project.” The decision has been made that we will not attempt to completely restore the ship to flying condition before sailing again. While we will constantly work toward that goal, and no work will be done that would need undone in order to fly, we want to restore the ship in all other aspects first. Then we will schedule some sailing time to help us “keep the faith” as well as generate some outside interest in sponsors. No doubt there is nothing like the sight of this ship moving through the water to generate questions; where there are people asking questions there is interest.
  • Currently we are designing shipboard power generation. Nearly all the power used on this ship is 400 cycle. There are far too many of these specialized motors all ready installed not to use 400 hz power. We have spares and while the aerospace quality parts are super expensive if we had to buy new, they are a relative bargain surplus since most people haven’t a clue what 400 hz means. We are leaning toward replacing the 250 kw turbine units that gulp about 50 gph whether they are loaded or not with 855T Cummins power connected to a custom gearbox that will drive a high speed 400 cycle generator as well as high speed 60 cycle generator along with a hydraulic pump. The high speed generators (4000 to 6000 rpm) will allow us to keep the package as small as possible to help compensate for the larger engine. The Cummins is large but very reliable and economical to buy, rebuild and maintain. After conceiving this plan we happened upon a genset that utilizes this very idea, a ground power unit that supplies 400 hz, 60 hz, and 28 VDC to idle aircraft. This unit uses a 6 cyl horizontally opposed Lycoming aircraft gas engine but we may be able to use parts. The HVAC system will be converted to 60 hz. and will be the only large addition to the minimal 60 hz equipment currently on board. Can someone tell me the effects that 400 hz has on resistive loads? Nearly all of the resistive loads aboard our PHM (i.e. heaters) are 400 hz but appear and test out with an ohm meter common to 60 hz figures for similar power requirements. While inductive loads like transformers and motors obviously rely on frequency is there any reason 60 hz resistive loads and 400 hz resistive loads can not be interchanged? As for circuit breakers, we examined both the 400 and 60 hz and can find no real difference. I am having trouble finding information on the when, where, why, and how to use 400 cycle power and would be grateful for any info.
  • As it turns out there is not enough of the original Automatic Control System (ACS) left to restore. Given current advancements in PC based controls coupled with PLCs in not only industrial automation but marine technology as covered in recent IHS articles, this is becoming less of an obstacle. While we have the hydraulic actuators, I understand that electric actuation is becoming more popular? Any thoughts?

We are currently doing more planning than wrench turning but at least we are moving forward. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Update on PHM Ex-ARIES

[30 Oct 97] We finally made it to Missouri. Got some great pictures of our ship under the St. Louis Arch. There was an opening on the waterfront and we just pulled in like we owned the joint. The trip took about 45 days and covered over 2100 miles the ship performed excellent. our only mechanical problems were with the 60 cyl genset and our launch. The foils do hinder us in docking so we spent most nights anchored. The reception we received was exactly the same from SC to MO, amazement! If we were paid one buck for every picture that was taken we could have bought a brand new LM2500 for cash! Everyone we met had the same questions, “What is it?” and “What are you going to do with it?” initially the questions were answered with great detail,talks about restoration and preservation, were carried out with boats putting alongside yelling to one another. Eventually that got tiresome as you can imagine!! The answers got shorter! no matter where we were we had company, it became quite comical to see boaters running along side with the resident expert explaining the operation of the foils always using his arms in the same sweeping motions. When we did dock for fuel and supplies we were always treated as royalty, dredges gave way to us and lockmasters gave us the lock to ourselves, the foils made the lockage tricky but we never had a problem. We had to change the name of the ex-Aries for the DRMO so we used Pegasus, The original is gone now for good. don’t worry Barney I got the spelling right on the Coast Guard forms. I also promise never to refer to foils as wings. Both acts of temporary stupidity rather than ignorance, plus I can’t spell or type for beans. This update is obviously of no technical value just to let you in on what’s happening. Thanks for the info on FOIA it’s a big help I will send you some current pictures if your interested of both our ship and of PHM-1 getting cut up (ghastly photos) — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

[6 Aug 97] In a deal made with the company that purchased the other five PHMs for scrapping we have traded the ex-HERCULES PHM-2 for the ex-ARIES PHM-5, the only PHM that still had the foils attached. We outfitted this ship with original MTU diesels for hullborne ferry back to Missouri. The engine installation is complete as is the hydraulic system, electrical system (consisting of one 60-cycle genset and one 400 cycle genset) as well as a new PLC controller for control. This computer let us retain the original helm, and electro-hydraulic actuators that operated the steering and thrust reversers as well as monitor the power train. The manuals that IHS helped us acquire have been helpful! The set has included a few of the Systems Operations and Onboard Maintenance Manuals (SOOMMs). If anyone has any other of like text we would be very interested in hearing from you. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

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They Want a PHM

[27 Apr 02] . I am currently active duty Navy, AO3, about to become MA3. I am interested in the location, owner as well as any and all information you may have reguarding the remaining PHMs. If the current owner is still willing to sell one of the survivers, it is my intention, as well as some potential investors, to save one for museum use. I am currently stationed in Pa. at NAS Willow Grove, which is near the former Phila. Naval Shipyard. The yard still maintains a reserve fleet as well as surplus equipment. It is possible to aquire demilitarized equipment there (with some string-pulling) for museum and private use. Metro Machine is presently scrapping ships and selling off fittings and equipment at the yard as well. Perhaps you may be able to find some articles which are non-specific to the ‘foils there. If you have any questions or comments, please feel free to contact me. Oh, and if you have any other pictures of the “girls” which aren’t so painful I would be very grateful to see them — Brian S. Bell (ezrip@comcast.net)

[1 Apr 01] I’m planning a trip on to inspect PHMs for possible purchase. Can’t afford MTUs; I’m considering 12V92 on original gears. As a project junkie, I’ve taken on cars and busses before but this one scares the hell out of me. Would appreciate all opinions, info, on the following:

  • Is the idea of using base hull for a pleasure craft conversion nuts?
  • Can hull withstand (Cajun shrimper budget bottom Job method) of dragging onto shore via greased Hhriz. pylons for rails like we do shrimpboat bottom jobs for restore. Sure to make the locals in Grand Isle talk.
  • Doubt it will ever fly but very interested in your limp home PLC nav and control package.
  • What would you do different in getting it home, details, planning, and logistics to expect if I prove foolish enough to attempt this project.

— Arthur M. (“Bo”) Hoover (amh@tsgcom.com); Technical Services Group; 12015 Cloverland Court; Baton Rouge, LA 70809; Phone: 225-751-9800; Fax: 225-753-1726; website: www.tsgcom.com.


Engines for PHM Foilborne Operation

PHM Foilborne Propulsors – Info Wanted

[13 Jan 02] Eliot James says that you might be able to tell me where to look for some info on the PHM drive pumps (the big ones, that is). I need to know : What is the thrust rating? What is the material used in the impellers and stators? — E J Potter (potterej@cmsinter.net)

Responses…[13 Jan 02] I think the thrust rating would be equal to the battle override setting on the LM-2500 for production PHMs, which was about 117% of rated HP on the pump (1.17 x 18,000 metric HP), and I think the primary material used for the pump was Inconel 625, but I’m not positive about that. You would need to research the PHM-3 Specs to find out for sure. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)

[13 Jan 02] We suggest you purchase the AMV CD-ROM for US$ 5.00 offered by IHS. The Building Specs for the PHM 3 Class are included among the documents provided, and there are several pages devoted to the foilborne propulsors. One caution is that the text of this spec makes frequent references to the PHM drawings, which are not available on the CD-ROM. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)

Main Propulsion Engines For PHM Restoration

[26 Oct 00] We continue to investigate foilborne re-power options for our PHM. The current thinking is to wait for the availability of surplus LM2500s, we are looking for other options should that one be too far in the future. I would like anyone’s opinion on the subject. This ship used the GE LM2500 engine de-tuned to approx. 19000 hp. We have everything from the gearbox rearward that connects to the output shaft of the LM2500. I believe this to be at 3000 rpm. Due to space considerations, there is no container around the LM2500, instead, a room was built to house the engine and is still in place. As is the exhaust ducting that was fabricated specifically for the ship. What we would need is the engine and controller. The engine used was the twin shank model LM 2500, but we would consider any suitable replacement. I have been told that the ship would fly with less hp, especially since we have much less weight due to the removal of armament. Could you suggest a less expensive alternative power plant, perhaps a LM1500? Is the LM1600 I see in your literature a LM1500 derivative? I also understand that the LM2500 is more fuel efficient due to higher compression, and burns less fuel than the LM1500. Is this true? How much fuel would each burn at? I would appreciate some costs based on supplying the engine and controls, while we would do the installation. Any other information as to maintenance cost per hour would be helpful. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Responses…[26 Oct 00] Best bang for the buck would be to use an LM-1500 unit. They are however rated at only 13,500 shaft horsepower at ISO conditions. We do have a hot section upgrade package available that bumps the potential output to 15,000 shaft horsepower, continuous. The original LM-2500 units when de-tuned to 19,000 horsepower were not very fuel efficient, on the order of 28% @ full power, and considerably less efficient at partial loads. An LM-1500 is about 26% efficient at full power, and less at partial loads. With the hot section upgrade, this is bumped up .5% The biggest difference between the -1500 and the -2500 is the power turbine assembly. (The assembly that converts the engine exhaust thrust to rotary horsepower.) The -2500s use a two or five stage power turbine which is more efficient than the single stage power turbine used on the -1500’s. People think the -2500 engine is more efficient, but it’s really not. Only at high outputs and temperatures does the -2500 get better fuel economy. (26,000+ Hp.) The LM-1600 is a completely different engine line [not recommended]. — S&S Turbine Services, LTD (email: ssturbine@solarwinds.com)

[26 Oct 00] I don’t know if you are aware of this but the horsepower limit for normal operations was actually set at approximately 16,700 HP. That was the normal output we used, and not the higher setting of 19,400 hp. There was a switch at the Engineering Operator Station (EOS) console labeled “High Torque Limiting” and when we threw that switch, the electronics allowed the parameters to go up to an output of approximately 19,400 hp. In 700 foilborne hours on the USS GEMINI I can only remember going to High Torque Limiting once, when chasing a 38′ Cigarette boat with five hundred pounds of cocaine onboard (We caught back up to him and nabbed him. We seized the boat and two of our Coasties drove it home to Key West. The driver got 30 years). We may have demonstrated it to INSURV too, but that was about it. The limiting factor at the higher power settings were the foilborne propulsor inlet and outlet pressures. We had flexible rubber sections in the ducts and I don’t know if this had ever happened but we always accelerated slowly so we didn’t build up too much suction on the inlet side and suck in the flexible sections. Don’t tell anybody, but when we went to High Torque Limiting to get the smuggler we were way over the red line on the outlet pressure, but didn’t exceed the inlet suction limit. We had been chasing the guy for 54 minutes at about 200 yards and couldn’t quite catch up to him. It was a dead heat, but he was leaping out of the water on waves and banging around bad. About 10 minutes before the end, he turned down seas and tried to run back to the Bahamas. We didn’t want to lose at this point so the Captain and I talked and decided to go for it. We went to High Torque Limiting and caught right back up with him, when he broke down. If it would have gotten us anything we would have gone to Battle Override too, but the HT Limiting was the “Nitrous Switch” for the PHM. We were fully loaded with fuel, missiles, 300 rounds for the gun, etc. and we were going just over 56 Knots. Normal cruise back then was 95% power and the GEMINI would go about 48 knots at that setting. ARIES was equally fast at the time, and the others were all slower. AQUILA was a dog and would only get a little over 40 knots at that setting. ARIES, GEMINI, and AQUILA flew from Honduras to Jamaica in formation one night and we had to slow down to the speed of the slowest PHM, AQUILA. You got one of the fast ones in the ex-ARIES. Bottom line, In my operators opinion, as opposed to the real engineers you have also sent this e-mail to, I’m guessing you could fly your PHM with the LM1500 if you can make it fit the gearbox. Note: I got the package for the sale of the other PHMs in Charleston, but there is nothing left there worth saving. Sad. — Jon Coile, Former Chief Engineer, USS GEMINI (PHM 6) 1987-88 (jon@coile.com)

P.S. I swear on a stack of bibles that the 56 knots was true. On my last underway on the GEMINI we were going into the shipyard at Mayport FL so we had offloaded all the ammo and Harpoons in Key West. We flew up the Florida Coast and had burned off most of the fuel. Just before we pulled in, I heard after I woke up, that the Captain wound her up to see what she would do at extremely light load. I was told 63 knots, but as I slept through this I can’t verify it. I personally saw 56 Knots so that is as fast as I can verify.

Other Posted Message on PHM Engines…

[30 Oct 97] We finally got the ship to Missouri. It will be a while before we will be in the position to spend more money, but we are doing a hard search now for any and all info we can obtain. Since initial investigation tells us that a LM2500 sells for about US$2 million, we wonder where else to look besides the USA? Or at alternative power plants. While LM1500s can be had for considerably less, it is our understanding that they are not nearly as fuel efficient as the more modern LM2500. But how much less? Our ship has lost almost 100 tons of weight from the equipment removed, and since the LM2500 was detuned to a max of 19000 hp we are assuming the LM1500 would provide enough but at what price of efficiency? Would the additional pieces necessary to convert an aircraft engine to a marine unit be any easier to acquire or even a feasible alternative, and if so what is the aircraft engine designation? Where would be the best place to look for parts? — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

[19 Nov 97] The day may come when you can buy an LM2500 as military surplus. The US Navy is downsizing and inactivating ships such as the FFGs that use this engine. I heard recently that the Navy is buying many new storage containers so they can mothball the extra engines that come from these ships. Eventually they will decide they have too many and decide to surplus them, so you should try to be ready for that opportunity. You might want to contact the US Navy’s Inventory Manager for LM2500s and see what the prospects are for LM2500s going into surplus. If the Inventory Manager is interested in your project, she might volunteer to contact you when and if some engines are going to become available. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)

[23 Feb 98] The LM2500 inventory manager is Ms. Shirley J. Thompson, Inventory Management Specialist. Her phone is 703-602-0401 x302. Her email address, if it follows the format of other NAVSEA address that I am familiar with will be Thompson_Shirley@hq.navsea.navy.mil. Mailing address is as follows: Attn: Shirley L. Thompson (Code 03F3, NC3 10W16); Naval Sea Systems Command; 2531 Jefferson Davis Highway; Arlington VA 22242-5171, USA. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)

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PHM Fuel Line Problems
[02 Jun 98] I spent three years as an Interior Communications Electrician 2nd Class with PHMs in Key West, 2 as a trainer and 1 on the Herc. The photo of all six hydrofoils “up” was a rare time, and as I recall one needed everything it had plus prayers form the rest to stay up for the photo. What I’m getting at is, they all leaked some kind of fluid at one time or another. The lines and fittings were all subject to high vibrations during foilborne ops and needed watching all the time. On our engineering walk throughs we carried rags, a flash light, and communications (another nightmare) to wipe up LEAKS and report anything out of the ordinary. Boeing was our supplier of parts, so that may be a source for you. You might try the shipyards the ships went to for overhaul (I think they were Runyan Shipyards in Pensacola and Bellinger Shipyards in Jacksonville), they might have some parts or drawings. Another source for drawings might be the civilian engineering branch of the Navy (NAVSEA). It is a brave and noble thing you have taken on and if you need any help, e-mail me. — James M. Hupe (whopay@thruston.com)

[30 Oct 97 ] Of all the work we have done, our only real trouble has been with the stainless steel tubing that makes up much of the plumbing. In particular the low pressure lines for the air and fuel systems. The air lines have numerous cracks we keep chasing and the fuel line fittings that connect the engines to the main lines are fragile. Of four check valves we tried to use, all four had cracks from over torque. These are valves that came straight from the other ships. From all indications they must have seeped fuel when they were last in service. Does anyone remember fuel leaking problems? All the stainless steel lines appear to use a modified compression fitting. While conventional compression fittings require the nut to force the sleeve to compress onto the line (not a design I have ever favored) these lines seem to use a special sleeve. Some sort of special tool must be inserted into the line and then expand the line into recesses in the sleeve. This system appears to me to be a wonderful combination of the simplicity of the compression fitting and the seal capability of a flare without the drawbacks of either. Does anyone know of such a tool? Given the cracking problem we have seen I wonder if there is a special annealing process? — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net), Custom Composites Company; RR 2 Box 192; Salibury MO 65281-9664; 816-777-3300 voice; 816-777-3302 fax.

[25 Nov 97] The fittings on PHM were mostly Mil-Std. There is a special tool to swage the fittings on. I have talked to others that were on the PHM program but no one could remember any leak problems. It could be because of long term stowage with salt water caused erosion on the ss tubing. Over-torquing of the fittings can cause leakage at the fittings. I recall that PHM 5 had problems getting fuel to the turbine through the filter. I remember lines being opened to check for blockage, and the filter dismantled but no obvious problem was detected. I don’t know if it was completely resolved. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

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PHM Automatic Control System
[3 Jun 00] I know that Marc has located the manuals that we need and hopefully that info can be released by the Navy. It would definitely help us, especially now that we are getting into the electrical system redesign. Without more accurate information, We have to find all the equipment we intend to keep. Make a list of the power and control wire numbering, then trace it down to one of two switch stations then trace the control wires to EOS and motor protection to two more stations. We cannot remove any wire until we know that we will not need it so this is a very slow process indeed. Many of the systems we are redesigning, such as the HVAC ours will be significantly simpler but it is important to figure out how the original works in order to know what to keep. In conversations with Danny Jordan with MAPC., I understand that the single biggest engineering feat for constructing an Automatic Control System (ACS) for our PHM is the control algorithms. Would this info me among that Marc has located? We are pushing very hard to have her ready for a hull born cruise by the end of this summer/fall. If we could confirm dockage through the winter, we could shoot for Key West. That would be an ideal spot for a PHM reunion! We would like to have at least a prototype ACS to test out hullborne. There are areas if we go to Kentucky Lake that we could extend the foils and but not if this drought continues. Being in the Gulf of Mexico will allow us to record the effectiveness of the ACS in stabilizing wouldn’t it? — Elliot S. James (esjames@cvalley.net)

[8 Aug 99] Have you heard about using pressure transducers as means of measuring flight height / foil depth? Wave spray problems would be eliminated, and the cost of even the most sensitive transducer would be a fraction of a radar setup or even the sonic system. As I understand, there is an increase in atmospheric pressure that provides lift at low altitude to an airfoil known as ground effect when the airfoil is within close proximity to the ground. Since air and water are both fluid wouldn’t this also apply to a hydrofoil and if so, given the increase in density of water wouldn’t the effective distance, or height, be greater if not enough to effect lift perhaps enough to effect a transducer sensitive enough to gauge the few psi difference between high flight and broaching? (is broaching the correct term for coming out of the water or just a good way to cook chicken?) — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…[8 Aug 99] Various methods of sensing height has been tried, mostly as research projects at Boeing. Pressure transducers have been tried, as well as leading edge sensors. In all cases, it was determined that the reliability of data was lacking. Of course, over the years, improvements have been made on sensors and may warrant another study. A sensor reading the foil depth by measuring up to the water surface was also tried. The problem is when the ship broaches. A broach in boat terms is when the hull is out of the water. In a submerged hydrofoil foil, we considered a broach when the foil was in aerated water where loss of lift occurs. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Response…

[8 Aug 99] This is the system used on QUEST‘s Motion Controller as designed by Danny Jordan at Maritime Applied Physics Corporation (MAPC). It worked very well. — John Meyer (jmeyer@erols.com)

[8 Oct 97] I am very interested in information on submerged hydrofoil control systems. We are looking to replace the ACS on our PHM-5 ex-ARIES (renamed PEGASUS because the DRMO requires a name change, and the original PEGASUS is no more) we have a mostly complete spare set of controls (yoke input and servo cylinder actuators) and are planning to construct a working simulator “on the bench”. The ACS used in our PHM needs replacing. While we have most of the parts I believe it would be cost prohibitive to restore this system. We built a PLC system using D to A / A to D equipment for control of the steering and thrust reversers as well as the throttles, but the foilborne controls will need more processing speed. Also there is the interface of gyros and accelerometers. The yoke and foil cylinders have not only dc position pots but 400 cyl resolvers. We have sonic height sensors but the radar system is gone and advice from others tells us the former is inferior to the latter but replacement cost for the radar units is high. What method for height sensing would you consider? And interface that to the pc control how? Any info is appreciated — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…[10 Oct 97] In response to your inquiry, I could only go by memory since I sent all the data I had collected in my file cabinets to DTNSRDC Carderock, now called Naval Surface Warfare Center – Carderock Division. I called a retired Boeing ACS engineer who had very little memory of what was done, so I have to be very vague on the subject. I have added Jim King as copy to: where maybe he could access some of the data I will refer to here.

  • A trial plan was established and funded to use an IBM PC, original 8086 type with about a 10mb hard disk and D to A and A to D converters to tie into the HIGH POINT ACS. The HIGH POINT ACS maintained the ability to take over control by default relay switching when the control output voltage comparison varied over a set limit. The algorithms were programmed to be exactly like the analog ACS. I believe it was written in Basic and compiled. All sensors and hydraulic servos work with voltage. The synchros use the three R leads with voltage application or output on the other two points. This can be converted to providing positioning digitally by sampling the voltage levels. At one time, some companies provided cards to convert synchro signals for digital use. Very few sensors used by the ACS require high sampling rates, therefore processing speed does not appear to be a problem. HIGH POINT actuators do not have the dual system as I believe the PHM has. The complexity of the ACS algorithms increases with the PHM system. The retired ACS engineer thought with the modules containing the major circuits of the ACS, you would probably be far ahead to refurbish the analog system, than to try to program and interface the computer with the existing hydraulic servos and feedback sensors. He felt regardless of neglect, the modules would most likely be useable with just a solvent bath. The wire wrap and connectors probably will need more maintenance. Manuals were written that provided test points and readings in the checkout of the ACS.
  • As for the height sensor, the radar unit was a standard TRT aircraft altimeter with a modification to provide an output of 100 mv / ft instead of the standard 4 mv / ft. A schematic of this modification was provided in the technical manuals for the radar unit. These altimeters are used in many military and commercial aircraft. The radar unit with its coded pulse proved to be impervious to outside signals, thus provided a better reliability. The sonic units provided satisfactory indication to the ACS for height control under normal flight. The sonic units were susceptible to outside noise, such as gun fire and susceptible to jamming. Originally, Boeing designed cut out circuits to maintain height stability when known noise was encountered. Thus, the sonic units should provide you satisfactory flight under most conditions. I suppose you heard of the ship broaching when the toilet was flushed. Again, the output of the height sensor is a voltage level. Sampling of the voltage level is the only input necessary as part of the programming for the PC.
  • All of the ACS factory test equipment was turned over to Kawasaki when the Jetfoil design was licensed to them. I do not know if Kawasaki is still using the Boeing analog equipment or have replaced the ACS with their own design of current state of the art. They might be able to provide some support in getting the ACS in operational condition.As Head of the Hydrofoil Special Trials Unit, most of my involvement in these projects was from an administrative position. With my engineering background, I tried to keep the engineers honest by asking questions and following the progress, but did not get involved in the day-to-day details of design. Again, my inputs to you are from memory which occurred over 10 years ago. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)


What To Do With a PHM

PHM Sighting in South Carolina…

[3 Sep 01] At approximately 7:15 p.m. on Tuesday, July 24th, 2001 a commercial tug (northbound on the Intracoastal Waterway) passed the Belle Isle Yacht Club (Georgetown, SC), pushing two Navy hydrofoils, stern first. Do you know which hydrofoils they were and what their destination was? I have about 30 seconds of amateurish video of the event. — Bob Miller (CBbi@aol.com)

Response…[3 Sep 01] Presumably two of the PHM Class, which are up for scrapping. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)

Need PHM Status Today…

[2 Sep 01] I took note of the pic in your photo gallery of the three ‘foils as they appear today. My question to you is whether you have any information regarding their location either in that pic or at present, as well as scrapping progress. I’ve spoken to fellow Naval Reservists like myself who would like to see one saved from the heap. Any information you could supply would be of great help to get some kind of ball rolling if possible. Thank you for your time and for actually having a current picture. — IT3 Brian S. Bell USNR (RIP2262@aol.com)

Last Chance to Buy Decommissioned PHM Hydrofoils…

[30 Aug 00] We have been unsuccessful in obtaining a solid buyer for the remaining PHMs, and we are losing dock space in Charleston SC. Therefore we are reducing the price of the vessels to the following: 2 PHMs – US$75,000 each and 2 damaged PHMs – US$40,000 each. If you have a serious offer and are interested in the boats, you need to respond quickly, as the purpose of the reduction is to avoid the expense of relocating the vessels. PHM particulars are: Length 132′ x 28 ‘ beam, design displacement 237 Lt fully loaded with 7’6″ draft. Advanced design by Boeing features high speed and maneuverability with long cruising range. Built for all-weather, high sea state operation. Max. speed 22 kts with 800 hp diesels (not incl) and excess of 70 kts with LM 2500 GE turbine (not incl). Vessels have been demilitarized. Original hydrofoils are available. Information package available. Call Emmett Crews 352-787-0608 or send email: ecrews@fcsco.com or rbolen@fcsco.com

Response…[31 Aug 00] This is sad to say the least. The production PHMs cost about $65M each in the late 1970s. — Mark Bebar

[8 Jun 98] If sponsorship could be established, what is the feasibility of setting the all-time record for circling the globe for a marine vessel? Since we lost approx. 100 tons of weapon related equipment fuel containers could be built to replace them. Would this give the range necessary for the longest part of the journey? I understand this record is currently held by a sailing vessel known as “Sport-Elec”. 71 days I believe. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

[10 Oct 99] We consider to convert one of the last 4 PHMs in a mini cruise vessel. Unfortunately are no lines plans and others available by the seller, and the reason that we contact you is the question, if you know where and how we can get such information! — Volker Gries, Naval Architect, Charlotte NC (grivotec@sprynet.com)

Response…[10 Oct 99] The following comments are offered in response to your interesting inquiry. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)

  • Before buying one of the remaining PHMs, please be sure that you can get the foils. My understanding is that these were removed from all but one of the PHMs, and that vessel has been bought by one of our members B.J. Meinhardt. Although the ship’s are aluminum hulled, the foils are a 17-4ph precipitation hardened steel… impossible to recreate if they do not exist… also tricky to weld-repair if they still do exist (you would need to get a copy of the weld repair procedure). The ships were also stripped of their LM2500 gas turbine main propulsion engines. However, the Navy must have many of these stockpiled now due to mass decommissioning of ships, so it should be possible to get one surplus for a reasonable price. IHS could possibly give you some leads to follow up on there, if you are seriously interested.
  • You should read about the efforts of BJ Meinhardt and Elliot James to restore the PHM they bought. This includes technical discussions of various types and discussions of where to get documentation. Look at both the new/uncategorized section as well as the PHM section of these posted messages. You may want to collaborate with these two individuals, or at least “pick their brains” for lessons learned from their efforts to date.
  • Technical data and drawings are hard to come buy… Both Boeing and the NAVSEA Project Office turned their data over to the government for storage, and probably some or all of it has been routinely purged by now. However, it is not hopeless, and there are IHS members who can help you track down data. Also there is the method of submitting Freedom of Information Act requests.
  • It is quite possible to buy a used commercial hydrofoil vessel. Just a few of the many for sale from Russia and elsewhere are listed on our website in the announcements section, and you should also look at the posted messages in this section concerning how to buy a hydrofoil tour boat or ferry. Most or all of the used vessels for sale will be of the surface-piercing hydrofoil variety… less sophisticated and capable than a restored PHM would be, but this could have advantages (lower cost of conversion and less risk) to offset the disadvantages.

2nd Response…

[11 Oct 99] BOY, do I agree with you, Barney! PHM would not be a good cruise ship, anyway. Your suggestion of a surplus Russky boat also good. Another choice in that speed range might be the Navy’s SES 200, which is very roomy and in operating shape. — Nat Kobitz (kobitzn@ctc.com)

3rd Response…

[18 Oct 99] Please note that since the PHMs were decomm’d in 1993, all of the technical information (Shipboard Operations and Maintenance Manual) has been purged. I was able to rescue some of this just before destruction and provide it to Mr. Meinhardt. To my knowledge, there is not a duplicate of this information available. You may want to follow up with John Monk to confirm this. — Mark Bebar, Naval Sea Systems Command (bebar@foils.org)


Drydocking of PHMs
[8 Aug 99] As you may know we have the last PHM with foils. She is tied to some cottonwoods floating in the Grand river at Brunswick Missouri awaiting restoration. I am interested if there are technical drawings for drydocking? Bringing the ship out of the water is something we have been giving some thought to but we were present when the scrappers tried to lift the original PEGASUS out of the water. They had 12″ wide straps built specifically for the job, but when they attempted to sling her with a large barge crane they ripped the hull open. They had to stop lifting but she took on a lot of water fast. Now the ship would sink if they let the crane loose to reattach, so the only crane capable of lifting her had to hold her afloat. They were able to dog the hatches, and pump the rest of the ship, then reattach at the 3 points where the foils attached, like they should have done in the first place. The foils had been removed and the stub that stuck out was an easy place to hook to, but when they attempted to lift she wiggled away again and dropped back to the water. Eventually the crane and determined scrappers won out, and once atop the seawall the ship disappeared quickly. PHM-1 PEGASUS put up a tremendous fight right up to the end, and we obviously would like a better way of getting our hull dry. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…[8 Aug 99] PHMs were built in the airplane assembly plant at Boeing Renton. Boeing used cradles with airplane jacks and dolly wheels to move the ships and launch them into the lake using a seaplane ramp. Considerable work was done at Key West to utilize this concept for docking the PHMs. Docking plans were made for setting the blocks to drydock the PHMs in standard floating or otherwise drydocks. Boeing did design a drydock for the Jetfoil. Nickum and Spaulding reviewed the drawings and commented on the construction and stability features. I do not know if any were built, if so, it would have been overseas. I am surprised that an attempt to lift PHM with a crane was made. Even with the foils and struts removed, and in light ship condition, it would take an extremely large capacity for the lift. Lifting the HIGH POINT, we had two 100 ton cranes with a spreader and four steel mesh belly bands about 3 feet wide. The spreader was also rigged to allow lifting with one hammerhead crane a Puget Sound Naval Shipyard. Page 82 of the “Twenty Foilborne Years” has a picture of this lift of the HIGH POINT. Subsequent modifications to HIGH POINT were made to install lifting pads for easier crane attachment. — Sumi Arima (arimas1.juno.com)

Response…

[8 Aug 99] At the time we closed down COMPHMRON TWO in December of 93 the haul-out cradle was located in Key West at the new docking and haul-out site @ Truman Annex. Paul Sharp from Boeing, (somewhere in the Boeing Space Station Program) who was in charge of the Boeing close-out effort might remember if the haul out cradle and all it’s wheels were sent to scrap. But one quick way to find out if it’s still there is to have Les Jackson take a look or maybe it’s enough of an excuse to make a trip to Key West to check it out! I do know that all of the holding fixtures for the ship were sent to scrap in Key West and sold. It’s also possible that no one purchased them or that if they did they are still intact in some junk yard someplace. The drawings for the haul-out cradle were down at PHMRON2 when the base was closed, and if we could locate some of the personnel who were in the S 4 shop at that time, they might know what happened to them. I believe the lifting spreader bar and slings were sent to Cheatham Annex (Williamsburg, VA) along with the other ship unique material. — John Monk (marymonk@msn.com)


Upper Constraints on PHM Speed…

MLSG Recollection

[31 May 03] I was attached to MLSG from 83-85 as an EN, working on the hullborne engines, hydraulics and propulsion systems. The ships crews were always talking about doing 55-58 knots at less than full power. — Steven R. Matkovich EN3, PHMRON II MLSG (danimatkob1@msn.com)

[19 Nov 00] We are contemplating some speed record attempts and have been discussing max. speeds of the PHM. Is it possible to exceed 60 knot based on the current design? I have been told that 60 knots is approx. the equivalent in the water to the sound barrier in the air. The entire design of craft propulsion goes from “subcavitating” to “supercavitating”. I am told that we have an operational limit of around 60 knots, no matter how much horsepower we shove to her before cavitation begins to eat us up. Another place where we will gain speed with less hp is in drag reduction. We no longer have a 50 foot plus mast sticking strait up in the air and there are other places we can make her more slick to help reduce drag. If 60 knots is out max. because of design, how much hp will be required to get there considering drag reduction more than weight since we will probably replace our lower weight with fuel for the distance. — Elliot S. James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Responses…[19 Nov 00] You are right about cavitation. That is the big problem. It has a lot to do with foil loading. So, the lighter the ship the faster it will go with the power you are able to pull and transmit to the water. Removal of a mast and reduction in air drag is OK, but it will not be much. — John Meyer (jmeyer@erols.com)

[19 Nov 00] What criteria are you willing to accept in measuring speed? I vaguely recall the number 57 knots on PLAINVIEW measured by the EM Log (I believe Frank Hudson was the skipper when the PLAINVIEW attained its top speed). This is not a very accurate device, especially when you are operating near the MACH 1 equivalent where the sensor is not operating in good laminar flow. To reach this number, a couple of red lines were exceeded. I believe the speed record is held by the FRESH-1, which is in the vicinity of 70 knots. Since FRESH-1 has super cavitating foils, I do not believe PHM could approach that number with its foil system. The MACH 1 equivalent in water is somewhat different than in air since water does not compress. I am not sure what the consequences are, some hydrodynamicist will have to do the explaining, but the cavitation is a detriment to lift and drag. Some loss of control could occur with the flaps working in air. This was the primary reason for the FRESH-1 ‘s accident. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

[21 Nov 00] Just thought I would chime in on the speed issue. I was riding ARIES during trials at Puget Sound Naval Shipyard (PSNS) and we were doing 61 knots(according to the speed log on the bridge) on Puget Sound. It seemed like we could go faster, but the Boeing people on the bridge were worried about “cavitation” and the possibility of the ship broaching. They considered it a real possibility if we went any faster. I rode ARIES many times during my stint at MLSG and she cruised at 55 knots no problem. — Chuck Shannon, ET MLSG ’82-’86 (ChuckE68@aol.com)

[23 Nov 00] The max speed I saw while with PLAINVIEW was approximately 52 knots. Shortly thereafter, we were restricted to max of 40 knots because trial data and modeling predictions were not tracking re: lateral forces on the struts. There was concern that, under certain conditions, an instantaneous change in the direction of force could occur. — Steve Duich (Duich_Steve@AEPCO.com)

[23 Nov 00] I believe at least one of the production PHMs made 58 knots. The ship may have been in less than full load condition and there was a Battle Override conditon specified for the production boats. The boat had to be in Battle Override to make that speed. I checked my copy of the PHM 3 ship specifications, and the LM 2500 GT power level input requirements to the foilborne reduction were as follows: Continuous (100%) Power Input: 17,000 metric horsepower; Battle Override (max intermittent): 115.8% of continuous power = 19,686 metric horsepower. You are right in saying that 60 knots could introduce cavitation problems both in the pump and with the foil system. The PHM-3 series (production boats) had very good foil contour tolerances and were cavitation-free at higher speeds than PHM-1. I am not sure if there was cavitation 58 knots was attained, but there may well have been some foil cavitation. Clearly, you would need more than 20,000 HP into the FB reduction gear for 60 knots, which would exceed the max intermittent rating and is probably not a good idea. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)

[26 Nov 00] After we put the PLAINVIEW back into operation in the spring of 1977, we routinely operated under a 65 knot speed limitation due to concern with ventilation of the aft strut during a turn. We never saw any indication of a problem, and there was abundant power to have gone much faster. — Greg Bender (glbender@erols.com)

[28 Nov 00] As far as the PLAINVIEW and HIGH POINT, the best way to make a final determination is to go through all the test tapes. It was my policy that since we were a research and development organization, that minimum data be collected during all operations so that if anything happened, we could recreate what really occurred. We did set up a flight recorder set up on PEGASUS. There was some talk about instrumenting the other PHMs but I cannot recall if it happened. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

[28 Nov 00] Sumi, You are 100% correct when it comes to the “real speed”. Where the “tapes” are is anybody’s guess. Yes, I know you sent them all back to Carderock, and they may be in a Cage in the basement of Bldg 17 buried with all of the other AMV stuff. Yes, we were in the process of installing a prototype “flight recorder” on PHM-2 when the “roof fell in.” It never got up and running in spite of all the good work done by Boeing. The boxes were sent back to the Center, and were recently disposed of in a clean-up exercise. — John Meyer (president@foils.org)


PHM Electrical Power Redesign

Wiring on PHMs

[21 Nov 01] I was an ET on USS HERCULES from 89 – 92. The wiring is navy standard but the thing I found tricky while I was assigned was that 400Hz power was normal and 60Hz was the Special Frequency bus (SF Power). Hope this is some help and am very glad to hear someone is trying to preserve an example of this fantastic ship. — Brian Stone (stoneb001@hawaii.rr.com)

Shore Power

[03 Aug 01] I have a question about shore power. We currently are using a 3 wire, B phase grounded delta system. 480 volts. There are three lines coming down the pole into our disconnect, two of these lines pass through fuses, the other does not, the latter is connected directly to a grounding rod. Our line going to the ship is a three conductor cord with one line to each. when measured at the box, we have 480 volt between any two lines. As I understand it, the ship is 3 wire, ungrounded delta. We are bringing the three lines into the panel where all three lines are fused and there is no connection between any line and the hull. When I use a digital multi meter to measure voltage, I notice that I have a bit of potential between the leg that is grounded at the pole, and the ship. Should I ground this leg at the ship to eliminate the voltage? This is the easiest since we have only 3 wires going to the ship. We have the option of having a 4 wire service put in, a Y with center ground or neutral. this means we would have a potential difference between each leg of 480, and each leg to ground or neutral of 277. This would isolate the three legs from the power company, but we would still be able to get 277 between each leg and ground and less at the ship between each leg and the hull where it isn’t really well grounded. If the 4 wire is the way to go, do we have to run another wire out to the ship and ground it? — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…[03 Aug 01] I am not familiar with a 3 wire B phase grounded delta system. In fact, this would be contrary in terms since a delta system would not have any grounds. What I suspect you have is a Scott connection from the power company so you could get the 3 phases. It would be grounded. I am also confused since the ship’s shore power was originally provided at 400 hertz. The power company, unless they are using some type of frequency conversion would provide 60 hertz. The reason ships use a delta connection is to keep the power system from grounds. If ungrounded, a person would have to touch two leads to get shocked. With a grounded system, touching one wire standing on the deck could provide enough shock to kill you. DO NOT GROUND THE POWER ON THE SHIP!! You really should have an isolation transformer. Go to a Marine scrap yard and get three single phase transformers. I suspect for your use, you could get by with small units at a very reasonable in cost. The other reason for not using the ship as ground is electrolysis, especially in sea water. A ground wire from the ship to shore would compound this problem, and really could do damage when welding on the ship. By the way, that potential you are measuring is enough to provide a good shock to you, especially if you are wet. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

PHM Restoration – Isolation Transformer

[13 Oct 00] We currently have shore power run to our PHM. This is 460 volt 3 wire, where one of the three legs is grounded, a common approach to three phase in rural areas. What this means is that when a meter is connected between one of the ungrounded legs and the ship hull, we read a potential of 460 volts. Would it be advisable to have an isolation transformer in line? We don’t seem to experience any problems with the higher voltage, but we could use a buck/boost transformer to lower the voltage to 440, or is there something else we should be doing short of making sure the anodes are still in place to minimize corrosion? — Elliot S. James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Responses…[13 Oct 00] I would highly recommend an isolation transformer. The danger you face is standing on the deck and touching a piece of equipment that is using one of the other legs, which would put 460 volts through you. Ships use delta (no grounded lead) connection for this very reason. From your description, it sounds like you are being supplied by a scott connection, which is not truly 3-phase. I would be cautious of running sensitive 3-phase equipment with this connection because it could look like a short with the grounded leg. — Sumi Arima (arimas@juno.com)

[20 Oct 00] Assume that 460 volt is 60 Hz power being supplied to PHM. The PHM utilizes 400 Hz power that is converted from 60 to 400 Hz motor generator set. Believe that the motor generator set can operate with one of the input phases grounded but another ground on one of the other phases could cause damage to the MG set and ship. Recommend that isolation transformer be used to isolate the ship. The ship operates at 450 volts plus or minus 5%, so that 460 volts is in the range. Note that sometimes the shore power voltage reaches 500 volts when the are no other heavy consumers. This high voltage may cause equipment to trip off line if it is not regulated by the MG set. To minimize corrosion, the ground connection between ship’s hull and the pier has a good contact. The impedance of the ground connection must be minimized. — Dickey Yee, NAVSEA 05Z – Power Systems Group – 703-602 3474 x 282

PHM VFD Issues

[22 Sep 00] About the VFDs, one project I was on, we were upgrading a process water cooling system for a company. The idea was to vary the speed of the cooling pump to regulate header pressure instead of a control valve. The system was controlled by an Allen-Bradley PLC, but the customer wanted to be able to override everything in the event of a problem. To override the cooling pump the VFD had to be bypassed. An option with the VFD is a bypass switch and a pair of motor contactors. We asked Allen-Bradley if we could just put the contactors in our own motor control center to save space (and expense). In a word they said “no”. They said not to put motor starters on the output of the VFD, to let the VFD do the starting and stopping. I guess the VFD “looks” on the three phase output for a feedback signal, and an open output confuses it in some applications. I noticed with the wiring the VFD had a signal coming from the bypass switch on the front panel to tell it (no feedback I quess) when it was in bypass mode. I asked the factory about this and they said that as long as there was some kind of load on the VFD output there would be no problem with switching the output on and off thru contactors. This was about five years ago, I know the VFD’s have gone thru a lot of improvements since then. Maybe it’s no longer an issue, or it might be a good Idea if there was always some kind of load (lights, heater or fan?) on the bus at all times to extend the life of the VFD. I wonder “how low can you go” with a 400 Hz motor? Some jobs I’ve been on the VFD’s were limited to no less than 20 Hz for a 60Hz motor. One engineer told me that the copper content of motor windings was changed around 1984. I quess if an older motor is kept at low speeds for a period of time it starts to build up heat. Newer motors can be run just about all the way down. I wonder if 400 Hz motors of the same vintage have the same problem. I also remember the VFD’s having two modes, on being “constant torque” or “constant load” ? I had better look these things up to let you know for sure which mode would be best. As far as the LM2500 it came from the aircraft version of the TF39 which I’m sure everyone has told you about by now. If you notice in the LM2500 Tech Manual the first bearing is #3. This is because #1 & #2 are for the turbofan which is driven thru the center of the engine by the power turbine. In marine applications the turbofan is not used and the power turbine power take off is thru the aft end. I’m sure somewhere there has got to be one of these aircraft engines in surplus which is no longer air worthy. Keep me honest here…1) I thought I remembered the hullborne engines as Mercedes-Benz?2) The SSPU’s had the SAC (Start Air Compressor) for the LM2500 mounted on them correct? I remember the SAC’s looking a lot more at home on them than the SSDG’s (Ships Service Diesel Generators) on the Frigates. These Compressors were originally cabin pressurization units on the aircraft. which is why I thought the whole SSPU was borrowed from the aircraft. If this is the case and you replace both SSPU’s wouldn’t this burn the bridge of being able to start a LM2500 (or TF39) down the road?. I’ll look some of these things up and make sure. Thank you for your reply and putting me on your list. Since you have VFD experience, can you see any problem with our plan on using them for power supplies for the 400 hz? I have yet to locate large used ones at a price that I can afford. We need at least 2-75 hp units. I would prefer 3 of the same units, we could use one to drive the 60 hp motor we hooked to one of the hydraulic pumps. With a VFD driving it, we would significantly reduce starting current, and be able to take the motor/hydraulic pump to near 100 hp for short duration which would be perfect for the hydraulic bow thruster, not to mention make the bow thruster variable which might be handy. — Dan Schmidt (GSE2Schmidt@Hotmail.com)

Response…[22 Sep 00] As far as running the 400 hz motors, we plan to run most of them at 400hz with the VFD, which limits us on finding used VFDs because many big ones don’t go that high. We tried slowing down one of the fuel pumps with the VFD since we won’t need 7 hp for hullborne operation and the emergency DC pumps are very noisy. We found that we build heat very quickly. I believe this is because the VFD was set with a base freq. of 60hz. which I think means that 100% voltage will be applied above that point. When a motor is slowed down from the base speed, the voltage needs to be reduced to keep the motor from getting hot. I am guessing that when we reset the base freq. of the VFD to 400 hz, the voltage will drop as the freq. is dropped to compensate. Am I correct in my thinking? I do know that the cooling systems of motors are designed around the base speed, the speed at which the fan spins is important to how well it cools the motor, motors designed specifically for VFD compensate with different fans, or in some cases, separate driven blowers that don’t slow down with the motor. The 400hz motors on our ship are oil cooled, the oil is pumped around the housing with an internal centrifugal impeller which would slow down with the motor. this too would limit the amount we can slow the motor down. The hullborne engines are 8v331 series 80 MTUs for PHM1 , and series 81 for the rest of the ships. We found one of each. we had to make a bell housing adapter for the 80 series since it uses a size smaller bell housing, and all the gearboxes we had were for the larger 81s. When we were looking at building a custom gearbox for the diesel gensets, we were going to incorporate one of the SACs into the design, since we have been able to eliminate the need for a custom gearbox, we plan on using a air start turbine. This is a stand alone unit that is a common sight at airports to start planes. They are relatively cheap on the surplus market and not very large or heavy. Elliot S. James (esjames@cvalley.net)

[31 Jul 99] In our design of the SSPU replacement our gearbox complexity is growing. We have found 400 HZ generators that turn at 4000 rpm and 60 HZ generators that turn 5600 rpm. We are trying to find some that turn the same rpm to keep our gearbox simple. I have noticed that many of the 400HZ generators are 220/110 output. Our ship uses 440, I understand now how 400HZ can save significant weight. It seems odd that 220 seems to be the voltage of choice over 440? This further restricts the availability of surplus generators. One that we have found is from an APU (Auxiliary Power Unit), and it generates 208/416 volts. Is 416 close enough? The PHMs used static frequency converters to convert 400HZ to 60HZ. I assume these were very specialized since there should be very little use for converting in that direction while there are many going from 60HZ to 400HZ. Our loads are mostly 400HZ. Should we more strongly consider coming up with a 400 hz to 60 hz static converter? Are there other applications that use such a device? Would it be hard or cost prohibitive to build one? This would further simplify the wiring by keeping closer to the original design. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…[31 Jul 99] What are you going to do with the PHM other than try to refurbish it to flying condition? I believe you need a new power analysis to determine the amount and type of power you need to get the PHM to your satisfaction. I presume you have stripped much of the weapons so you should have a weight margin to allow heavier 60 hz equipment in lieu of the specialized 400 hz equipment. A lot of the resistive load can operate on either 400 hz or 60 hz. A study was made at one time to replace the SSPU turbines with diesels. I do not know if a copy of this study is available. With commercial marine diesel generators and a standard airport type air start turbine, you could easily save equipment costs and pay for a little design effort. You will still need 400 hz, but going from 60 hz to 400 hz either by motor generator or static inverters should be much cheaper. I caution you as to the quality of power required by the equipment you have retained. A bad power supply could burn up equipment easily. By the way, most aircraft uses 220v 400 hz single phase power. The PHMs used 440 volt, 400 hz, three-phase “Y” converted to delta to avoid grounds. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

Response…

[31 Jul 99] Sumi is right on target. There was a diesel gen study that showed for mission duration of 10 days or longer, combined weight of diesels + fuel was less than that for GT generators. Unfortunately the stated mission for PHM was 5 days. In reality, they went out for 10-12 days or even 2 weeks on occasion and so the decision was the wrong one. Just removing the 3 inch gun and its ammo reduces weight many tons, so going with 60 HZ equipment makes a lot of sense. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)

Follow-up to Responses…

[31 Jul 99] We are going to have 2 diesel units in the same location as the turbine SSPUs, The majority of equipment is still 400 hz. Since most of the wiring is still in place for the items we are retaining, we are planning to keep the resistive loads 400 hz. At full load, with all bilge pumps, fuel pumps, fresh, gray, and black water pumps, fans, blowers, heaters water and air, etc. on at one time, our load is approx. 180 to 200 KW. not included in that load is air conditioning(30 kw), 2 sea water pumps(14 kw), the latter 44 kw we figure to convert to 60 hz for the following reasons: (1) the sea water pumps were removed and it appears that there are very few high horse power 400 hz motors available; and (2) while we have the four separate air-conditioning compressor/motors, we have no spares and have yet to find any other applications that use them. The other 400 hz equipment is either very close to available aircraft components which are cheap surplus or we have acquired spares already. All the equipment is turned on and off with contactors, all have overload protection and control wiring located in EOS. Our plan is to use PC/PLC control to monitor and manage all loads from EOS with network links to the bridge and CIC (combat Information Center). Obviously there is no time when all loads will be on, we can use the control to inhibit items as necessary by prioritizing. If we need all the bilge pumps running then we sure don’t need the galley range and water heaters on! This significantly reduces the load requirements. We rough figure the requirements to be 120 kw of 400 hz (which includes the 28 VDC), 60 kw of 60 hz, and about 60 kw of hydraulic power (mostly the bow thruster) Full hydraulic power would be available foil born from the pumps mounted to the foil borne gearbox. If we split this load between both diesel SSPUs each consisting of one 60kw-400hz generator, one 60kw-60hz generator, two hydraulic pumps(as was previously) all mounted to a gearbox attached to a 400 hp diesel. We should have no problem running the ship on one SSPU at a time with plenty of power for an emergency by further prioritizing loads if one SSPU is down. Does this sound plausible? One thing we could do is to increase the amount of 400 hz available in an emergency from one SSPU by increasing the size of the 400 hz generator and eliminating the 60 hz generator replacing it with a static converter. the converter would have to be larger than the original which I believe was 20 KVA. Now we would need about 60 KW. Does such a converter exist? If not how hard would it be to build one? This approach would let us use the original generators off of the turbine SSPUs. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…

[31 Jul 99] I’ll defer to John Johnson of NAVSEA Power Systems Group. He may have information on 60 KW converters. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)

Follow-up to Responses…

[17 Aug 99] On my visit to the HIGH POINT, I noticed that there were two 60 hz to 400 hz static converters, Do you remember what these units were used for? As far as I could tell most of the ship was conventional 60 hz. If you do remember them maybe you know what KW they were and what voltage. At the time I was not interested, I was pretty sure that we would be using a 400 hz generator but in light of the recent advice I am leaning more toward either a static converter or motor generator. The former being lighter but the latter being much more affordable. — Elliot James (esjames@cvalley.net)

Response…

[17 Aug 99] The static inverters on HIGH POINT were made by Abacus. I cannot remember if they were 7.5 or 5 KVA units. It converted 440 volt 60 hz 3 phase delta to 440 volt 400 hz 3 phase delta. One unit was sufficient to operate the ships load, including the test instrumentation, with the other as standby and/or powering special trials equipment. Many modifications were made after installation to improve the reliability. It kept blowing fuses to keep from spiking the diodes. We installed a limiter circuit. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

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PHM Producibility Improvements

[3 May 01] I am aware that PEGASUS (PHM-1) was built to metric units and the follow-on hydrofoils in imperial units. Also, didn’t the follow-on PHMs have structural mods to make production more simple? The issue of Naval Engineers Journal (around 1985) dealing with ANVs describes some of this. I am interested to hear more about this. — Martin Grimm (seaflite@alphalink.com.au)

Response…[3 May 01] The production PHM (PHM 3 Series) Program conducted a set of Producibility Studies in the 1977-78 timeframe. These studies were aimed at improving producibility (reducing cost) for the 5 follow ships and covered a number of areas. Two of the key areas were Struts-and-Foils and Hull Structure. There was no change from metric to British units however. To my knowledge, this issue was never raised since all of the production drawings for the lead ship (PEGASUS) were in metric, and it would have been cost prohibitive to switch to British units. Strut/Foil Producibility studies were driven by the need to address the problems with stress-corrosion induced cracking in the chordwise direction on PHM 1 aft foil. The 17-4 PH steel used for PHM 1 was especially susceptible to such cracking propagated from within the hollow foils when sea water intruded into the foils and there was no way to remove it. PHM 1 operations were modified to add an oil/wax substance called ‘Floatcoat’ to adhere to the internal surfaces and delay corrosion. The cracking was centered in areas of high stress caused by center-of-lift fluctuations resulting from flap actuation at foilborne speeds. The solution for production PHMs was to eliminate the aft strut-to-foil welded connections in the high stressed areas close to the aft struts and ‘hog’ solid billets of 17-4 PH into an inverted tee solid structure, with the foil skins welded to this solid inverted T further outboard. There was a weight increase in the foil system of several metric tons. For Hull Structure producibility, the structural detail design was extensively modified to reduce the large number of different scantlings used in the lead ship (this was done on PHM 1 for minimum weight). By modifying the design to use fewer tailored scantlings, especially forward in the ship, the meters of welding in the follow ships was drastically reduced with a savings in man-hours for welding. There was a weight increase in SWBS Group 100 of about 4.5 metric tons if memory serves me. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)


PHM Hull “Print-Thru”

[4 May 01] Might I trouble you for your thoughts on PHM Hull print thru visable on structure? — Arthur M. (“Bo”) Hoover (amh@tsgcom.com); Technical Services Group; 12015 Cloverland Court; Baton Rouge, LA 70809; Phone: 225-751-9800; Fax: 225-753-1726; website: www.tsgcom.com.

Responses…[4 May 01]I was the Chief Engineer of the USS GEMINI (PHM 6) in 1987-88. I don’t think the print thru you are referring to in the hull plating is a big deal. All ships oil can their plating to some extent, even the 563′ steel hull Spruance Destroyer I was on. I think it’s a function of the high speed stresses the hull goes through and the thickness of the plate of Navy ships. The hull will oil can some, but the superstructure of a PHM above the main deck will show this even more since the bulkheads are really thin. That is my operator’s opinion, but I defer to the real engineers if their opinion is different then mine. I went to visit Elliot James and the ex-ARIES. It reminded me that the ships are miserable without a functioning air conditioning system. That is one of your biggest priorities, after hullborne propulsion, steering, and a bow thruster. I never saw a PHM in the special cradle that Boeing made for the hydrofoils, but I did see the cradle. Looked like a HUGE boat trailer. In my time on the PHMs we used a floating dry dock to get them out of the water. We were right off the ICW near Mayport for the yard availability during my tour, in a shipyard that now works on tugs. The floating dry dock is no longer there. By the way, there are some fixed fins on the bottom for directional stability that you need to keep in mind dragging them out of the water. When I was on the ex-ARIES, I thought some windows in the Combat Information Center (CIC) would make that a nice main deck salon. Much of the engineering spaces are not required now without a gas turbine engine, but with 132 feet of ship you can have a few feet of wasted yacht. — Jon Coile (jon@coile.com)

[4 May 01] I was not directly involved with PHM program, since it was a construction program. I was the Head of the Hydrofoil Trials Unit, a part of David Taylor Naval Ship Research and Development Center, U.S. Navy. Our part was to provide consultation and even ran some development work such as evaluating the firing of Harpoon missiles off a flying hydrofoil. I am not familiar with your term “print thru”. If you are talking of the visibility of the frames on the hull, it is due to the welding and construction technique. Boeing chose to use the aircraft technique of assembly of the hull upside down on jigs rather than the method most shipyards use which is to allow the hull to move as it is welded and control the shape by welding sequence. The later ships became better as the welders became more proficient. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

[4 May 01] I have never come across the terminology “print thru” or “oil can” when referring to hull plating before, but I think it is the same as what is also referred to as the “Hungry Horse Look”. In other words, the hull shell plating or superstructure plating is dished in between the stiffeners when viewed from outside giving it the look of a starved horse with its skeleton showing through! This is indeed fairly typical of lightly constructed naval ships, and would presumably be even more so for the PHMs. It would be caused by a combination of distortion of the plating due to the welding process during fabrication and later by sea loads acting on the hull. It typically reaches a steady state point where no further significant deflection occurs with further years of service and does not mean the structure has failed. Fatigue problems would be more apparent by signs of cracking of the plating or stiffeners or evidence of attempts to re-weld cracks, which is somewhat problematical for alloy ship structures as the heat affected zone around the weld repairs may just promote further cracking in the same area! — Martin Grimm (seaflite@alphalink.com.au)


PHM as Gun Platform

[11 Apr 01] In the earlier stages of PHM development, the German Federal Navy was interested because they were planning to replace the conventional fast attack craft due to their inability to operate at higher sea states. The German company Luerssen Shipyard was involved in this project. A manager the shipyard told me about his experiences with the PHM. He said that the PHM tested (maybe PEGASUS?) developed low frequency vibrations when it ran through higher short seas. Because of this vibration problem it was thought not to be a stable platform for the 76 mm Oto Melara gun. Is that true? — C. Schramm (Chr_Schramm@gmx.de)

Response…[11 Apr 01] I don’t recall any vibration problem that affected the gun. When the gun was fired, the sonic height sensor reacted to the noise, causing the ship to change height. A circuit was installed in the height sensor electronics to eliminate this problem. When the radar height sensor was used, this problem did not exist. — Sumi Arima (arimas1@juno.com)

[4 Mar 01] Doesn’t ring a bell with me. The production pump re-design by Aerojet was focused on the higher HP rating for increased full load weight and reducing stress in the material through thicker structure on the pump. — Mark Bebar (bebar@foils.org)

[4 Mar 01] This is news to me. I am unaware of any limitations on the gun due to ship vibrations. Yes, the PHM which the German representative (Dr. Bakenhaus) rode was PEGASUS. I remember him being onboard in Port Hueneme for rough water trials. I do not recall him being onboard for the gun firing trials out of Puget Sound. — Philip Yarnall (yarnallp@nswccd.navy.mil)


PHM Fuel Consumption

[11 Apr 01] How much fuel does a PHM hydrofoil need, if it runs foilborne at a speed of 45 – 50 knots? What kind of fuel in which quality is needed? — C. Schramm (Chr_Schramm@gmx.de)

Responses…[11 Apr 01] The specific fuel consumption of the LM2500 GT engine at about 15,000 to 16,000 hp was 0.430 lb per hp hour. So at 45 knots the fuel rate was about 6450 lbs or 2.88 L tons per hour. This is equivalent to about 0.064 LTons per mile or about 143 lbs per nautical mile. This was the characteristic of the LM2500 engine operating at these power levels. It would be that way on any ship! (But at a different speed perhaps.) Note that the LM2500 has been improved over the years, so these numbers are out of date. In looking back at the requirements for fuel in the original shipbuilding specification, I note that the reference is to the manufacturer’s spec for the specific requirements for cleanliness, temperature, and pressure… I do not have these. The shipbuilder spec required a Facet Model 670350-1 filter/separator with DFM Flow rate 95 liters/minute. Before that in the fuel line there were to be two 5-micrometer pre-filters for particulate matter. Two types of fuel could be used interchangeably, DFM per MIL-T-16884 and JP5 per MIL-T-5624. I am not sure if this info will be of much use to you in current times, but it is all I have right now. Probably the manufacturer General Electric (GE) would be the best source of current specifications and requirements for the engine. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)

[12 Apr 01] I was on a FFG. We had a gravity feed emergency fuel tank. It held 350 gallons of fuel. Rule of thumb was that it would last 5 minutes with both LM2500’s running full power or 30 minutes with one engine at Idle. The LM2500 has gone thru several updates. In the late 1980s the horsepower went from 20,500 to 26,250 with the single shank update. I read an article that the LM2500+ is being installed in its first military application @ 37,000HP. Now there is a detuned version called the LM2000. This engine shares the majority of pieces, but the Hot section lasts twice as long. The trick has always been which Main Fuel Control modification you had. Some started hot, some didn’t start too well at all. Whatever you do never starve the engine of fuel! We went thru 2 fuel controls this way. The rebuild cost was $30,000 to $35,000. The fuel starvation instantly would carve a groove in the 3 dimensional cam. When you went to start up the engine it would shoot a fireball up about 50 feet in the air, on a PHM the stack is only about 20 feet tall so Im sure it would be even more impressive. If you look on the back of the Fuel Control you will see a specific gravity adjustment. We never had to play with this and we would run F76 and JP5 interchangeably, except we did not preheat the JP5. I think the thing would run on peanut oil if you cranked on it. Someone told me JP5 has been superseded does anyone know about this? — Dan Schmidt (GSE2SCHMIDT@hotmail.com)


Why So Few PHMs?

[20 Feb 01] I am doing a form and function report on the PHM, and have found out that America initially wanted 25 to be commissioned, with France and Italy keen on having a few made for themselves. On the internet I have only found information on the six made for America and was wondering why this is the case. The information that I have read about the PHM refers to it as being far better than other vessels that are around concerning speed, comfort *and maneuverability. Therefore I was surprised to see that so few were made and that they have now been decommissioned. I am hoping that someone can tell me why they were decommissioned, and also if there is a replacement for it, or whether a new vessel has taken its place. — Crawford Orr (agr@blackpool.ac.uk)

Response…[20 Feb 01] The programmatic history of the PHM class can be found on our website at http://www.foils.org/phmhist.pdf. After reading this article, please address any specific questions to the author George Jenkins at georgejj@aol.com. — Barney C. Black (Please reply via the BBS)


 

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PO BOX 51 – CABIN JOHN MD 20818 – USA

webmaster@foils.org

Obscure hydrofoil milestone: USS PEGASUS, the US Navy hydrofoil missile ship PHM-1, set a record for fastest transit of the Panama Canal in 1979: 2 hours, 41 minutes.


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Passenger

Passenger


The International Hydrofoil Society (IHS) Hydrofoil Correspondance Archives

General: IHS Administration Design of Foils: Foil-Struts-Controls-Performance Design of Vessels: Hull-Machinery-Costs-Performance/Ops History of Hydrofoils: People-Vessels-Operations Hydrofoils: Commercial Hydrofoils: Military
Hydrofoils: Models Hydrofoils: Pleasure Hydrofoils: Sailboats R/D: Student Projects/Thesis etc. Sources, Buy/Sell: Brokers-Builders-Designers-Operators Miscellaneous:Hybrids-Other High Performance Vessels-etc.

Updated last August 20, 2006

Hydrofoils: Commercial
 

Hydrofoils: Commercial      Scroll To Top Top

 

Archived Messages

Count,MessageID,category,ShortTitle,Message,Date,UserName,MsgPswd,Phone,Email,ParentMsgId

“1”,”908704″,”5″,”Re; Re; Seaflight L.90 information||908704″,”The 1973-74 edition of Janes Surface Skimmers Hovercraft and Hydrofoils has a description and principal characteristics of the L.90 on pages 217-218, but no photo.”,”2005-10-06″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,” “,”908701”

“2”,”908701″,”5″,”Re; Seaflight L.90 information||908701″,”According to an article “Small Italians” in the April 2001 Classic Fast Ferries Cyberzine, Seaflight completed only the prototype L.90 (in 1973). www.classicfastferries.com/cff/pdf/cff_2001_3.pdf”,”2005-10-06″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,” “,”902142”

“3”,”902142″,”5″,”Seaflight L.90 information||902142″,”I would like to receive information on the Seaflight L.90 hydrofoil which was built in Messina in the ’70.
One of this type(may be the only one produced) was named SQUALO BIANCO (White Shark).
If someone, worldwide in the foilers community, has any info and/or pictures on the operational life of this beautiful hydrofoil, I will very much appreciate!
Thanks in advance”,”2005-09-27″,”Lorenzo BONASERA”,”nopswd”,” “,”lbonasera@aeronautica.alenia.it”,”5″

“4”,”888998″,”5″,”Small fast boat||888998″,”I am looking for a small fast boat that may be able to take 30 up to 50 passengers. My knowledge in boat is very low. This boat is needed to cross a fast stream river in Africa. We have a project of using this boat as a ferry boat.”,”2005-09-05″,”Okongo Justin “,”nopswd”,” “,”okongo@telus.net”,”5″

“5”,”870718″,”5″,”Re; Re; JUDICIAL SALE – VosKod-2||870718″,”Hi Gerry, IHS does not have a current email address for you. If you want to stay in contact, please send current email address to: president@foils.org. Thanks!”,”2005-08-02″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,” “,”5”

“6”,”869664″,”5″,”Re; JUDICIAL SALE – VosKod-2||869664″,”Auction Date?
Technical Details?
Photograph?
Status reports currently available?

“,”2005-08-01″,”Gerry Levine”,”nopswd”,” “,”gerrymega@adelphia.net”,”0″

“7”,”867548″,”5″,”JUDICIAL SALE – VosKod-2||867548″,”We have ac ourt order to sell an Hydrofoil 1977 Voskod-2 passenger ship.
Its 26 Meter long. For mor info www.gestionprotec.com (28-07-2005)
located in Montreal Canada and we are told its in very good working condition
contact us now !”,”2005-07-27″,”Robert Boivin”,”nopswd”,” “,”rboivin@canada.com”,”0″

“8”,”867546″,”5″,”JUDICIAL SALE – VosKod-2||867546″,”We have ac ourt order to sell an Hydrofoil 1977 Voskod-2 passenger ship.
Its 26 Meter long. For mor info www.gestionprotec.com (28-07-2005)
located in Montreal Canada and we are told its in very good working condition
contact us now !”,”2005-07-27″,”Robert Boivin”,”nopswd”,” “,”gespro@canada.com”,”0″

“9”,”863081″,”5″,”Re; comparison of jetfoil and catamaran||863081″,”Catamarans make a bigger wake than a hydrofoils.Some Russian hydrofoils are shalow draft, like the Voskhod type.See www.dutchhydrofoils.com for examples of high speed ships navigating on the NorthSee canal.
And www.fastferry.nl for example of high speed catamarans navigating on
a river.”,”2005-07-19″,”mark van Rijzen”,”nopswd”,” “,”dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl”,”0″

“10”,”862464″,”5″,”Re; comparison of jetfoil and catamaran||862464″,”Jetfoil is a specific model of hydrofoil initially designed and built by Boeing Marine. It uses a fully-submerged hydrofoil design and is ocean-going. The hydrofoils that I have heard about being used on rivers are the surface-piercing hydrofoil type, mostly designed and built in Russia. Some hydrofoils built by Helmut Kock are still in use on Lake Titicaca in Peru. There is info on these and other hydrofoils throughout the IHS site and elsewhere.”,”2005-07-18″,”Barney C Black”,”nopswd”,” “,” “,”0”

“11”,”859475″,”5″,”comparison of jetfoil and catamaran||859475″,”Dear reader,

Does anybody know why catamarans are not used on rivers for the commercial transport of passengers whereas jetfoils are? What are the functional differences between jetfoil and catamaran that provoke the catamaran not to be used on rivers or canals. Does anybody know examples of high speed ships navigating on rivers and canals? I know about jetfoils in the netherlands and on the danube but that is just about as far as my knowledge stretches. I would be grateful for any information!

“,”2005-07-12″,”Chris Beghin”,”nopswd”,” “,”xris1510@hotmail.com”,”0″

“12”,”853110″,”5″,”LASTOCHKA-M HYDROFOIL NEWBUILDING CONTRACTING||853110″,”Dear sir,

Pls contact me as I’m very interested by your offers.
My e mail adress is : mamode@wanadoo.mg

Regards
Mamode”,”2005-06-29″,”mamode”,”nopswd”,” “,”mamode@wanadoo.mg”,”0″

“13”,”852276″,”5″,”LASTOCHKA-M HYDROFOIL NEWBUILDING CONTRACTING||852276″,””VOLGA” SHIPYARD PROPOSING NEW-BUILDING CONTRACTING FOR ‘LASTOCHKA-M’ TYPE PASSENGER HYDROFOIL. 75-86 PASSENGERS / SERVICE SPEED 45 KNOTS. FOR MORE INFORMATION AND PHOTOS CLICK HERE http://www.volga-shipyard.com/index.php?lang=eng&section=products&catid=4&craft_id=24

WE ALSO LOOKING FOR CUTOMERS TO DEVELOPE NEW PERSPECTIVE PROJECT SEA-GOING HYDROFOIL ‘KOMETA-120M’.
http://www.volga-shipyard.com/index.php?lang=eng&section=projects&catid=4&craft_id=7

FOR MORE INFORMATION PLS CONTACT VYACHESLAV FEDOROV:
‘VOLGA’ SHIPYARD – MOSCOW SALES OFFICE
TEL/FAX:+7 095 254 04 43 OR
E-MAIL: SLAVA@CIELO-TRADING.NET
HTTP://WWW.VOLGA-SHIPYARD.COM/

“,”2005-06-28″,”FEDOROV VYACHESLAV”,”nopswd”,” “,”SLAVA@CIELO-TRADING.NET”,”0″

“14”,”832530″,”5″,”INVESTMENT OPPORTUNITY||832530″,”INVESTMENT OPPORTUNITY

Calling For Investment in Passenger Fast Ferry Operation in West Coast of Africa.
I am interested in a joint venture with a partner/s who might have or could finance 1 or 2 seagoing passenger hydrofoils or fast ferries for us to start a coastal operation in West Africa. He might need to invest as much as $1.7 M to buy and bring successfully to West Africa an hydrofoil not older than 6 years. Or as much as $5 – $10 M for a fast ferry in range of 0.1 to 8 years old. I am advised not to buy vessels that are too old in order to enjoy hitch free operations. Vessels capable of carrying 120 – 350 passengers together with 5 – 25 tons of cargo are good for the routes. Demand for such ferry service is high and there is non on the routes at present.
This project can also be financed by preferential loan arrangement, repayable within 1 to 3 years of operation.
I am 53 years old, born again Christian, a qualified Shipbroker, member of the Institute of Chartered Shipbrokers, London elected in 1983.
For full details, Interested investors should contact me – Yinka Olaipe.
Tel: 08055620933 or 08023154661 E-mail: lmhcoastal@yahoo.co.uk.
Addresss: LMH Nig. Ltd (Shipping & Shipbroking) 6, Airways Road, Ijeshatedo, P. O. Box 6271, Surulere, Lagos, Nigeria.
“,”2005-05-21″,”Yinka Olaipe”,”nopswd”,” “,”lmhcoastal@yahoo.co.uk”,”0″

“15”,”832472″,”5″,”Commercial Jetfoils||832472″,”Does anyone know how many Jetfoils are still operating in the world? Also whatever happenned to the ones that went to Indonesia and sat there for all these years? “,”2005-05-21″,”Rod Clayards”,”nopswd”,” “,”rodbev@shaw.ca”,”0″

“16”,”831700″,”5″,”Former Seajets Engineer Will Tell All||831700″,”Aloha-
I am former Engineer/ Diver for the ill-fated Seajets Boeing 929 Florida to Bahamas operation . I will answer any inquiries regarding the experiences of hydrofoil ferry service in US waters as a member of the Maintenance Department. Feel free to contact me “Boatdoc@aol.com” Michael Berman”,”2005-05-20″,”Michael Berman”,”nopswd”,” “,”Boatdoc@aol.com”,”0″

“17”,”794438″,”5″

 

“18”,”780611″,”5″,”Re: Hydrofoils – Vietnam||780611″,”No personal experience. Schedules posted at the following webpages:

http://www.vietnamopentour.com/Transport/waterway.htm
http://www.sinhcafetour.com/waterways.html

A traveler posted a couple of photos of the vessels at this page:
http://homepage.mac.com/wkaemena/Public/PhotoAlbum60.html”,”2005-02-12″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,”bcblack@erols.com”,”0″

“19”,”780554″,”5″,”Hydrofoils – Vietnam||780554″,”We will be visiting Vung Tau, Vietnam, in late March as a part of a cruise to other places in Australia and SE Asia. We will have only one day in Vung Tau and I would like to travel by hydrofoil to Ho Chi Minh City for sightseeing and shopping. Does anyone have any experiences with the hydrofoil services from Vung Tau-HCMC and return? If there are companies recommended, or to be avoided, I would appreciate comments. If there are any other places in Australia, Singapore, or Thailand where we could have a hydrofoil or high-speed catamaran ride during a one-day tour stop, I would like to know about those also. Thanks.”,”2005-02-12″,”Ralph Patterson”,”nopswd”,” “,”RAPatterson.57@alum.dartmouth.org”,”0″

“20”,”764235″,”5″,”METEOR-2000 HYDROFOIL FOR SALE||764235″,”ZELENODOLSK SHIPYARD, russia, OFFER NEW METEOR-2000 HYDROFOILS AND NEW FFF. 12 months – guaraties.
PLEASE WRITE snikonov63@yahoo.com
S.Nikonov
marketing manager”,”2005-01-14″,”sergey nikonov”,”nopswd”,” “,”snikonov63@yahoo.com”,”0″

“21”,”750876″,”5″,”||||750876″,”We are investigating the possibilty of aquiring a small to medium size hydrofoil for commercial use on NE coast UK. Seating for 50/60 persons with shallow draft with foils retracted.
“,”2004-12-13″,”Bob Roberts”,”nopswd”,” “,”enquiries@fibretalk.com”,”0″

“22”,”744252″,”5″,”Re: Disco Volate||744252″,”Are you aware that Disco Volate/volante was a fake that did not fly?

I saw a TV program (was it Movie Magic?) that showed the special effects involved. They built a big model of the craft from the water line up. This was placed on a planing hull and was photographed at speed using a blue mat as a background. Then they inserted images of foils inplace of the planing hull.

I saw this quite a while ago, so I may be reporting some of these details inaccurately, but I definately remember my disappointment that this improbable design did not really fly in the movie.”,”2004-11-27″,”Ray Vellinga”,”nopswd”,” “,”rvell@san.rr.com”,”0″

“23”,”738770″,”5″,”Investment Opportunity ||738770″,”Investment Opportunity in Passenger Fast Ferry Operation on West Coast of Africa
I am interested in a joint venture with a partner who might have or could finance 1 or 2 Seagoing Passengers Hydrofoils or Fast Ferries for us to start a coastal operation in West Africa. He might need to invest as much as $500K – $1M in buying the hydrofoils, while I would offer the management side of the operation. The demand for such ferry services is high. There is no such service at the moment. I am a qualified Shipbroker, member of the Institute of Chartered Shipbrokers, London since 1983. And above all, I am a born again Christian.
Interested investor should contact — Yinka Olaipe. Lagos. Tel: 08023154661
E-mail: lmhcoastal@yahoo.co.uk

“,”2004-11-16″,”Yinka Olaipe”,”nopswd”,” “,”lmhcoastal@yahoo.co.uk”,”0″

“24”,”714918″,”5″,”Hydrofoils for sale||714918″,”Dear Mr. Whatley,

attached you will find information regarding two hydrofoils. In order to give an estimate of the shipping costs to SE Asia we have to know to which place they are to be shipped. We normally advise the vessels to be shipped as deck cargo. Both vessels are owned by a Dutch Shipping Company and the sale will be conducted directly from the owner. Both ships are currently registered in the Neteherlands.
All the documents you like to see are ready for your inspection and you are welcome to see those at your convenience.

Kind regards,

Marcel Roelofs
Chevalier
Voorplecht 15
1186 WP Amstelveen
The Netherlands
Tel + 31 20 453 75 90
Fax + 31 20 453 75 91
Mobile + 31 6 22535406
E-mail Marcel.Roelofs@12move.nl “,”2004-09-27″,”Chevalier Floatels”,”nopswd”,” “,”marcel.roelofs@12move.nl”,”0″

“25”,”712040″,”5″,”Re: Purchase/Lease 2 Hydro Passenger Boats (used)||712040″,”We are in the process of narrowing the field of available crafts, can you forward any additional information regarding the two that you are offering.
Who has the title to these crafts, availability for inspections, logs, references, bank references etc.
We also wish to have your estimate of transfers of the two units to SE Asia.
Best regards,
R Whatley
Reginatorw@netscape.net”,”2004-09-20″,”R Whatley”,”nopswd”,” “,”reginatorw@netscape.net”,”0″

“26”,”710440″,”5″,”For sale MTU 12V 331, W6 overh.||710440″,”One (1) W6 overhauled MTU 12V 331 TC82 marine engine for sale.
Rated 1050 HP at 2050 RPM.
Engine has only 90 hours of operation after complete W6 overhaul (testing and adjustments).
Ready to install. The engine can easily be converted to TC92 (1582 HP) or derated to TC81 version by adjustment of governor.
A very common engine in Rodriquez hydrofoils.

A W6 overhaul of a 12V 331 cost 80-100.000 EUR or more today.

Price: 65.000 EUR or best offer.

Contact:
Bo Berglund
Rickenbacker Sweden Phone: +46-708-37 23 58, Fax: +46-708-37 33 58
Email: calibrator@telia.com
“,”2004-09-17″,”Bo Berglund”,”nopswd”,” “,”calibrator@telia.com”,”0″

“27”,”706667″,”5″,”Re: Disco Volate||706667″,”There is info on the Disco Volante in several areas of the IHS correspondence archives. Most of the interest is from people who want to model the vessel. Go to each of the following pages and scroll down in the correspondence or search on the page for Disco Volante. Also feel free to try to contact any of the people who has corresponded on this subject to see if they have more recent information:
http://www.foils.org/modelrc.htm
http://www.foils.org/media.htm
http://www.foils.org/pioneers.htm
http://www.foils.org/gallery/badges.htm
http://www.foils.org/postmisc.htm
http://www.foils.org/models.htm

A newspaper ad offering the vessel for sale is at:
http://www.foils.org/ffishad.jpg

Note that Jean Buhler of Miami Shipbuilding is still alive and well, so you could call him if you want to chat about this vessel or any other MSC projects.
“,”2004-09-10″,”Barney C Black”,”poopdeck”,” “,”bcblack@erols.com”,”0″

“28”,”705949″,”5″,”amphibian hovrcraft(10T-20T)Russian||705949″,”I would like to take lease amphibian hovercraft for long tram basis for cargo purpose.If you are interested please inform me as soon as possiable.”,”2004-09-09″,”Ruman Barua”,”nopswd”,” “,”rum27m@yahoo,com”,”0″

“29”,”705497″,”5″,”LOOKING TO BUY HYDROFOILS.||705497″,”I am interested in receiving information on new (or not too old) foils for passengers for sale and/or lease. They have to hold at least 100pp.

Please send price, photos, characteristics and conditions of sale.

Anyone with this kind of foils for sale, please contact me at
kikeolarte@yahoo.com

Thank you

Enrique”,”2004-09-08″,”Enrique”,”nopswd”,” “,”kikeolarte@yahoo.com”,”0″

“30”,”703351″,”5″,”Re: seeking old russian high speed hydrofoils ||703351″,”We currently have an older Meteor Hydrofoil available. It is not offered for lease but for sale. However the asking price is only
170000 euro and we are open for offers. I will send you additinal information by email
Kind regrads,

Marcel Roelofs”,”2004-09-02″,”Chevalier Floatels”,”nopswd”,” “,”marcel.roelofs@12move.nl”,”0″

“31”,”703339″,”5″,”Hydrofoils for sale||703339″,”We currently have 2 hydrofoils for sale which are very reasonably priced. Both are Meteoor and have been in service until recently. Both vessels are still in class.

I will send you some pictures and some information per seperate email”,”2004-09-02″,”Chevalier Floatels”,”nopswd”,” “,”marcel.roelofs@12move.nl”,”0″

“32”,”702063″,”5″,”Disco Volate||702063″,”I am looking for the Flying Fish Hydrofoil used in the James Bond movie Thunderball. Its movie name was the Disco Volante. Any info would be appreciated.
Thank You,
Dick Henry”,”2004-08-30″,”Dick Henry”,”nopswd”,” “,”mrdr0590@comcast.net”,”0″

“33”,”699313″,”5″,”Purchase/Lease 2 Hydro Passenger Boats (used)||699313″,”We represent a concern wishing to lease/buy 2 used passenger boats, to be operated in SE Asia. Must have excellent log of maintenance etc. 35+ mph, 240+ PAX. We are quite serious and will consider serious opportunities only. Please feel free to forward leads to our email as well.
“,”2004-08-25″,”R Whatley”,”nopswd”,” “,”reginatorw@netscape.net”,”0″

“34”,”694828″,”5″,”seeking old russian high speed hydrofoils ||694828″,”i am seeking russian old hydrofoils for long tarms lease any type of condition (rocket, cyclone,kometa7,vliegb,oly15,kara4,metrus)please contact by mail”,”2004-08-15″,”Ruman Barua”,”nopswd”,” “,”rum27m@yahoo.com”,”0″

“35”,”691580″,”5″,”Re; I Need some Help||691580″,”Hi Andreh
I`m interested to buy your boats.Please contact me as soon as possible

Best regards

Captain Ali Jodat
“,”2004-08-08″,”Captain Ali Jodat”,”nopswd”,” “,”jodat@technicon-tic.com”,”0″

“36”,”691508″,”5″,”Re; I Need some Help||691508″,”andre,

please take digital photos, send them to me or mail to

jeffrey Phipps
500 orchard Pond Rd.
Tallahassee, FL 32312

850-528-1459

Hablo un poco de espanol, y trabaje in Brazil por dos meses en 1993, entonces puede comprehende un poco de portugues.

I am going to Paraguay in six months, would love to look at your equipment with the idea to purchase all three craft, for conversion or to put into service.

Please indicate where you are,

sincerely,

jeffrey Phipps,”,”2004-08-07″,”jeff phipps”,”nopswd”,” “,”jfipps@growthinnovations.com”,”0″

 

Archive; Buy/Sell/Restore/Convert Hydrofoil

Click below to Open

http://www.foils.org/buyferry.htm
[Date/Time=03-24-2002 – 3:12 PM]

    Name:webmaster@foils.org [Msgid=237684]
    Archive; Where To Buy Hydrofoil Work Boat
    Work Boat for Commercial Algae Harvesting

        • [3 Dec 97] I am a commercial harvester of a blue green algae on Upper Klamath Lake, Klamath Falls, Oregon, USA. The raw product is transported 10 to 14 miles to its drop-off point. We will be upgrading our transport system for the next harvest season. Our objectives are as follows: two (2) transport boats, each 24 to 26 ft. in length; payload of 2500 lb. ; transport speed 60 mph at 70% power. Klamath lake is 25 miles long, 5 miles wide and averages 9 ft. deep. The lake level will seasonally drop to 4.5 ft. in the shallower spots that we must cross. 2 to 3 ft. chop is to be expected when
        • sudden winds occur. We are currently talking with American Offshore (Grove Oklahoma – 26 ft. tunnel), Shoell Marine (24 ft. step hull, fiberglass, Ft. Lauderdale, Florida) and Wind River (step hull, 24-26ft. alum. Pasco Washington) All these folks claim to be able to get the job done with 400 to 550 hp. That works out to 20 to 24 gallons per hour in fuel, or US$432 per day, or US$43,000 per year.
        • Enter the foil– will it work, is it more economical, do they break away when you hit a solid object? OK folks, as you can see we are hunting. Look forward to your input, positive or otherwise.
        • — Mike Reynolds, Flos-Aquae llc (

    flosaqua@cdsnet.net

        • )
        • Response…
        • [21 Mar 98] Re: the Algae harvester, a Hydrofoils, Inc. craft to move (6) 462 lb. drums and two people at 70 mph @ 75% power two 4 hour shifts / day, with reasonable periodic down time for maintenance, will cost just over US$200,000. Flos-Aquae 11c wanted something in the $US50,000 price range, and I’m sure no boat will meet that criteria for that price. We did some heavy calculations and drawings, and the boat is basically designed. I would loved to have this project but I don’t think it’s going to fly at this time.
        • Ken Cook, Hydrofoils, Inc. (

    kencook@hydrofoil.com

        • )
        • _________________________________________________________________

    Click Below to Open related Archive.

    http://www.foils.org/buyferry.htm


    [Date/Time=03-25-2002 – 3:54 PM]

      Name:Webmaster@foils.org [Msgid=238100]
      Want to Buy 2 Hydrofoils

        ViewThread

            • We are urgently in need to buy two (02) used passenger hydrofoil boats with the following requirements:
            • – Year of manufacture: 1992 or later
            • – Number of passengers: 65 – 85
            • – Speed: at least 60 km/h
            • Could you please help us locate reliable suppliers, thank you in advance.
            • Best regards,
            • Hong Duong
            • SECOIN CO., LTD.
            • Address: 59 Hang Chuoi Street, Hai Ba Trung District
            • Hanoi, Vietnam
            • Phone: 84-4-971 8899 (6lines) ; Fax: 84-4-971 8898
            • Mobile:84-913-207676
            • Email:

        mailto:secoin@fpt.vn

            • or

        mailto:secoin@hn.vnn.vn

            • URL:

        http://www.secoin-ltd.com

            • or

        http://www.seterra.com

            • SECOIN Import-Export Forum:

        http://secoin.go.to/

            • SECOIN Trade Bulletin Board:

        http://secoin.come.to/

            • SECOIN Photo Center:

        http://clik.to/secoin

        [Date/Time=05-04-2002 – 8:20 AM]

          Name:Hong Duong secoin@fpt.vn, [Msgid=255274]
          Hydrofoil FOR SALE

            ViewThread

                • I am writing on behalf of the owner of a 77 foot, 145 passenger, 32 knots, 550 miles-range catamaran ferry. It is available immediately: please contact me at

            hv1@lantic.net

                • .


            [Date/Time=05-04-2002 – 11:54 AM]

              Name:Hein Vogel hv1@lantic.net, [Msgid=255349]
              Attached File  “Vessel 1~jpg.zip” – size 259374   Click Here To Download
              Hydrofoil FOR SALE

                  • Hein
                  • Thanks for the accompying Photos of the vessel. Do you have any more details on its charaterictics that indicate what makes it a high performance freey? Are there foils that I see between the catamaran hulls? With additional information we would add the vessel to our site. And if you have a Web Site supporting your sales efforts we would be happy to add it to our links page.
                  • As a volunteer organization we do not endorse or support sales. However, we are happy to post your notice for the benefit of our members.

              [Date/Time=05-04-2002 – 8:59 PM]

                Name:Bill White Asst. Webmaster whitewn@Speakeasy.net, [Msgid=255472]
                Want to Buy 2 Hydrofoils

                    • Hong Duong
                    • Check out our Archive at

                http://www.foils.org/buyferry.htm

                    • for more information on where to Buy.
                    • If you would like, we would be happy to list you web site on our Links page where potential sellers often go to be matched up with buyers.
                    • Keep us posted.
                    • Bill White

                [Date/Time=05-04-2002 – 9:07 PM]

                  Name:Bill White Asst. Webmaster whitenw@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=255474]
                  Hydrofoil FOR SALE

                      • I have added this notice, including the principle characteristics provided, to the IHS website announcement page at

                  http://www.foils.org/announce.htm

                      • .

                  [Date/Time=05-09-2002 – 5:33 AM]

                    Name:Barney C. Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=257264]
                    Further Info on Hysucat

                        • Bill,
                        • The ferry is a hydrofoil-supported catamaran (Hysucat) that was built in Cape Town, South Africa and is presently being used to take tourists from Cape Town to Robben Island (Nelson Mandela’s old prison). The foils were designed and optimized by Prof. Hoppe and myself at the University of Stellenbosch. I can supply some pictures and info if Hein is unable.
                        • Regards
                        • Günther

                    [Date/Time=05-09-2002 – 11:40 AM]

                      Name:Gunther Migeotte migeotte@ing.sun.ac.za, [Msgid=257372]
                      Further Info on Hysucat

                          • Here are the specifications and extra photos of the Hysucat and her Foils as provided by Hein Vogel.
                          • Specifications presented in good faith:
                          • SEA PRINCESS
                          • 76′ high speed passenger vessel. Located in Victoria and Alfred Waterfront, Cape Town, South Africa. Asking price: US$1.325.000
                          • MODEL: High speed passenger vessel
                          • YEAR: 1998
                          • BUILDER: T-Craft & Waterfront Charters
                          • DESIGNER: J. R. Van Niekerk, Boatfloat cc.
                          • TYPE: Tandem hydrofoil-supported catamaran passenger ferry

                      HYDROFOIL SYSTEM

                          • Dual foils made of high-grade stainless steel, specially designed for this vessel after tank tests. The center foil is 9.75 feet wide and 1.6 feet long. Each foil is positioned at bottom of hull. The vessel rises 2 feet out of the water at approx. 18 mph, reducing the hull wetted surface considerably, and effectively providing approx. 30% more speed and reducing the fuel consumption by approx. 28%.
                          • TOP: Open sundeck with seating for 46 passengers
                          • ENGINES: 2 x MTU / DDC 12v (fitted new 30 July 2000) with standard drive shafts and propellers.
                          • ENGINE HOURS: (at 03-05-2002) 1192 Port, 1189 Starboard.
                          • RANGE:
                          • (1) Approx. 21 US gallons/hour/engine/ 528 gallons/22k = 550 miles
                          • (2) Approx. 30 gallons/hour/engine/528 gallons/32k = 544 miles
                          • RIG: Mast with cross trees for navigation light etc
                          • MATERIAL: Superstructure: marine grade aluminum, marine grade painted.
                          • Hull: glass reinforced plastic and balsacore sandwich construction with GRP and foam ring beams.
                          • Deck: Laminated wooden beams bonded to hull construction.
                          • SPEED: Cruising: 26 knots (laden) Maximum: 32 knots at 2300 rpm
                          • TANKS: Fuel:2 x 528 US gallons Water: 396 gallons
                          • WEIGHT: 42 metric tons (light ship). 65 metric tons with fuel & water. 86 metric tons GRT
                          • ACCOMMODATIONS AND LAYOUT:
                          • All passenger seating is on tracks in the saloon and can be modified from ferry style (cinema) to restaurant, conference or school room style. Large kiosk / bar with access from interior and exterior. 145 passengers + 8 crew (including master) = 153 total.
                          • BRIDGE INSTRUMENTS & NAVIGATION EQUIPMENT:
                          • * MTU engine: computerized instruments linked to dual engine room computer panels providing revolutions, oil pressures, oil & water temperatures, injection pressure, gearbox conditions, etc.
                          • * Navigational: Navico, Corus system, providing speed & log depth, windspeed & direction, compass heading, autopilot etc.
                          • * MTU portable engine controls for docking procedure.
                          • * Simrad radar RA772, 24 nautical mile range.
                          • * Simrad RT 1200 VHF radio.
                          • * Two ICOM IC-GM1500 VHF emergency portable radios.
                          • * Ritchie compass.
                          • * ITT Jabsco searchlight.
                          • * All tanks monitoring panel.
                          • * A/C switch panel, 50Hz.
                          • * 12v – 24v switch panel.
                          • * P&S docking lights.
                          • * Emergency ship intercom & fog / siren system.
                          • * Ringmaster intercom system throughout vessel.
                          • * Chubb fire system with sensors and alarms throughout vessel.
                          • * Chubb security system with sensors and alarms throughout vessel.
                          • * JVC KS Fx230 Radio & CD player.
                          • * Lofrans electric windlass control.
                          • * Panasonic air conditioner
                          • INSTRUMENTS IN SALOON:
                          • * Two JVC TV units.
                          • * Sharp VC RA33 video system.
                          • * Panasonic music sound system, amplifiers & speakers.
                          • * Two Panasonic air conditioners.
                          • * Two Panasonic air down curtains.
                          • * Lights dimmer controls.
                          • * Fire system sensors & alarms.
                          • * Security sensors.
                          • ELECTRICAL SYSTEM:
                          • Generator: Perkins model 1004T, 240 volt, 50Hz, 20 KVA.
                          • DECK AND HULL:
                          • Glass reinforced plastic and balsacore sandwich construction with GRP and foam ring beams. Deck is made of marine plywood bonded to laminated wooden beams and watertight bulkheads to form a strong integral construction.
                          • MECHANICAL AND ENGINE EQUIPMENT:
                          • * Main engines: 2 x MTU / DDC 12v 92 2000 m90 (fitted 30 July 2000)
                          • * 2 x 1350 Hp (2 x 1007 kW)
                          • * Fuel Consumption: 80 liters per hour at 26 knots (savings due to adjustable foil system)


                      [Date/Time=05-09-2002 – 11:16 PM]

                        Name:Bill White bbs@foils.org, [Msgid=257698]
                        Attached File  “Pic9~jpg.zip” – size 284815   Click Here To Download
                        Further Info on Hysucat

                            • Gunther
                            • Thanks for the offer. We received plenty of pictures of the overall craft, but none of the Foils themselves.
                            • I have always thought that catamarans made great hulls for hydrofoils. I even got as far as working with the French Navy via NATO while they did a design and model tested a catamaran hydrofoil that fully lifted out of the water on it’s fully submerged Foil system. It confirmed all my performance beliefs, but was never built for the usual Monohulls are good enough reasons.
                            • If you have any photos of the foil system on HUSUCAT, it would be a wecome addition to our web site along with any commentary you could provide.
                            • V/R
                            • Bill White
                            • IHS BBS Moderator

                        [Date/Time=05-13-2002 – 11:21 AM]

                          Name:Bill White, BBS Moderator whitewn@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=258802]
                          Further Info on Hysucat

                              • Bill,
                              • I have some photos of the foils on the boat as well as some of the foils being constructed. I will scan a couple and post them here shortly.

                          [Date/Time=05-19-2002 – 9:23 AM]

                            Name:Gunther Migeotte migeotte@ing.sun.ac.za, [Msgid=261225]
                            New Voskhod-2M for

                              ViewThread

                                  • Check out this link:

                              http://home.wanadoo.nl/~hydrofoils1/fffnews.htm

                                  • For photo’s of the first new Voskhod-2M for Fast Flying Ferries.
                                  • Build by Feodosia shipbuilding association “MORYE”.

                              http://morye.kafa.crimea.ua/

                              [Date/Time=05-22-2002 – 6:38 AM]

                                Name:Capt M Van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=262426]
                                Attached File  “vos-2m~jpg.zip” – size 17457   Click Here To Download
                                New Voskhod-2M

                                    • Great photos, Mark. With your permission I will put some of them in the newsletter.

                                [Date/Time=05-24-2002 – 4:07 AM]

                                  Name:Barney C. Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=263297]
                                  Hydrofoils and Whales Don`t Mix

                                    ViewThread

                                        • Interesting brief article on the Greenpeace website at

                                    http://www.greenpeacefoundation.com/history/histsub.cfm?hiid=12

                                        • .
                                        • “…Due to the rolling of ocean swells, the sonar of a hydrofoil can’t see surface objects – even BIG objects – like whales in its path. Compounding this problem, the fast speed of a hydrofoil is typically nothing a whale is accustomed to, and the whale may not be able to avoid a collision even if it hears one coming. Indeed, the whales which spend most time at the surface are the babies, which are nearly invisible even to a boat going a fraction the speed of a hydrofoil… “

                                    [Date/Time=05-24-2002 – 4:20 AM]

                                      Name:Barney C. Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=263299]
                                      Hydrofoils and Whales Don`t Mix

                                          • Collision with whales is not a phenomenon that is unique to hydrofoils. Over the years there have been a number of reports of yachts under sail colliding with whales. It is thought that this may occur when the whales are sleeping. In those cases the yachts have often been significantly damaged or sunk.
                                          • The reference to “sonar” in the Greenpeace article is presumably referring to the navigation radar that would be fitted to commercial hydrofoils.

                                      [Date/Time=05-25-2002 – 6:26 AM]

                                        Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=263686]
                                        Hydrofoils and Whales Don`t Mix

                                            • No kidding. Just ask the crew of the

                                        USS AQUILA

                                            • (PHM 4) about a certain night in ’91 or ’92 going from 40+ knots to zero knots in the length of the ship off the back of a whale. The Skipper left his face impression in a metal door, breaking vertebrae in his neck in the process. Several other crew members were also injured. Diesel motors were ripped from their foundations. The hull was actually wrinkled back by the aft struts. From all accounts, it was a rude awakening in the middle of the night for some sailors. — FCC(SW) Kevin Hufnagle (ret),

                                        USS GEMINI

                                            • (PHM 6)

                                        [Date/Time=05-27-2002 – 8:20 AM]

                                          Name:FCC(SW) Kevin Hufnagle (ret) khufnagle@stonel.com, [Msgid=264145]
                                          New Voskhod-2M

                                              • Today (31th of may 2002)at 14:00 the Eilsum will arrive
                                              • at the locks in IJmuiden.
                                              • With as deckcargo hull#605.
                                              • I will try to update my site A.S.A.P…

                                          [Date/Time=05-31-2002 – 2:12 AM]

                                            Name:Capt Mark van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=265844]
                                            Why Aren`t There More Hydrofoils?

                                                • Here is a good question about the merits of hydrofoils that appeared in the archives… asked 5 years ago, and still no answer has appeared. If only people like Hanns von Schertel were still around to answer these questions with their insights…
                                                • [14 Oct 97] I am a student in an English university, and my Strategic Management Project is about passenger hydrofoils; I would like info about the advantages and disadvantages compared to other means of transport, analysis, specific magazines about hydrofoils, and how I can join IHS. — Mike Koronaios

                                            [Date/Time=07-14-2002 – 7:58 PM]

                                              Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=282357]
                                              New Voskhod-2M

                                                ViewThread

                                                    • Here is a photo made on one of the last test runs of our new voskhod-2M. The photo is free to use. If you have any questions I will try to answer them all. – Mark van Rijzen

                                                http://www.dutchhydrofoils.com


                                                [Date/Time=07-20-2002 – 5:56 AM]

                                                  Name:Mark van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=284541]
                                                  New Voskhod-2M

                                                      • Mark
                                                      • Thanks for posting the great photo. We would appreciate it if you could add some additional details about the craft and her history.
                                                      • I went to your Web Site. Very interesting. Perhaps you could share some of your background and the purpose of the site with us. I would be happy to transfer it more permanently within our Web site so others can share your interests.
                                                      • Regards
                                                      • Bill White
                                                      • IHS BBS manager

                                                  [Date/Time=07-20-2002 – 3:49 PM]

                                                    Name:Bill White whitewn@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=284646]
                                                    New Voskhod-2M

                                                        • History of this new vessel is highlighted in the current (Summer 02) issue of the IHS Newsletter. It appears only in the electronic version, however, not the printed version… those IHS members who are not web enabled will miss out on it.

                                                    [Date/Time=07-21-2002 – 5:05 PM]

                                                      Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=284928]
                                                      New Voskhod-2M

                                                          • Mark,
                                                          • I always liked the old Fast Flying Ferries (FFF) Voskhod colour scheme but the new one is nice as well.
                                                          • Could you perhaps tell us what the unusual projection is at the stem of the bow? It is something that is not fitted to the original FFF Voskhods but was apparent on this the new craft, particularly on some of the other photos on your website.

                                                      [Date/Time=07-22-2002 – 6:13 AM]

                                                        Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=285079]
                                                        New Voskhod-2M

                                                            • At

                                                        http://home.wanadoo.nl/~hydrofoils1/fffnews.htm

                                                            • you can read the story of hull 605.


                                                        [Date/Time=07-29-2002 – 4:26 AM]

                                                          Name:Capt Mark van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=287625]
                                                          Attached File  “vos-2mnewcol01~JPG.zip” – size 629459   Click Here To Download
                                                          New Voskhod-2M

                                                              • The unusual projection is at the stern of the bow is the resuld of a 2001 rule by the Dutch shipping inspection.The rule is that new to build ships(all types) may not have their anchor stick out of the hull of the ship.Since hull 605,606 and 604 allready being build,FFF choose this unusual projection to prevent the anchor stick out of the hull.About the new colour,Fast Flying Ferries is now a part of Connexxion,( Big public transportation company with bus lines and [door to door wheelchair] taxi’s)and this is their house colour.We hope to see hull 606 arrive in the end of August.

                                                          [Date/Time=07-29-2002 – 5:04 AM]

                                                            Name:Capt Mark van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=287631]
                                                            log strike

                                                                • Does anybody have any further information on the following accident:
                                                                • LINDA LINE FOILCAT PULLED OUT OF SERVICE
                                                                • the new superfoil 40 foil assisted catamaran for the Linda Line, LINDA EXPRESS, built by Almaz Marine in St Petersburg entered service on the Tallinn-Helsinki route in July 22nd. THe 40m, 288 seat, 55 knot vessel had arrived in the estonian captial already on 16th June, completing the delivery trip from St. Petersburg in 3.5 hours. But only 3 days after its inauguration on July 5th, the catamaran had to be pulled from service as 12 NM off the Estonian coast the starboard engines died and it was discovered the hull had been punctured and began taking on water. A floating log hit by the vessel was believed to have caused this.

                                                            [Date/Time=08-19-2002 – 10:20 PM]

                                                              Name:Gunther Migeotte gmigeotte@artanderson.com, [Msgid=298219]
                                                              SHEARWATERs to Thailand

                                                                  • Here is a picture I took in mid-April 2002 of the Red Funnel RHS 70

                                                              SHEARWATER 6

                                                                  • . This vessel and the

                                                              SHEARWATER 5

                                                                  • that were advertised on the IHS site were sold. I can tell you that they are going to Thailand via the Med and Suez canal under their own power (mad or what?! I have had some rough rides in these, and that was only going across the Solent to the Isle of Wight). The vessels will be used for taking tourists and divers + equipment to islands off Thailand’s east coast.


                                                              [Date/Time=09-11-2002 – 7:31 PM]

                                                                Name:Neil Newman Newmans@1pinegrove.fsnet.co.uk, [Msgid=308543]
                                                                MEC hydrostatic drive

                                                                  ViewThread

                                                                      • Way back in, I believe, the summer of 1969, Carlo Rodriquez, one of his design engineers and I were having a meal on the terrace of a small restaurant just outside Messina. Carlo, in his usual way, was digging in my plate for the bread-and-something stuffed bell peppers he had ordered for all three of us and which I did not like. By the end of the meal, a telephone call at the restaurant informed Carlo that his house in Musolino (where I was staying) might be threatened by burning trees and shrubbery that had been set ablaze by the erupting Etna. I remember that Carlo rode with me in my Citroën DS 21 to go and check. The polyester roof of the car got scorched when we drove at high speed down a gravel road through burning Eucalypt trees. We arrived safely by the house only to find out that the generator in the shed outside was a bit slow to start, but nothing else had happened and the fire was spreading in a direction away from the house.
                                                                      • When I drove Carlo back to his house in Messina, he mentioned that they were breaking their heads over a new drive system, wanted for further development of their aliscafi, but had not come up with a satisfactory solution. He also mentioned that they would have loved to incorporate it in the GP 40, that, at that time, was being converted from a test bed into a luxury yacht (later to be sold to a man nicknamed “signore mezzo milliardo” by a newspaper for having paid 500 million lire for it).
                                                                      • Later that year, back in Belgium, I drew up some sketches and took them to Roelof Laan’s engineering bureau in Dordrecht, Holland, to discuss them. A couple of months later or so I sent Carlo an outline of my idea to use a hydrostatic drive: pumps coupled to the engines, hydromotor/props mounted on the rear foil. That would certainly have done away with the shaft vibration and other problems that we had discussed. Carlo sent me a polite letter saying that my idea was totally unfeasable and not worth pursuing.
                                                                      • This afternoon, by coincidence, I came across your webpage at

                                                                  http://www.foils.org/navali.htm

                                                                      • and, reminiscing about these bygone days, started to read and was quite surprised to read the following:

                                                                  On the ground of the experience and exciting results with the RHS series, the technical department of Rodriquez Shipyard undertakes a series of studies on research and development which lead to the definition of a new product. The MEC (Maximum Efficiency Craft) series which adds the hydrostatic drive to the hydrofoil idea. This revolutionary propulsion system consisting of a set of hydraulic pumps coupled to a conventional diesel engine and a block of hydraulic motors placed on the foil in turn coupled to a propeller.

                                                                      • Grrr.

                                                                  [Date/Time=09-14-2002 – 8:33 PM]

                                                                    Name:Takeo De Meter a133759@in.pandora.be, [Msgid=309798]
                                                                    MEC hydrostatic drive

                                                                        • Thank you for a layered and fascinating remembrance stimulated by Leopoldo Rodriquez’s history (which is becoming a bit dated) of Rodriquez Cantieri Navali. This history is on our site at

                                                                    http://www.foils.org/navali.htm

                                                                        • . There is more info on the Rodriquez MEC vessel in our photo gallery at

                                                                    http://www.foils.org/gallery/mec.htm

                                                                        • .
                                                                        • I would like to console you with the news that the MEC design was not a technical or commercial success, but in these circumstances, and from your point of view, news of success or news of failure would be equally disappointing!

                                                                    [Date/Time=09-14-2002 – 8:46 PM]

                                                                      Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=309803]
                                                                      MEC hydrostatic drive

                                                                          • Disappointment ? Not really. It is all so long ago, more than 30 years now. But now I also remember a few other things of anecdotic value. The country house in Musolino, in the hills, was rather a small palazzo than a house, with a large flat terrace roof on which his children (and I) put our beds to sleep during the warm summer nights. It was a very pleasant place to stay. When I rode with Carlo in his Lancia to his house in Messina, coming from the Molo Norimberga, he invariably drove up a one-way street in the wrong direction and I often saw policemen saluting him and holding up traffic for him so he got through. There was also a small (5 or 6 metre) craft at the cantiere that was used to test scaled-down foil set-ups. The GP 40 was featured in a french girlie magazine called “Lui” and the article was titled “Un poisson volant qui nous vient d’Italie” (A flying fish that comes towards us from Italy). Carlo was kinda proud of that article – there are not many pictures of the GP 40-. It would “fly” at some 120 Km/h in force 5 seas with no hull movement exceeding 2 degrees in any direction, at one time she had 2 Maybach (MTU) 750 HP V-12 diesel engines, but the early electronics that steered the automatic stability array were very troublesome.

                                                                      [Date/Time=09-14-2002 – 8:48 PM]

                                                                        Name:Takeo De Meter a133759@in.pandora.be, [Msgid=309804]
                                                                        MEC hydrostatic drive

                                                                            • I was looking at the Rodriquez website (

                                                                        http://www2.glauco.it/rodriquez/

                                                                            • ) trying to figure out what the GP 40 was but I couldn’t find any indication of it on their construction listing. The nearest I could come to it was a small experimental craft they called the ST-1 (see photo below from Rodriquez website), the reference on the website to 70-passenger capacity is apparently an error. The photo shows a boat with “Supramar AG” titles on its side. I am wondering whether the ‘small craft of 5-6 metres’ is one and the same as the ‘GP 40’? Placing two 750 HP engines into such a small boat seems difficult to me.


                                                                        [Date/Time=09-15-2002 – 7:55 PM]

                                                                          Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=310083]
                                                                          MEC hydrostatic drive

                                                                              • The GP40 is the original name of the Aliyacht later converted to a passenger RHS110 for Aerobarcos do Brasil and named Flecha de Angra. The Rodriquez site lists it under the last name.
                                                                              • The full story was in Classic Fast Ferries #6 which is no longer available for download but a mail to Tim could help.

                                                                          http://classicfast-f.homepage.dk/

                                                                              • Eje

                                                                          [Date/Time=09-17-2002 – 7:52 AM]

                                                                            Name:Eje Flodstrom eje.flodstrom@yahoo.com, [Msgid=310754]
                                                                            MEC hydrostatic drive

                                                                                • Eje,
                                                                                • Thanks for that explanation. I have a copy of CFF #6 from 2000 and so it was worth reading the article on the RHS 110 series once again.
                                                                                • I didn’t make the connection with the Aliyacht since Takeo had made reference to a small 5-6 metre craft. The Aliyacht was around 24.5m long. Jane’s Surface Skimmers indicates the Aliyacht was powered by two supercharged MTU/Maybach MB 12V 439 TY 71 Diesels rated at 1350 hp which is similar to Takeo’s recollections except that the installed power is greater. It may be possible that the craft was re-powered at some point to achieve greater performance.

                                                                            [Date/Time=09-17-2002 – 9:34 PM]

                                                                              Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=311120]
                                                                              The Albatross

                                                                                ViewThread

                                                                                    • Looking for a good home for the H/V Albatross. Hull and cabin are in good condition. However, she’s missing foils, strut, shaft, rudder, and engine. Anyone knowing of a museum, school, conservator, etc. interested in having it donated to them, please let me know.

                                                                                [Date/Time=11-05-2002 – 1:51 PM]

                                                                                  Name:Robert Miller cbbi@aol.com, [Msgid=333844]
                                                                                  The Albatross
                                                                                  For Bob Miller

                                                                                      • : It has been a couple of years, but here are two possible contacts for you: (1) In April 02, Britt Goudey (

                                                                                  BRITTGOUD@aol.com

                                                                                      • ) notified us that he had found a similar vessel in poor condition in Anchorage, AL and was looking for advice on how to restore it. If the foils are in good shape, perhaps he could combine those with your hull. (2) Back in Aug 02, we were contacted by Ken Tuccillo, phone: 914-478-6375

                                                                                  ktux@netzero.net

                                                                                      • ) who had seen the photos of your restoration and wanted to find a vessel and do a similar conversion. If he bought yours, that would save him the trouble!

                                                                                  For Others interested in this vessel

                                                                                      • : historical and other info, and photos of Bob Miller’s resoration are on the IHS website at

                                                                                  http://www.foils.org/albatross.htm

                                                                                      • . Historical information and photos on the Albatross in her prime are in the Helmut Kock biography at

                                                                                  http://www.foils.org.kockbio.htm

                                                                                      • .

                                                                                  [Date/Time=11-07-2002 – 8:17 AM]

                                                                                    Name:Barney C. Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=334736]
                                                                                    Buy

                                                                                      ViewThread

                                                                                          • We want to buy 02 unit high speed vessel for passenger transportation.( Brand new 100% )passengers 60 – 80. From Russia.
                                                                                          • If you can supply or Export to Vietnam market, please send to us:
                                                                                          • 1. Catalogues, Engine, model, Sepecification,
                                                                                          • 2. Price list FOB any port or CNF any Port Vietnam.
                                                                                          • 3. Origin, manufactory , Sepecification, Payment, quantity, quality….
                                                                                          • Please send by Post Service to Letter-Box:
                                                                                          • Atlantic Group
                                                                                          • P.O.Box No.02 Thanh Khe Central Post Office
                                                                                          • Danang City – Vietnam 59200
                                                                                          • Hotline: 0903581157
                                                                                          • Or send by DHL – EMS to Address:
                                                                                          • Commercial TW2 Building.No.45 Dung Si Thanh Khe Rd
                                                                                          • Thanh Khe Dis., DaNang City – Vietnam
                                                                                          • Atlantic International Co.,(Vietnam)
                                                                                          • Attn: Mr. Nguyen Danh SON/ Director
                                                                                          • Hotline: 090 3581157 * Fax: 0511-655 222

                                                                                      [Date/Time=12-13-2002 – 2:00 AM]

                                                                                        Name:Nguyen Danh Son atlanticvietnam@yahoo.com, [Msgid=350699]
                                                                                        Buy

                                                                                            • Try to contact mister S.J.Stoop:

                                                                                        sjaakstoop@cs.com

                                                                                            • ,
                                                                                            • He is the European contact person of the
                                                                                            • Feodosia shipbuilding association”MORYE”
                                                                                            • ,situated in the Ukraine.
                                                                                            • He can help you to buy a 100% new Voskhod-2M-FFF.
                                                                                            • see my site for the first three Voskhod-2M-FFF ever build.

                                                                                        http://home.wanadoo.nl/~hydrofoils1/fffnews.htm

                                                                                            • Here you can see also more info on the vessels.
                                                                                            • The hydrofoils are great to operate!!!

                                                                                        [Date/Time=12-13-2002 – 3:24 AM]

                                                                                          Name:Capt M van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=350707]
                                                                                          Attached File  “vos-2mnewcol01l~jpg.zip” – size 30148   Click Here To Download
                                                                                          Commercial Ferry Service in Niger

                                                                                              • Ferry Service to accommodate 250 passengers and if possible, as well provide for carrying 20 vehicles.
                                                                                              • There is the need to develop the sea transportation system in the highly populated area of the Niger Delta of Nigeria. Present developments taking place in the area justify this. Presently, there are no fast moving ferry crafts operating in that zone, meanwhile movement of people and goods between various cities, such as, Port Harcourt, Warri and say Bonny, Forcados (which are on the Atlantic Ocean coast line) is high and deserve serious attention.
                                                                                              • It is our intention to propose to the relevant government agencies, the idea of generally modernizing the transportation system in the Niger Delta zone, to include towns on the bank of River Niger.
                                                                                              • The type of vessel we intend to propose for this ferry operation will be either Hydrofoil or Hovercraft, this will speed up movement, yet be very safe
                                                                                              • We are looking for interested companies that will want to consider doing business in Nigeria, on joint venture basis, to offer proposal on this subject, noting the following conditions:
                                                                                              • 1. Supply, Operate and Maintain NEW or REFURBISHED vessel. Refurbished vessel must not
                                                                                              • be over 5 years of age from the date of manufacture.
                                                                                              • 2. Supply adequate spare parts for 2 years operation
                                                                                              • 3. The vessel shall be standard passenger ferry with basic facilities/amenities.
                                                                                              • 4. The vessel shall have service speed (at sea) of between 40 and 55 knots.
                                                                                              • 5. Fuel consumption must be minimum.
                                                                                              • 6. Training local personnel to operate and maintain the vessel.
                                                                                              • We, of course, will be glad to receive proposals from companies that may only want to sell vessels and not involve themselves in the operation, however, such proposal must satisfy our above requirements/conditions.
                                                                                              • Any company that is interested in this venture should come up with a detailed proposal that should be mailed to our address below. Make it for the attention of our Managing Director, Kadiri P. Otaru.
                                                                                              • We shall appreciate an initial e-mail introduction.
                                                                                              • Solid Base Nigeria Limited
                                                                                              • 25A, Fatai Atere Way,
                                                                                              • Matori, Oshodi, Lagos.
                                                                                              • PO Box 369,
                                                                                              • NITEL Train. Sch. Post Office,
                                                                                              • Oshodi, Lagos.
                                                                                              • Tel. 234 1 523018
                                                                                              • Tel/Fax 2341 4526782 (You may send fax to the number 234 1 4934696, 4960338)
                                                                                              • GSM numbers: 234 (0)803 3006423 or 234 (0)802 3109874

                                                                                          [Date/Time=01-20-2003 – 10:07 AM]

                                                                                            Name:Kadiri P. Otaru solidbasenig@yahoo.com, [Msgid=364450]
                                                                                            seattle hydrofoil service to Victoria

                                                                                              ViewThread

                                                                                                  • I am looking for the name of the company who operates a commercial hydrofoil service from Seattle to Victoria, B.C.

                                                                                              [Date/Time=02-06-2003 – 12:06 PM]

                                                                                                Name:charlotte gillis charlotteg@carmnet.com, [Msgid=373335]
                                                                                                Re; seattle hydrofoil to Victoria

                                                                                                    • There is no hydrofoil service, but there are high-speed catamarans that should meet the need. The operator is Clipper Navigation, Inc. 2701 Alaskan Way, Pier 69, Seattle Washington 98121; (206) 448-5000 or 800-888-2535. Or you can book passage on the website:

                                                                                                http://www.victoriaclipper.com

                                                                                                    • . They run 4 boats from 108 feet to 132 feet at speeds of 25 to 45 knots (depends on the tide and traffic). Rates differ at various times of the year running from about US$91 to US$115 round trip with senior and child rates available. 7 day advance purchase can also get you reduced rates. It is possible to go up from Seattle in the morning and return from Victoria in the evening, which will give you about 6 hours to visit Canada. Package deals are also available for overnight stays in accommodations of various rates.

                                                                                                [Date/Time=02-07-2003 – 5:12 AM]

                                                                                                  Name:Sumi Arima arimas1@juno.com, [Msgid=373798]
                                                                                                  Re; seattle hydrofoil service to Victoria

                                                                                                      • The Victoria Clipper’s which are catamarans have been operating a daily service from Pier 69, Seattle to Victoria since the mid 80’s.
                                                                                                      • There is loads of informatiom on the net if you need the details &
                                                                                                      • schedules/prices etc. I don’t think there has been a hydrofoil service
                                                                                                      • on that route since we operated the Boeing Jetfoil demonstration for
                                                                                                      • Washington State Ferries 1n the late 70’s & early 80’s.

                                                                                                  [Date/Time=02-07-2003 – 11:24 AM]

                                                                                                    Name:Bruce Bryant bryant@silverlink.net, [Msgid=373950]
                                                                                                    buying hydrofoil

                                                                                                        • We are a American company working in vietnam. Recently, we want to
                                                                                                        • import 2 second hand hydrofoils (high speed boat). The type of hydrofoil which we
                                                                                                        • are
                                                                                                        • intending to choose is “METEOR 125 seats”, we want you to give us more detail information as
                                                                                                        • well
                                                                                                        • as PRICE of the hydrofoil
                                                                                                        • Moreover, we want the hydrofoil which was newly built : at least
                                                                                                        • after
                                                                                                        • 1991 or 1992( this make us more easier in registering at Vietnam). So
                                                                                                        • if you
                                                                                                        • have any question relalting to this deal, please do not hesitage to
                                                                                                        • contact
                                                                                                        • us asap.
                                                                                                        • Name of company: American technologies,. Inc
                                                                                                        • Website:

                                                                                                    www.ativietnam.com

                                                                                                        • or

                                                                                                    www.bvom.com

                                                                                                        • Address: 26 Pham Van Dong st; Cau giay dist; Hanoi VietNam
                                                                                                        • Tel: 84-4-7681524
                                                                                                        • Fax: 84-4- 7681568
                                                                                                        • Contact person: Nguyen Duc Toan
                                                                                                        • Mail:

                                                                                                    toannguyen@ativietnam.com

                                                                                                        • ;

                                                                                                    toanbb@yahoo.com

                                                                                                        • Hotline: 0903405033

                                                                                                    [Date/Time=03-12-2003 – 2:20 AM]

                                                                                                      Name:Toannguyen toanbb@yahoo.com, [Msgid=394349]
                                                                                                      Catamaran Ferry Needed for India

                                                                                                          • We have a requirement of a 45-50 Seater Ferry purpose Catamaran. The craft will be used for plying in the River on a Commercial purpose in India.
                                                                                                          • Please send us full details of the craft suitable to our requirement. While sending the details please positively include the speed, cost of running and CIF Kolkata, India prices.
                                                                                                          • Thanking you,
                                                                                                          • Ravi Fatehpuria
                                                                                                          • Director
                                                                                                          • Sriniwas Fatehpuria Pvt. Ltd. (est. 1949)
                                                                                                          • Fatehpuria House
                                                                                                          • 82/2, M. R. Babu Street
                                                                                                          • Kolkata – 700 007.
                                                                                                          • India
                                                                                                          • Phn : +91 33 2241 5874 – 5
                                                                                                          • Fax : +91 33 2241 1169
                                                                                                          • E-Mail :

                                                                                                      sfpl@usa.net
                                                                                                      [Date/Time=04-09-2003 – 7:51 AM]

                                                                                                        Name:Ravi Fatehpuria sfpl@usa.net, [Msgid=413150]
                                                                                                        Scrapped Vessels Wanted in Egypt

                                                                                                          ViewThread

                                                                                                              • We are interested to buy any scrapped vessels ready for sale as
                                                                                                              • scrap, which can be towed to Alexandria Egypt. Can you offer any? Or can you recommend to us any web site to visit in this regard?

                                                                                                          [Date/Time=04-16-2003 – 7:18 PM]

                                                                                                            Name:M. Khaled Naweto aba@internetegypt.com, [Msgid=418564]
                                                                                                            Re; Scrapped Vessels Wanted in Egypt

                                                                                                                • You can contact Mr. P de Boer at:

                                                                                                            p.d.boer@connexxion.nl

                                                                                                                • Our company has two Voskhod hydrofoils for “scrap” sale.

                                                                                                            [Date/Time=04-17-2003 – 2:57 PM]

                                                                                                              Name:Capt M van Rijzen dutchhydrofoils@wanadoo.nl, [Msgid=419198]
                                                                                                              Re furb Aircraft Seats for Ferries Availa

                                                                                                                  • We are an avaition company dealing with Aircraft passanger seats.We have attained Some 500 Aircraft seats on (Tourist class/ Business class and First class ).I have noticed that there are Ferry vessels using these seats too.I would like to Invite anyone who is interested in purchasing or leasing these seats.We are located in Singapore & Malaysia.Please contact me for any inquirey.

                                                                                                              [Date/Time=04-21-2003 – 5:44 AM]

                                                                                                                Name:Rauff Kareem bess1@singnet.com.sg, [Msgid=421164]
                                                                                                                Florida Hydrofoil to Bahamas

                                                                                                                  ViewThread

                                                                                                                      • I am looking for either a website or phone number for a hydrofoil service in West Palm Beach Florida, that takes you to The Bahamas. Can you help me?

                                                                                                                  [Date/Time=04-28-2003 – 12:31 PM]

                                                                                                                    Name:Sarah Mack SMACK1@tampabay.rr.com, [Msgid=426450]
                                                                                                                    Re; Florida Hydrofoil to Bahamas

                                                                                                                        • Sarah, SeaJets Ltd used to offer hydrofoil service between West Palm Beach Fl and Freeport Bahamas via Boeing 929 Jetfoil, but this company has ceased operations.

                                                                                                                    [Date/Time=04-28-2003 – 12:36 PM]

                                                                                                                      Name:Barney C. Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=426453]
                                                                                                                      Question

                                                                                                                        ViewThread

                                                                                                                            • I have a newbie question on high speed ferries…
                                                                                                                            • when you talk about the Output Power of a vessel, you have the engine output, shaft output, waterjet output, propeller output … and also you have the RPM readings for an engine, do you have a common format when you talk about the output power of a vessel ?
                                                                                                                            • or where should I go for a simple tutorial for the definitions of the basic parameters of a vessel ?
                                                                                                                            • thanks !

                                                                                                                        [Date/Time=05-07-2003 – 10:27 AM]

                                                                                                                          Name:Kevin Tse kevin@softrepublic.com, [Msgid=431479]
                                                                                                                          Re; Question

                                                                                                                              • Dear Kevin,
                                                                                                                              • I note that you have posted on the International Hydrofoil Society (IHS) bulletin board a question about power. Most refer to the horsepower available at the specified RPM of the propulsion engine installed.

                                                                                                                          [Date/Time=05-09-2003 – 8:54 PM]

                                                                                                                            Name:Sumi Arima arimas1@juno.com, [Msgid=433336]
                                                                                                                            Looking for hydrofoils to buy

                                                                                                                              ViewThread

                                                                                                                                  • I’m looking for 3 hydrofoils (more than 100 passengers, and less than 15 years old).

                                                                                                                              [Date/Time=05-10-2003 – 10:28 AM]

                                                                                                                                Name:Rachid Khelouat rkhelouat@yahoo.com, [Msgid=433481]
                                                                                                                                Re; Looking for hydrofoils to buy

                                                                                                                                    • Please contact me giving me your name and address and phone number and some information about the vessels you want. Also where do you want them delivered and approximate budget you have for purchase of the vessels.
                                                                                                                                    • I will provide vessels available.
                                                                                                                                    • I am currently located in Dubai working with clients.
                                                                                                                                    • Tom Schneider
                                                                                                                                    • The InterMar Group

                                                                                                                                intermargrp@aol.com
                                                                                                                                [Date/Time=05-11-2003 – 11:18 AM]

                                                                                                                                  Name:Tom Schneider intermargrp@aol.com, [Msgid=433830]
                                                                                                                                  Re; Looking for hydrofoils to buy

                                                                                                                                      • Please visit my website. have access to others besides the 76′ CAT which is a hydrofoil assisted CAT. Currently she is being looked at by a Company here in the US.
                                                                                                                                      • visit

                                                                                                                                  www.yachtminder.com
                                                                                                                                  [Date/Time=05-11-2003 – 12:00 PM]

                                                                                                                                    Name:Christopher Whitlock chris@yachtminder.com, [Msgid=433847]
                                                                                                                                    Re; Question

                                                                                                                                        • Hello Kevin,
                                                                                                                                        • I would agree with Sumi that the installed engine power is most commonly referred to when quoting the ‘power’ of a ship. Of course each type of engine has all sorts of different power ratings, but the most commonly referred to is “Maximum Continuous Rating” or MCR.
                                                                                                                                        • When calculating the speed a ship can attain, it is important to account for all the losses in transmitting the engine power to the water, hence allowing for gearbox and shaft losses through friction, and hydrodynamic losses due to the hull and propulsion system. Other losses are associated with such items as fluid couplings and hydraulic or electrical propulsion systems (where generator, convertor, transmission and motor losses need to be allowed for).
                                                                                                                                        • In terms of RPM, it is not unusual for the propeller shaft RPM to be identified rather than the engine RPM, however these are simply related to one another by the gear ratio of any gearbox (invariably a reduction gearbox) installed in the ship.
                                                                                                                                        • Marine Engineering or Naval Architecture textbooks should be helpful in defining some of the parameters that are commonly used. For example, you may be able to access a copy of Volume 2 of “Principles of Naval Architecture” published by the Society of Naval Architects and Marine Engineers (SNAME).
                                                                                                                                        • Regards,
                                                                                                                                        • Martin Grimm

                                                                                                                                    [Date/Time=05-13-2003 – 8:16 AM]

                                                                                                                                      Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=434658]
                                                                                                                                      waterjet thrust curves

                                                                                                                                        ViewThread

                                                                                                                                            • I am looking for the waterjet thrust curves including the cavitation limits for the Kamewa 63 SII waterjet. Can anybody supply me with these?

                                                                                                                                        [Date/Time=05-14-2003 – 11:24 AM]

                                                                                                                                          Name:Gunther Migeotte gunther@cae.co.za, [Msgid=435340]
                                                                                                                                          Re; waterjet thrust curves

                                                                                                                                            ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                • To the best of my knowledge, the information you want is company proprietary to KAMEWA. Your best bet is to contact them directly. The main reason for not advertisig those numbers are that they are installation specific to Hull Form, Intallation Location (height, angle) and Inlet congiguration.
                                                                                                                                                • Hope this helps
                                                                                                                                                • Bill White

                                                                                                                                            [Date/Time=05-15-2003 – 12:06 PM]

                                                                                                                                              Name:Bill White whitewn@speakeasy.net, [Msgid=435954]
                                                                                                                                              San Diego – Oceanside hydrofoil

                                                                                                                                                ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                    • For those who live near Southern California there is a hydrofoil boat service between San Diego and Oceanside. You can learn more about it at

                                                                                                                                                www.TakeTheWave.com

                                                                                                                                                    • .
                                                                                                                                                    • I have taken it twice. The evening boat leaves San Diego at 5:35 and reaches Oceanside in 1.5 hours. You can enjoy a resaurant dinner at the Oceanside harbor and walk or taxi to the Amtrak station to catch the 9:23 to San Diego, arriving two blocks from your departure. The boat costs $5.00 and the train is about the same. The program is temporarily subsidized by a government grant.
                                                                                                                                                    • The Wave is a 149 passenger boat with four 1,000 HP diesel engines powering two water jets. The hull is supported by submerged foils fore and aft. These foils partially elevate the hull, and the load is shared by the planing hull.
                                                                                                                                                    • This hybrid system has advantages over a pure planing hull. It uses less power and fuel. It has a relatively small wake that allows 45 MPH passage through the crowded San Diego harbor. Its motion at sea is relatively comfortable. Less roll, pitch and pounding.

                                                                                                                                                [Date/Time=05-15-2003 – 10:17 PM]

                                                                                                                                                  Name:Ray Vellinga rvell@san.rr.com, [Msgid=436293]
                                                                                                                                                  Re; waterjet thrust curves

                                                                                                                                                      • Gunther, Bill,
                                                                                                                                                      • I can back up what Bill has said. I once asked a KaMeWa representative whether it was possible to get performance data for their waterjet series, just as is normal for standard propeller series. The reply was that by all means we could obtain KaMeWa performance predictions and selection of the most suitable size units for a design in question, but the company does not provide general design charts. Once a design is developed in more detail additional data can usually be obtained from the waterjet manufacturer on the thrust vs RPM & input power relationships at different ship speeds.
                                                                                                                                                      • Regards,
                                                                                                                                                      • Martin

                                                                                                                                                  [Date/Time=05-19-2003 – 7:57 AM]

                                                                                                                                                    Name:Martin Grimm seaflite@alphalink.com.au, [Msgid=437779]
                                                                                                                                                    Want to ride on a HYDROFOIL

                                                                                                                                                        • I have been studying HYDROFOIL designs, and think I have “nailed” it. Now need to ride on someone’s craft. I live in South Florida but am willing to go anywhere in NA for an extended ride. Any one have an operating Hydrofoil Boat who can accomodate my request?

                                                                                                                                                    [Date/Time=06-03-2003 – 7:30 AM]

                                                                                                                                                      Name:Gerry Levine gerrymega@adelphia.net, [Msgid=446219]
                                                                                                                                                      Joint Venture Sought in the Philippines

                                                                                                                                                        ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                            • I intend to operate a hydrofoil to serve the transportation of passengers between the two main islands in the Philippines. I plan to enter into a joint venture/partnership with a vessel/hydrofoil owner wherein the operation, management and manning will come from my side. Some important details to consider:
                                                                                                                                                            • Passenger capacity: 120-150
                                                                                                                                                            • Speed: 35-40 kts
                                                                                                                                                            • I am currently operating two fast crafts serving the same place.

                                                                                                                                                        [Date/Time=06-23-2003 – 5:22 PM]

                                                                                                                                                          Name:Felicito Datinguinoo luchijane@aol.com, [Msgid=458458]
                                                                                                                                                          Re; San Diego – Oceanside hydrofoil

                                                                                                                                                              • FYI- This vessel is formerly the Westfoil. The air propulsion system, and foils have been removed, and the foil and interceptor system employed as mentioned. I live in SD, but have yet to try it. Sounds interesting though.

                                                                                                                                                          [Date/Time=07-01-2003 – 7:22 PM]

                                                                                                                                                            Name:Kurt Jordan lakingsfankurt@sbcglobal.net, [Msgid=463048]
                                                                                                                                                            The Boeing Jetfoil

                                                                                                                                                              ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                                  • Hi, I got some question about Boeing Jetfoil.
                                                                                                                                                                  • Does anyone know why Boeing gave up the developement of the Jetfoil 929 and sold the whold deal to Kawasaski in 1987?
                                                                                                                                                                  • Were the 2 929-120 patrol-boat shipped to Indonesia? and did the Indonesian armed their 929-120s? According to the Kawasaki JPS website (seems to be the last and the most “official” website about Jetfoil left on the planet..), the Indonesian are now having 2 Jetfoils, I’d like to know which 2 is the Indonesian operating now? and where’s the others?
                                                                                                                                                                  • Does the Indonesian still have the building licence and the capability to build Jetfoils?
                                                                                                                                                                  • And Finally, how many Boeing/Kawasaki Jetfoils are still operating?
                                                                                                                                                                  • Thanks everyone!

                                                                                                                                                              [Date/Time=07-06-2003 – 6:26 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                Name:Felix Ng felisvoski@yahoo.com.hk, [Msgid=465206]
                                                                                                                                                                Re; The Boeing Jetfoil

                                                                                                                                                                  ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                                      • According to the 1993/1994 edition of Jane’s High-Speed Marine Craft 26th edition (the latest edition I personally have), there are two Jetfoil 929-115 vessels in Indonesia. The operators are listed as PT PELNI (Pelayaran Nasional Indonesia) / PT PAL Indonesia / P Seribu Paradise Travel Agent. The names are Bima Samudera I delivered 1982 and Binida II delivered 1986. There is a note that the Binida II is Navy-owned. Routes operated are listed as Tanjung Priok, Jakarta to Pandang, Lampung (Srengsan) three days a week and Tanjung Priok, Jakarta to Palau Putri, P Seribu on Sundays (this info may be obsolete).
                                                                                                                                                                      • As to why Boeing decided to get out of the Jetfoil business, there are a few retired Boeing people who worked on the Jetfoil program and who visit the IHS website, so hopefully one of them will respond to you and give some insight.
                                                                                                                                                                      • Parenthetically, China State Shipbuilding Corp offers and is still making (or able to make) a high speed hydrofoil ferry the PS 30 that looks pretty much like a reverse engineered Jetfoil.
                                                                                                                                                                      • As to how many Jetfoils are still operating today, possibly the best source of that information would be Fast Ferry International (

                                                                                                                                                                  www.fastferryinfo.com

                                                                                                                                                                      • ). They publish a database of vessels, operators, shipyards, etc. I checked the 1995 version of that database, which is the latest I have, and found that 38 Jetfoils were listed as operating at that time.

                                                                                                                                                                  [Date/Time=07-07-2003 – 6:07 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                    Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=465573]
                                                                                                                                                                    Re; The Boeing Jetfoil

                                                                                                                                                                        • The Boeing Company did not sell the “whold deal” to Kawasaki. It licenced the manufacture and sale of the Jetfoil 115 model to Kawasaki. The reason why The Boeing Company licensed the 115 model is proprietory until made public by the company.
                                                                                                                                                                        • Harry Larsen

                                                                                                                                                                    [Date/Time=07-07-2003 – 11:58 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                      Name:Harry Larsen htdr.larsen@verizon.net, [Msgid=465696]
                                                                                                                                                                      EAST COAST OPERATING FOIL ASSISTED CATAMARAN

                                                                                                                                                                        ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                                            • Chattanooga, TN is considering purchasing and operating for tourists & locals a 49-70 passenger-only foil-assisted catamaran which would run year-round from our million-visitor Tennessee Aquarium 20+ miles downstream to the beautiful Tennessee River Gorge. We’re trying to find an East Coast or Great Lakes vessel which is running this sort of route so we can visit and study it. Cruising speed must be 30-50 knots. Please email

                                                                                                                                                                        jm7403@bellsouth.net

                                                                                                                                                                            • or call John McDonald, 423-756-4082 collect if you know of any such operating vessel. Thanks

                                                                                                                                                                        [Date/Time=07-14-2003 – 8:07 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                          Name:John jm7403@bellsouth.net, [Msgid=466507]
                                                                                                                                                                          re; passenger ferry

                                                                                                                                                                              • Dear Mr. McDonald,
                                                                                                                                                                              • I sent you some information some time ago regarding our company and some of the vessels we have built. I understand that you are looking for a high speed passenger vessel for the Aquarium. We have 30 conventional passenger catamaran ferries, that we have built, that we could show you. We have the technology available to us from Unstel in South Africa to apply lifting foils to our existing designs. We would be happy to meet with you to discuss your specific needs and make a formal presentation.
                                                                                                                                                                              • Best Regards
                                                                                                                                                                              • Peter J. Duclos
                                                                                                                                                                              • President, Director of Business Development
                                                                                                                                                                              • Gladding-Hearn Shipbuilding
                                                                                                                                                                              • Duclos Corporation
                                                                                                                                                                              • 1 Riverside Ave. Box 300
                                                                                                                                                                              • Somerset, MA 02726-0300
                                                                                                                                                                              • USA(GMT-5)
                                                                                                                                                                              • Phone: (01) 508-676-8596
                                                                                                                                                                              • Fax: (01) 508-672-1873
                                                                                                                                                                              • E-mail:

                                                                                                                                                                          peterd@gladding-hearn.com

                                                                                                                                                                              • Web site:

                                                                                                                                                                          http://www.gladding-hearn.com

                                                                                                                                                                              • Important Notice: This message and attachment(s) are the property of Duclos Corporation
                                                                                                                                                                              • and are intended only for the original recipient(s). They must not be copied or forwarded,
                                                                                                                                                                              • in whole or in part without their express written permission.

                                                                                                                                                                          [Date/Time=07-15-2003 – 8:52 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                            Name:Peter J. Duclos peterd@gladding-hearn.com, [Msgid=470095]
                                                                                                                                                                            Re; The Boeing Jetfoil

                                                                                                                                                                                • Thanks for your reply. I also looked into some Jane’s Publications (Surface Skimmers ’83 to High Speed Marine Crafts ’03) in the library here in Hong Kong. But the mystery of the Indonesian ships are still unsolved. In the Jane’s books, there’re 3 unnamed Jetfoils include one 929-119 and two 929-120s in list beside the 929-115 “Bima Samudera I” and the 929-119(?) “Bininda II”. The big mystery is all about the 3 unnamed Jetfoils in the island country.

                                                                                                                                                                            [Date/Time=07-16-2003 – 6:57 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                              Name:Felix Ng felisvoski@yahoo.com.hk, [Msgid=470823]
                                                                                                                                                                              Buy Albatros

                                                                                                                                                                                ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                                                    • Search for hidrofoil Albatros or similar for cca 30 passengers.

                                                                                                                                                                                [Date/Time=09-05-2003 – 3:01 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                                  Name:Danijel Miskovic danijel.miskovic@ri.hinet.hr, [Msgid=501200]
                                                                                                                                                                                  Re; Buy Albatros

                                                                                                                                                                                      • Hello, Danijel. When someone attempted to send you an email about your posting, your Internet Service Provider responded: “Remote host said: “553 5.3.0 No such user”. If you made an error in typing your email address, please email a correction to

                                                                                                                                                                                  bbs@foils.org

                                                                                                                                                                                      • so that this can be fixed. Otherwise, sellers will not be able to contact you privately. In many cases, sellers will not want to make the details of their offer public by putting them on the BBS, but would prefer to exchange emails with you privately.

                                                                                                                                                                                  [Date/Time=09-07-2003 – 9:34 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                                    Name:Barney C Black webmaster@foils.org, [Msgid=502447]
                                                                                                                                                                                    Re; Re; The Boeing Jetfoil

                                                                                                                                                                                        • Dear Sir,
                                                                                                                                                                                        • I guess I am the right person who knows about five Boeing Jetfoil in Indonesia.
                                                                                                                                                                                        • If any persons want to make any deals with this vessels please do not hesitate to contact us at

                                                                                                                                                                                    sentot@lycos.com

                                                                                                                                                                                        • or my fax 62 31 561 2293.
                                                                                                                                                                                        • We wellcome to any posibilities to work with.
                                                                                                                                                                                        • Best regards,

                                                                                                                                                                                    [Date/Time=09-20-2003 – 7:21 PM]

                                                                                                                                                                                      Name:Sentot Adi Pramono sentot@lycos.com, [Msgid=511166]
                                                                                                                                                                                      re; Distance, rate

                                                                                                                                                                                          • Dear Sir,
                                                                                                                                                                                          • What is the distance between this two island?
                                                                                                                                                                                          • How many trip per day/week/year?
                                                                                                                                                                                          • How much the rate per trip per passenger?
                                                                                                                                                                                          • I am in position to find out any cooperation for Indonesian Boeing Jetfoil.
                                                                                                                                                                                          • Best regards,

                                                                                                                                                                                      [Date/Time=09-20-2003 – 7:26 PM]

                                                                                                                                                                                        Name:Sentot Adi Pramono sentot@lycos.com, [Msgid=511168]
                                                                                                                                                                                        Partner for Persian Gulf

                                                                                                                                                                                            • Owners of 1 or 2 hydrofoils in excellent condition and passenger capacity of 50+ and min.speed of 35+ are invited for a pax liner service in Persian Gulf specially for oil rigs and plants and offshore
                                                                                                                                                                                            • passenger sevices between Gulf islands.
                                                                                                                                                                                            • Fule+crew+shore offices+maintnance services+P&O and full insurances
                                                                                                                                                                                            • will be on our side and a very high revenue is guaranted.
                                                                                                                                                                                            • Captain Ali Jodat

                                                                                                                                                                                        jodatjoo@msn.com
                                                                                                                                                                                        [Date/Time=12-04-2003 – 4:57 PM]

                                                                                                                                                                                          Name:Captain Ali Jodat jodatjoo@msn.com, [Msgid=554213]
                                                                                                                                                                                          Project seeks design partner

                                                                                                                                                                                              • I am planning to build an airboat that converts into a hydrofoil once it leaves the shallow river. The plan is to be able to transport at least five tons of cargo. If you can help in the design of such a project and want to get involved on some other level; ordering one if it turns out okay, investing, purchasing one, etc. please email me and we can talk.

                                                                                                                                                                                          [Date/Time=12-05-2003 – 12:37 PM]

                                                                                                                                                                                            Name:Daryan daryan@meroiran.com, [Msgid=554659]
                                                                                                                                                                                            I Need some Help

                                                                                                                                                                                              ViewThread

                                                                                                                                                                                                  • I Have 3 Hydrofoil to 50 passangers but they are 10 years stoped. The boats don’t float anymore. The machines still closed and out water. I’m looking for some hel´p from you beacause a need to sold those 3 machines, they have 500hp Detroit Diesel. I have some pics but i don’t know where to send…..can you help me ?
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • Thanks
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • Andre Regueira – Florianopolis – Santa Catarina – Brazil

                                                                                                                                                                                              [Date/Time=03-26-2004 – 10:15 AM]

                                                                                                                                                                                                Name:Andre Regueira maicarudo@hotmail.com, [Msgid=621297]
                                                                                                                                                                                                Re; I Need some Help

                                                                                                                                                                                                    • Hello Andre. This will be difficult to sell internationally, I think. Maybe the best possibility is to sell one-at-a-time to someone locally who wants to restore one as a hobby or as a small business. If you reply to this message, you can attach a photo as a jpg file. To do this, just click on the box below by the text “Click here to attach a file or photo to this message.” Then click the “Submit Message” button. You will be prompted to attach your photo. Best of luck to you…

                                                                                                                                                                                                [Date/Time=03-26-2004 – 9:16 PM]

                                                                                                                                                                                                  Name:Barney C Black barney@alum.mit.edu, [Msgid=621641]
                                                                                                                                                                                                  Hydrofoil ALBATROSS

                                                                                                                                                                                                      • I recently received some inquiries as to the status of the hydrofoil ALBATROSS. However, in my usual procrastanating manner, I deleted the emails before I could copy the addresses of those who sent them. My apologies on this. The ALBATROSS is still in Centereach, Long Island in a rather neglected state. Still hoping to interest a museum in adopting her. She was the only one of her class to be built in Costa Mesa, CA. All the others were built in West Chester, PA. Wilson was supposed to build them at their yard but according to Helmut Kock, they did not have the experience in welding aluminum so a sub-contractor was used. Again my apologies on the belated response to the inquiries.

                                                                                                                                                                                                  [Date/Time=04-06-2004 – 6:00 PM]

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Name:Robert Miller cbbi@aol.com, [Msgid=627414]
                                                                                                                                                                                                    boat motors

                                                                                                                                                                                                        • we have 3 Mercedes motor for sall.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • all three are the same brand:MERCEDES.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • are complet and with all details.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • MTU:V8
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • NR:331.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • all manufactured:1978.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • 662 KWA.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • 2250 RPM.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • one of the 3 motors has Zero our working and the other tow has worked 3000 ours.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • price:for the new one:100 000 USD.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • the tow other:80 000 USD each.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • all three motors:200 000 USD.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • if you are interested then feel free to ask for more details.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • best regards.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • Daniel,Stockholm.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • tel(46)737289725.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    [Date/Time=06-24-2004 – 1:39 PM]

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Name:Daniel danielmatte94@hotmail.com, [Msgid=669225]


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                                                                                                                                                                                                      MAPC

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Maritime Applied Physics Corporation (MAPC) provides a mix of scientists, engineers, naval architects and technicians who are motivated to move ideas from concept through design and prototype.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering, formed in 1999, is dedicated to design and engineering support of high performance marine vehicles- primarily for the development of advanced ride control systems. These systems are analogous to an aircraft flight control system. Unlike traditional fin roll stabilization systems, a ride control system often reduces dynamic variations in pitch, roll, yaw and/or heave motions simultaneously- while concurrently maintaining list, trim, heading or height above the surface at user-defined values.  Proper design and implementation of the entire integrated system, from the effectors and their servo dynamics to the main control algorithm software, is essential in achieving the highest possible performance.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering personnel employ 3D CAD/CAM, Algor FEMPRO FEA with MES, plus various vortex lattice and panel based CFD analysis tools to optimize the effectors for these systems. Sea-keeping simulations, model tests, a vast experience base and scientifically performed sea trials are also used to refine system parameters.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The most advanced IEI motion stabilization system, fielded jointly with Quantum Marine Engineering of Florida, is currently installed on the U.S. Navy’s LSC(X) ‘Sea Fighter’. The system consists of two actively controlled titanium ‘T’ foils mounted near the bow, two active transom interceptors, and two actively controlled flapped skegs for yaw control. System components are linked via an EMI resistant fiber optic LAN.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ‘Spectrum’ systems can be provided for vessels of all types in the 50-300’ range. IEI recently installed yacht trim tab systems on a 56 Ft monohull, as well as a 65 Ft catamaran built by Multihull Technologies in Florida.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Click Here to contact:

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Senix

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Senix

                                                                                                                                                                                                       

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Our ultrasonic sensors are being used on numerous hydrofoils including, we think, all the America’s cup boats,  two electric hydrofoil startups. and a few of the university hydrofoil challenge teams.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      We’ve become the vendor of choice for hydrofoils and are working to remain so.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Dimitri Chernyshov
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Marketing and Sales Manager

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ToughSonic® Ultrasonic Sensors.  Tough. Smart.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ultrasonic sensors ToughSonic familySenix ToughSonic® ultrasonic sensors measure level and distance through air using ultrasonic sound waves, often replacing unreliable mechanical devices. They provide high reliability and fast, non-contact measurements at distances up to 50 feet (15.2 meters). Thousands are in use worldwide in many industries in both indoor and outdoor applications.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The Senix ToughSonic and ToughSonic CHEM product lines represent more than 25 years of ultrasonic innovation and engineering. Senix was the first company to introduce computer-controlled ultrasonic sensors in 1990 and we have been making them tougher and smarter ever since. Senix ultrasonic sensors are designed to handle even the most challenging liquid and distance measurement applications and environments. We make them tough and smart and we back them up with outstanding customer service and support.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Tough Construction

                                                                                                                                                                                                      • Rugged electronic circuitry designed and engineered specifically to meet Toughsonic standards for power, control and longevity.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • The highest quality, ruggedized piezoelectric ultrasonic transducers.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • Electronics, transducers and cables fully potted in an epoxy resin chosen for its exceptional strength and unique acoustic properties.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • 316 Stainless steel or Kynar® (PVDF) housings designed to stand up to the most demanding environments.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Smart Features

                                                                                                                                                                                                      • SenixVIEW™ Software
                                                                                                                                                                                                        Every ToughSonic® sensor comes with SenixVIEW sensor configuration and analysis software. SenixVIEW allows you to customize over 60 configuration parameters, dozens of output combinations, networking, data logging and reporting features all accessible through an intuitive graphical interface. SenixVIEW gives you complete control over your ultrasonic sensors.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • Outputs
                                                                                                                                                                                                        ToughSonic® sensors have up to six simultaneous outputs that are fully configurable using SenixVIEW software. In addition to RS-232, RS-485 or ASCII serial data output, there are three analog outputs and two solid state switches.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • “Teach Feature”
                                                                                                                                                                                                        Many ToughSonic® models can be configured using a simple pushbutton “Teach” feature. We invented this feature in 1990 and it continues to be the easiest sensor control mechanism available.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Common Sensor Applications

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ultrasonic water level sensor in tank   Liquid Level

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Our sensors are commonly used to measure liquid level in tanks, streams, channels and weirs. We measure benign, acidic, caustic, and hazardous liquids in demanding indoor and outdoor environments. Read more on tank level and remote water level applications.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ultrasonic sensor measuring distance to object   Object Detection

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ToughSonic sensors detect the presence, absence or position of an object or person. We use high sensitivity transducers and advanced control algorithms to detect  small objects and even weak-reflecting materials such as clothing and woven and non-woven materials. Read more on object detection applications.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Call or email us with your sensor challenges before or after you purchase our products.  We’ll help you get the most out of your ultrasonic sensors. +1 802 489 7585.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Go to Senix.com to see what our customers say…

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Omnic Management Systems uses ToughSonic ultrasonic sensors

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Cable One buys ultrasonic sensors from Senix

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Iowa Flood Center uses Senix ultrasonic sensors

                                                                                                                                                                                                       

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering, Inc

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering, Inc

                                                                                                                                                                                                       

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering, formed in 1999, is dedicated to design and engineering support of high performance marine vehicles – primarily for the development of advanced ride control systems.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering is one of a very few companies that specialize in providing the stabilization and motioIsland Engineering is one of a very few companies that specialize in providing the stabilization and motion control that a ship or craft requires in order to be able to accomplish its purposes. That may involve ensuring a ship-launched weapon will hit its target, or a helicopter or Rigid Hull Inflatable Boat can be deployed safely, or a yacht owner’s martini won’t spill. Requirements and solutions can vary widely from one case to the next, and Island Engineering has dealt with a wide variety of ships, craft and equipment involved in such solutions. Island Engineering handles all aspects of this work, from basic analysis to design and engineering, all the way to fabrication and shipboard installation of stabilization systems. n control that a ship or craft requires in order to be able to accomplish its purposes. That may involve ensuring a ship-launched weapon will hit its target, or a helicopter or Rigid Hull Inflatable Boat can be deployed safely, or a yacht owner’s martini won’t spill. Requirements and solutions can vary widely from one case to the next, and Island Engineering has dealt with a wide variety of ships, craft and equipment involved in such solutions. Island Engineering handles all aspects of this work, from basic analysis to design and engineering, all the way to fabrication and shipboard installation of stabilization systems.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Moreover, the company is well known for its ability and willingness to tackle all manner of unusual and challenging engineering projects. Island Engineering, formed in 1999, is dedicated to design and engineering support of high performance marine vehicles – primarily for the development of advanced ride control systems.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering, formed in 1999, is dedicated to design and engineering support of high performance marine vehicles- primarily for the development of advanced ride control systems. These systems are analogous to an aircraft flight control system. Unlike traditional fin roll stabilization systems, a ride control system often reduces dynamic variations in pitch, roll, yaw and/or heave motions simultaneously- while concurrently maintaining list, trim, heading or height above the surface at user-defined values.  Proper design and implementation of the entire integrated system, from the effectors and their servo dynamics to the main control algorithm software, is essential in achieving the highest possible performance.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering personnel employ 3D CAD/CAM, Algor FEMPRO FEA with MES, plus various vortex lattice and panel based CFD analysis tools to optimize the effectors for these systems. Sea-keeping simulations, model tests, a vast experience base and scientifically performed sea trials are also used to refine system parameters.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The most advanced IEI motion stabilization system, fielded jointly with Quantum Marine Engineering of Florida, is currently installed on the U.S. Navy’s LSC(X) ‘Sea Fighter’. The system consists of two actively controlled titanium ‘T’ foils mounted near the bow, two active transom interceptors, and two actively controlled flapped skegs for yaw control. System components are linked via an EMI resistant fiber optic LAN.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ‘Spectrum’ systems can be provided for vessels of all types in the 50-300’ range. IEI recently installed yacht trim tab systems on a 56 Ft monohull, as well as a 65 Ft catamaran built by Multihull Technologies in Florida.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      />

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Personal Motor Power

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                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hi-foil
                                                                                                                                                                                                      The Hi-Foil was sold about 1970 by Anglican Development Ltd on the Isle of Wight. This British personal hydrofoil was designed to seat 2 people. It has motorcycle steering.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (27k)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoil built by Steve Gresham and Greame Vanner

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (148k)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Dynafoil
                                                                                                                                                                                                      More Information
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Grumman’s SEA WINGS
                                                                                                                                                                                                      1963 Grumman sea wing boat owned by Allan Dinizio. He has the original engine and trailer. The boat is complete except for the windshield. As of 121127wnwMore Information

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Go To Main Page


                                                                                                                                                                                                      This part of the site is maintained by Malin Dixon

                                                                                                                                                                                                      BIBLIOGRAPY Technical Journals, Papers, and Books (REDUNDANT?)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      International Hydrofoil Society Presents…
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoil Bibliography
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoil References In Technical Journals, Papers, and Books

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (Mostly, But Not Entirely, Limited to Engine Powered Vessels)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      NOTE: THIS MAY BE A DUPLICATE COPY OF THE SAME MATERIAL.  THE LINKS HAVE NOT BEEN ACTIVATED IN THIS PAGE.  OF COURSE THE READER IS ENCOURAGED TO GOOGLE ANY MATERIAL TO FIND LINKS ON THEIR OWN.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      RV

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Last Update January 29, 2016

                                                                                                                                                                                                      For Hydrofoil References in Popular Magazines and Books, Click Here
                                                                                                                                                                                                      For Information on the IHS Advanced Marine Vehicle CD-ROM, Click Here
                                                                                                                                                                                                      For More Bibliographies, Especially Sailing Related, Try the IHS Links Page)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      For FAQs, Posted Messages, and Discussion About Hydrofoil Design Texts, Software, and Sources, Click Here
                                                                                                                                                                                                      The Premier Sources For Descriptions and Principal Characteristics of Specific Military and Commercial Hydrofoils is Jane’s High Speed Marine Craft (formerly: Surface Skimmers, Hovercraft, and Hydrofoils) and Fast Ferry International
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Click Here To Suggest Additional Reference(s)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Of course every IHS Newsletter is packed with articles about hydrofoils. To view an index of past articles in MS Excel format, Click Here

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Go To IHS Main Page

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Abbott and Von Doenhoff, ” Theory of Wing Sections” – Old but classic book still published in paperback form by Dover Publications, Inc.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Acosta, A.J., “Hydrofoils and Hydrofoil Craft,” 1973, 24 pages, California Institute of Technology, Pasadena CA USA. Sponsored in part by Office of Naval Research, Washington, DC and Naval Ship Research and Development Center, Washington, DC. Published in Annual Review of Fluid Mechanics, v5 p161-184 1973. Abstract: The successful achievements of hydrofoil craft to date and the possibility of high speeds at sea are due to the greatly increased understanding in recent years of the flow past hydrofoils and to the development of foil configurations and control systems for coping with the roughness of the sea surface. It seems appropriate, therefore, to link the discussion of hydrofoils with that of progress in the craft. The general characteristics of hydrofoil craft are reviewed together with some representative modern examples. Some physical aspects of the flow past hydrofoils are described, followed by a resume of some of the recent methods used in design and analysis of hydrofoils. Available from: National Technical Information Service; 5285 Port Royal Road; Springfield VA 22151 USA. Source Data: AD-760230 u7313. Order Number: AD-760230
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Alternative Hullforms for High-Performance Ferries – SNAME technical report examines the hullforms available for high-performance ferries, including planing monohulls, catamarans and other multihull vessels, small-waterplane vessels, hydrofoils, hovercraft, air-cushion vehicles, surface-effect ships, WIGs, and channel-flow-wing craft. For each type, attributes and issues are cited, and tables of principal characteristics and photographs of examples are provided. This Technical and Research Report R-51, may now be ordered from cpujols@sname.org. The 35-page report, with 22 illustrations, is being issued as a compact disk, priced at $30 ($15 for SNAME members).

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Altman, R., “The Design of Supercavitating Hydrofoil Wings,” Technical Report 001-14, Hydronautics Inc., April 1968

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Aroner, R. and R. M. Hubbard, “DEH, A High Endurance Escort Hydrofoil For the Fleet,” AIAA Paper No. 74-311, AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, San Diego, California, February 25-27 1974.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Asseo, S.J. and F. Dell’Amico, “An analysis of three hydrofoil boat control systems,” Cornell Aeronautical Laboratories, Inc. Buffalo, 1965.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Assessment of High Speed Waterborne Vessels and Their Builders,” Advanced Marine Systems Assoc, Inc; 9421 Chatteroy PL; Gaithersburg MD; Report No. UMTA-IT-32-0001-84-5, Aug 84, 191 pages. Available from NTIS, 5285 Port Royal RD; Springfield VA 22161. Abstract: Describes eleven of the most prominent firms in the design and construction of commercial high speed watercraft (HSW) craft, both domestic and international. The objective of this report is to identify and present data on the significant HSW vehicles currently available and their builders. For a number of vehicles currently in production and in operation, data is presented on the engineering and economic characteristics, energy efficiency, maintainability, reliability, ride quality, safety, comfort, accessibility to handicapped persons, and capital and operating costs. Engineering and economic comparison of these high speed vessels are also made with other modes of transportation.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Astolfi J-A, Dorange P., Billard J.-Y., Cid Tomas I., 2000, “An experimental investigation of cavitation inception and development on a two-dimensional Eppler hydrofoil,” March 2000, Journal of Fluids Engineering, Vol. 122, pp. 164-173.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bailly-Cowell, G. M. (1967). “Hamburg to las Palmas on Foils.” Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil, 6(12) pp: 10-12

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Baker, Jr., Robert M. L., and James S. Douglas. “Preliminary Mathematical Analysis of a Rigid-Airfoil, Hydrofoil Water Conveyance.” Journal of Hydronautics 5.4 (1971): 140-147.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ball, Edgar Scott, Jr., Lessons Learned From the Patrol Hydrofoil Missile (PHM) Program, Thesis for Master of Science in Management, Naval Postgraduate School, Monterey CA, March 1979. “The PHM Project began as a major NATO acquisition program consisting of 60 or more ships for international purchase. Today the program cosists of just six ships for the United States alone. This thesis reviews the history of the program, the design considerations and the current problems experienced by the Program Manager. An analysis of the rationale behind the decisions which led to the reduction in scope of the program suggests that factors inherent to the current systems acquisition process cause the cut back in the program and that these were independent of the Program manager’s efforts. The results of the analysis suggest that these factors have the potential to affect the outcome of any acquisition program, no matter how well the hardware performs.” Approved for Public Release. Copy located in the Defense Technical Information Center, Defense Acquisition University, Fort Belvoir VA. http://www.library.dau.mil.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bender, E., Remington, P., “Hydrofoil Design for Minimum Control Power” B.H. Beranek and Newman Report 2511, 1973.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Bibliography – High Speed Waterborne Passenger Operations and Craft,” Authors: Advanced Marine Systems Associates, Inc, Urban Mass Transportation Administration, and Peat, Marwick, Mitchell and Co.; Report No. UMTA-IT-32-0001-84-2. Aug 84, 135 pages. Available from: Office of Technical Assistance, UMTA, 400 7th ST SW; Washington DC 20590 USA. Abstract: One of seven reports written under this contract to describe high speed waterborne passenger transportation, review its applicability in the US, and document its development in the free world. This report presents a comprehensive listing of available literature (in English) on the subject of High speed waterborne passenger transportation. Each reference in the bibliography indicates the source of the document, and whether the document contains information in the following categories: vehicle characteristics (e.g., craft features, performance and human factors); design consideration’; and economic/financial analysis of such services. Over 1,200 document written prior to Sep 82 are cited.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Blade and Hydrofoil Section Design – The Society of Naval Architects and Marine Engineers (SNAME) has published the technical bulletin Blade and Hydrofoil Section Design. This bulletin includes the Blade and Hydrofoil Section Design Codes with a 29 page Owner’s Guide, and a 184 page Technical Report. It updates and complements T&R Bulletin 1-17. The Design Codes and Owner’s Guide provide tools for the design and performance evaluation of blade and hydrofoil sections. The programs are provided in both DOS and Mac formats and will run on most personal computers. The Technical Report provides analytical background information and is of interest primarily to those who wish to adapt or enhance the programs. This new publication is identified as Technical and Research Bulletin 1-45. It is being issued as a CD, and may be ordered by contacting cpujols@sname.org or by calling 201-798-4800. It is priced at $50 ($25 for SNAME members).
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bovee, E.C., “Design and Construction of the PC(H) Hydrofoil Patrol Craft.” Paper Presented to Northwest Section Meeting, SNAME, Seattle WA, 5-6 October 1963.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Brown, DK, JP Catchpole, and AM Shand, “The Evaluation of the Hydrofoil HMS SPEEDY,” Royal Institution of Naval Architects Transactions, Volume: 126, 1984, 16p., ISSN: 0035-8967. HMS SPEEDY was procured in 1979 to provide the Royal Navy with an opportunity to gain practical experience in the operation and support of a modern hydrofoil, to establish technical and performance characteristics, and to assess the capability of a hydrofoil in the UK ‘Offshore Tapestry’ role. The present paper describes the operational and technical evaluation of HMS SPEEDY undertaken in 1980-82, and outlines the results obtained. Supplemental Information: Transactions paper; Also in Naval Architect, January 1984 issue

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Buermann, T.M., Leehey, LCDR P. (USN), and CDR J. J. Stillwell (USN), “An Appraisal of Hydrofoil Supported Craft.” Paper Presented at SNAME Meeting, New York, NY, 12-13 November 1953.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bullock, Otis R. and Brian Oldfield, “Production PHM Hull Structure Producibility Design,” AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, Arlington, Virginia, September 1976.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Charlier, Jacques J., (Catholic University of Louvain), “Jetfoils on the Ostend-Dover Route: A Technical and Commercial Appraisal,” Maritime Policy and Management, Vo. 17, Issue 2, Apr 90, pp 123-132.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Chatterton, H.A., T.H. Sarchin, “Challenges to Hydrofoil Ship System Technology”, Naval Engineers Journal, February 1972.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Chen, Jiahn-Horng, “A Regression Relation between Cavitation Number and Cavity Length for Two-Dimensional Supercavitating Hydrofoils,” Proceedings, National Science Council ROC(A) Taipei. (Link broken “http://nr.stic.gov.tw/” on 040120wnw)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Christy, John, “Punch-Packing Sea Skimmers — Boeing’s Hydrofoils Are Some of the Fastest Water-Fliers Afloat Today,” International Combat Arms, The Journal of Defense Technology, May 1985 p.39, 68-74. (Background and capability summary and photos of PHMs, plus historical reference to and photos of Soviet hydrofoils such as Mo VI, PA-4, the P-6, P-8, P-10 classes if torpedo boats (foils retrofitted), Turya class, Matka class, and Pchela class, Sparviero, Nibbio class, TUCUMCARI, FLAGSTAFF, et al.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ciancitto, Antonino, Evoluzione dei Motori e Delle Macchine Terrestri, Marittime, Aeree e Spaziali… Dell’auto Electtrica al Naviplano dal Disco Volante al Razzo Cosmico. A technical book on the evolution of the engines and of the machines for land, sea, air and space. From the electric car to the hydrofoil ship; from the flying saucer to cosmic rockets. Evolution of helicopters and jet engines. Text in Italian. Well illustrated with technical line drawings and innumerable scientific formulae. 142 pages. Softcover.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Clark, D.J.,W.C. O’Neill, D.C. Wight, “Balancing Mission Requirements and Hydrofoil Design Characteristics”, AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, April 1978, Paper 78-725.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Coates, J.T.S., R.G. Merritt, and T.C. Weaton, “Why PHM? Further Studies on Roles and Missions”, AIAA Paper 78-729, AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, San Diego, California (April 17-19, 1978)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Colucci, Frank; “Sweeping the Sea,” Air International, Vol. 49, No. 2, August 1995, pp 73-78. Discusses airborne mine sweeping system history. It includes two photos of the Mk 105 hydrofoil sled, one of it being towed behind an MH-53E helicopter.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Connor, G. G. (1967). “Power for Hydrofoils.” Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil, Vol. 6 No. (11) pp: 8-13
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Crew, P. R., “The Hydrofoil Boat; Its History and Future Prospects.” Quarterly Transactions, The Institution of Naval Architects, Vol. 100, No. 4, October 1958.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Crimi, Peter. “Experimental Study of the Effects of Sweep pn Hydrofoil Loading and Cavitation.” Journal of Hydronautics 4.1 (1970): 3-9.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Davis, Jack (Port Authority of New York and New Jersey), “Those Fabulous Flying Ferries,” Portfolio, Vol. 3, Issue 1, Mar 90, pp 33-40. Document Source: Northwestern University Transportation Library DAM2927

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Dogan, P., Decanico, F., Gamber, F. Mederios, R., “Hydrofoil Universal Digital Autopilot (HUD AD), Phase I Final Report” Charles Stark Draper Laboratory Report R-745, January 1973.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Dogan, P., Gamber, F. S. and Decanto, F. T., “Hydrofoil Universal Digital Autopilot (HUDAP), Phase I Final Report.” Charles Stark Draper Lab, Mass. Inst. of Tech., Report 745, January 1973.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Duff, Karl M., H. Schmidt, and M.R. Terry, “The NATO PHM Ship and Weapons Systems Technical Evaluation Program”, AIAA Paper 76-848, AIAA/SNAME Advanced Naval Vehicles Conference, Arlington, VA, Sept 20-22, 1976.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Duff, Karl M., “The NATO Patrol Missile Hydrofoil (PHM)”, AIAA Paper No. 72-596, AIAA/SNAME/USN Advanced Marine Vehicles Meeting, Annapolis, MD, July 17-19, 1972.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Duff, Cdr. Kark M. “The NATO Patrol Missle Hydrofoil (PHM).” Journal of Hydronautics 7.3 (1973): 97-103.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Eames, M. C. and T. G. Drummond, “HMCS BRAS D’OR-Sea Trials and Future Prospects”, Transactions Royal Institute of Naval Architects, Vol. 115, 1973.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Eames, M. C. and Jones, E. A., “HMCS BRAS D’OR-An Open Ocean Hydrofoil Ship.” Transactions Royal Institute of Naval Architects, Vol. 113, 1971.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Eames, M. C., “A Review of Hydrofoil Development in Canada.” Paper Presented at 1st International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, 27-30 July 1982.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ellsworth, W. M., “The US Navy Hydrofoil Development Program-A Status Report.” AIAA Paper 67-351, Presented at AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Meeting, Norfolk, VA, 22-24 May 1967.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ellsworth, W. M., “Twenty Foilborne Years – The US Navy Hydrofoil HIGH POINT, PCH-1”, David Taylor Research Center, 1987.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Eppler, Richard, “Airfoil Design and Data,” Springer-Verlag, 1990.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Evaluation of the Boeing JETFOIL SPEEDY in the Fishery Protection Role”, Article in Combat Craft, p. 158, July 1983.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Existing and Former High Speed Waterborne Passenger Transportation Operations in the United States, Aug 1984, Report No: UMTA-IT-32-0001-84-3; Publisher/Corporate Author(s): Peat, Marwick, Mitchell and Company; 1990 K Street, NW; Washington DC 20006, Urban Mass Transportation Administration; Office of Technical Assistance, 400 7th Street, SW; Washington DC 20590; and Advanced Marine Systems Associates, Inc.; 9421 Chatteroy Place; Gaithersburg MD 20879 USA. Abstract: This is one of seven reports written under this contract to describe high speed waterborne passenger transportation, review its applicability in the United States, and document its development in the free world. This report reviews the history of high speed waterborne passenger transportation in the United States. High speed is defined as operating at 25 knots or greater. A summary is included which outlines the principal causes of success or failure of the 19 U.S. operations in the report. Failure of high speed waterborne transportation as a public transit mode in the United States has usually been due to some combination of the following four factors: use of an unproven technology; use of only one boat; insufficient market research, resulting in the selection of routes with insufficient market potential: and insufficient capital. Available from: Urban Mass Transportation Administration; Office of Technical Assistance, 400 7th Street, SW; Washington DC 20590 USA

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ford, T. (1967). Seaspeed. Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil, 6(12) pp: 30-31, 6

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Frauenberger, H.C., “SHIMRIT Mark II Hydrofoil For The Israeli Navy”, Paper Presented at 1st International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, 27-30 July 1982.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Gallington, Roger W. “Ram Wing Surface Effect Boat.” Journal of Hydronautics 7.3 (1973): 118-123.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Gamber, F. and R. Medeirus(Medetrios?), “Hydrofoil Universal Digital Autopilot (HUDAD) Phase II Final Report”, Charles Stark Draper Laboratory, Report R-817, May 1974.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Gebhardt, John C., “The skin friction of a hydrofoil near a free surface,” Ann Arbor, University of Michigan, 1968.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Gibson, G. R. (1967). “Expo 67 – c

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Giuffrida, G. (1967). “Improvement in Foilborne Navigation.” Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil, 6(11) pp: 17-19

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Graham, C., T.E. Fahy, J.L. Grostick, “A Comparative Analysis of Naval Hydrofoil and Displacement Ship Design”, SNAME Transactions, 1976.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Graig, W. A. “Comment on “Canadian Advances in Surface-Pierciing Hydrofoils”.” Journal of Hydronautics 8.2 (1974): 74-76.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Grimm, Martin, “Transverse Stability of Surface Piercing Hydrofoils,” International Hydrofoil Society Newsletter, Summer 1998, pp. 7-9. The stability criteria presented in the IMCO Code of Safety for Dynamically Supported Craft, now superseded by the International Maritime Association (IMO) High Speed Craft Code, provides an equation for assessing foilborne metacentric height (GM) of surface-piercing hydrofoils in the design stage. An alternative method which addresses several limitations of this equation has been implemented in a short computer program, and representative results for typical foil designs are presented. A more extensive assessment of the results, a source code listing, and example input files are available from the author to those willing to examine this subject in further detail and share their findings. Click Here to view the article in Adobe Acrobat format.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Griswold, John W., “PHM/JETFOIL Reliability and Service Experience,” AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicle Conference, Arlington, Virginia, September 1976.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Grumman M161 – Israel’s Combat Hydrofoil”, Defense Attaché, pp 11-21, No. 5, 1981.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Guide For Implementing High Speed Waterborne Passenger Transportation Services,” Authors: Advanced Marine Systems Associates, Inc, Urban Mass Transportation Administration, and Peat, Marwick, Mitchell and Co. Sep 84. Available from: Office of Technical Assistance, UMTA, 400 7th ST SW; Washington DC 20590 USA. Abstract: This guide is designed as a technical report for potential High Speed Waterborne (HSW) service operators, craft builders, and investors. It is intended to assist in the key tasks required to assess the feasibility of and implement HSW service. These tasks include market analysis; selecting HSW craft; fulfilling regulatory requirements; obtaining financing; and developing and implementing service. The disappointing record to date of implementing HSW service in the US demonstrated the need for this guide. This guide draws on the lessons learned from these past attempts to start HSW service in the US as well as on the experiences of many successful foreign HSW operators. It should be recognized that any compilation of data and methods for evaluation will have some limitations. Recognizing these limitations before initiating a feasibility evaluation will improve the overall accuracy of the results. Limitations can be placed in the following categories: vehicle characteristics that are continually being modified and improved; newly available and proven HSW vehicles will replace some of the HSW vehicles listed; regulatory decisions that may change from location to location and from time to time; and ridership that may be influenced by local, political, and economic considerations.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Guidoni, A., Seaplanes – “15 years of Naval Aviation”, Journal R.A.S., vol. XXXII, no. 205, Jan 1928, pp. 25-64

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hamilton, F. M., C.W. Pritchett, and H.H. Hudgins, “Technical and operational characteristics of high performance watercraft;” Washington, D.C. : U.S. Coast Guard, Office of Research and Development ; Springfield, Va. : Available through the National Technical Information Service, 1975.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Haney, Dan G. and Stanton R. Smith, “Economic Feasibility of Passenger Hydrofoil Craft in U.S. Domestic Foreign Commerce;” prepared for Maritime Administration, U.S. Dept. of Commerce. Stanford Research Institute. Menlo Park, Calif. : [distributed by Office of Technical Services, U.S. Dept. of Commerce], 1961

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hayward, L., “The History of Hydrofoils.” A Series of Articles Published in Hovering Craft & Hydrofoils, Kalerghi Publications, London, England, Vol. 5, 1966.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hefazi, Hamid; Orhan Kural; Hsun Chen; and Tuncer Cebeci, Professors; Eric Besnard, Adeline Schmitz, Kalle Kaups, and George Tzong, Research Associates, “Hydrofoil Design and Optimization for Fast Ships, Proceedings of the 1998 ASME International Congress and Exhibition Anaheim, CA, Nov, 1998. Abstract: The paper presents a multi-disciplinary design/optimization method for the conceptual design of a hydrofoil based fast ship. The method is used to determine the maximum achievable lift-to-drag ratio (L/D) of an isolated foil-strut arrangement (hopefully greater than 50) at high transit speeds (greater than 75 knots) while lifting masses of 5,000 and 10,000 tons. First, the tools necessary for the study are presented. They comprise a panel method to compute three-dimensional flows around arbitrary configurations with a model for the free surface, a foil cross-section optimization tool, a strut cross-section design tool, and a structural analysis tool. The computational tools are then integrated into a multi-disciplinary design/optimization approach, which is applied to the design of single foil and biplane configurations. Results show that the goal of L/D = 50 is achievable for 75 knots (assuming that techniques can be developed for reducing the skin friction drag to a quarter of its nominal value) and, that for 90 knots, L/D ratios around 45 can be reached. The corresponding break horsepower requirements for 10,000 tons are around 130 khp and less than 200 khp, respectively. Full text posted at: www.csulb.edu/colleges/coe/ae/ae_dept/images/pdf/asme_paper.pdf

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hockberger, William A., “Defining a Ferry Business.” Paper presented at the SNAME1997 Transportation Operations, Management, and Economics Symposium at the Meadowlands Hilton Hotel, May 14-15, 1997.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hoerner, Sighard F., Dr. – Ing, Fluid-Dynamic Drag, Practical Information on Aerodynamic Drag and Hydrodynamic Resistance, published by the author, 1965 (also by the same author with Henry V. Borst: Fluid Dynamic Lift. Both books are a “must” for hydrofoil designers)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Horn, Captain Frank, USN, “PHM Squadron Two Operational Experience”, AIAA/SNAME/ASNE 7th Marine Systems Conference, New Orleans, Louisiana, February 1983.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoil Handbook, Gibbs and Cox, Inc. New York, 1954. Prepared by Gibbs and Cox, Inc. acting as the design agent of the Bath Iron Works Corporation under Office of Naval Research contract NONR-507 (00)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ikonnikov, V.V. and A.I.Maskalik. Osobennosty proektirovaniya i konstruktsii sudov na podvodnykh krylyakh. L., Sudostroyenie, 1987 (“Peculiarities of designing and constructing hydrofoils”, in Russian)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Imlay, Frederick H, “Theoretical Motions of Hydrofoil Systems”, NACA Report 918, 1948. Results are presented of an investigation undertaken to develop theoretical methods of treating the motions of hydrofoil systems and to determine some of the important parameters. Variations of parameters include three distributions of area between the hydrofoils, two rates of change of downwash angle with angle of attack, three depths of immersion, two dihedral angels, two rates of change of lift with immersion, three longitudinal hydrofoil spacings, two radii of gyration in pitching, and various horizontal and vertical locations of the center of gravity. Graphs are presented. This 1948 report has been posted in full on the web by NASA. “The use of hydrofoils as an alternative to planing bottoms or hulls has been of interest for some time. Guidoni advocated the use of hydrofoils as a means of improving the take-off and rough=water performance of seaplanes as early as 1911.”
                                                                                                                                                                                                      International Hydrofoil Society, “Proceedings of the 25th Anniversary Celebration and Conference”, Collection of Hydrofoil Papers, Washington, D.C., June 1995. (Copies still available. The cost per copy for mail delivery in the USA or Canada is US$18.50. For delivery to other countries, the cost per copy is US$25.00. Send questions about the Proceedings to IHS Treasurer. For instructions on how to order, Click Here.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Irvine, James F. and Donald T. Blake, “Operational evaluation of the hydrofoil concept for U. S. Coast Guard missions, Phase I : Report of operations with the USCGC Flagstaff (WPBH-1)” Washington : U. S. Coast Guard, Office of Research and Development, 1975.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Irvine, James F. and Donald T. Blake, ” Operational evaluation of the hydrofoil concept for U. S. Coast Guard missions, Phase II : Record of additional operations with USCGC Flagstaff (WMBH-1);” Washington : U. S. Coast Guard, Office of Research and Development, 1975.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Irvine, James F. and Donald T. Blake, “Operational evaluation of the hydrofoil concept for U. S. Coast Guard missions, Phase III : Report of operations with USCGC High Point (WMEH-1);” Washington : U. S. Coast Guard, Office of Research and Development, 1975.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jackson, L. J., “Recent PHM Operational Experience”, ASNE Proceedings of High Performance Marine Vehicles Conference, Arlington VA, June 1992.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jaques, Bob, “Eggshells on Razor Blades Revisited: High-Speed Craft – Dismissed As Eggshells On Razorblades in Their Hydrofoil Infancy — May Have Revolutionized Ferry Operations of Late, But Old-Fashioned Safety Worries Are Resurfacing, Seatrade Review 1996

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jeffrey, N. E., and W. E. Ellis. “Proteus-A Versatile Vehicle for Open-Water Hydrodynamics Research.” Journal of Hydronautics, Vol 4. No. 2, April 1970: 60-65.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jeffrey, N. E. and M. C. Eames, “Canadian Advances in Surface-Piercing Hydrofoils.” SNAME Journal of Hydronautics, Vol. 7. No. 2, April 1973.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jewell, D. A. “Hydrofoil Performance in Rough Water”, Paper presented at AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, San Diego, CA, February 25-27, 1974.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Johnston, Robert J., and John R. Meyer, “100 Years of Overcoming Archimedes Principle”, SNAME Southeast Section Centennial 1893-1993, February 9-10, 1993.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Johnston, Robert J. and O’Neill, Wm. C., “A Ship Whose Time Has Come-and Gone”, Paper presented at AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, Baltimore, MD, 2-4 October 1979.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Johnston, R.J. and W.C. O’Neill, “The Development of Automatic Control Systems for Hydrofoil Craft”, International Hovercraft, Hydrofoil and Advanced Transit Systems Conference, Brighton, England, May 1974.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Johnston, R.J., “Historical Perspective”, Hydrofoil Lecture Day, Massachusetts Institute of Technology Professional Summer, July 8, 1975.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Johnston, Robert J., “History of US Involvement in Developing the Hydrofoil.” Paper Presented at 1st International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, 27-30 July 1982.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jones, E. A., “RX Craft, a Manned Model of the RCN Hydrofoil Ship BRAS D’OR.” SNAME Journal of Hydronautics, Vol. 1, No. 1, July 1967.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Kaji, M., Y. Nishi, and Y. Yamagami, “Prediction Method of Motions of Hydrofoil Vessels,” Journal of the Kansai Society of Naval Architects, Issue 214, Sep 90, 6 pages. ISSN: 0389-9101. Abstract: To respond to the need for high speed transportation, the hydrofoil vessel, supported partially or totally by foil lift, has been widely investigated. Because these investigations have included few studies of hydrofoil vessel motions, however, the authors studied these motions both theoretically and experimentally. They show that the unsteady characteristics of the hydrofoil have to be included in the hydrodynamic coefficients of the motion equations used for prediction. It is also confirmed, based on experiments, that lifting link theory is useful for calculation the unsteady characteristics of the three-dimensional hydrofoil under a free surface.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Kaplan, P., “Use of Jet Flapped Hydrofoils as Ships Anti-Pitching Fins”, Oceanics Report 6413.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      King, James H. and M. Devine, “HANDE-A Computer-Aided Design Approach for Hydrofoil Ships”, Naval Engineer’s Journal, Vol. 93, Issue: 1, April 1981. Presented at ASNE Day, 30 April-1 May 1981. Session Title: Ship Design III, Paper No. 3. Abstract: A powerful computer-aided design tool for use in hydrofoil ship engineering, the Hydrofoil Analysis and Design (HANDE) Program, is described. Its relevance, structure, features, and use are delineated. The value of HANDE for design verification and variation, research studies, and rapid response studies is related through case histories. Future application and development of HANDE and related design tools are forecast. Available from: American Society of Naval Engineers; 1012 14th Street, NW; Washington DC 20005 USA.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      King, James H., “The Evolution of the NIBBIO Class Hydrofoil From TUCUMCARI”, Paper Presented at 1st International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, 27-30 July 1982.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      King, John W., “The PHM-The NATO and US Requirements”, AIAA Paper No. 83-0614, AIAA/SNAME/ASNE 7th Marine Systems Conference, New Orleans, February 23-25,1983.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Lacey, R. E., “A Progress Report on Hydrofoil Ships.” Quarterly Transactions, Royal Institution of Naval Architects, Vol. 107, No. 1, January 1965.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Lang, Thomas G. “Preliminary Design of Hydrofoil Cross Sections as a Function of Cavitation Number, Lift, and Strength.” Journal of Hydronautics 4.3 (1970): 104-112.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Lunde, J. K. and H. A. Walderhaug, “300 tons, 50 knots hydrofoil Craft;” second report (Johannes Krzywinski), 1916- [S.l.] : Office of Naval Research, [19??]
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Lynch, Thomas G., “The Flying 400”, Canada’s Hydrofoil Project, Nimbus Publishing Limited, Halifax, Nova Scotia, 1983, ISBN 0-920852-22-X.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mahig, J. “Effect of Sweep Angle and Drag on the Flutter.” Journal of Hydronautics 7.3 (1973): 104-108.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mandel, P., Seagoing Box Scores and Seakeeping Criteria for Monohull, SWATH, Planing, Hydrofoil, Surface Effect Ships, and Air Cushion Vehicles. March 1979. 98 pages, Report No: DTNSRDC/SDD-79/1 Final Rpt., ISBN: SF 43-411-291; ISSN: 62543N. Publisher/Corporate Author(s): David Taylor Naval Ship R&D Center, Bethesda MD 20084 USA. Abstract: Three seagoing box scores applicable to any vehicle operating on the surface of the ocean are defined and assessed. One of the box scores is directly useful for calculating the operational worth and the technical seagoing merit of vehicles performing ocean surveillance-like functions. The second box score is similarly useful for the ordinary transportation function of vehicles. The third box score is useful for measuring the technical seagoing merit of vehicles performing any function. This work brings together prescribed values of 18 seakeeping criteria for monohulls, small-waterplane-area twin-hull (SWATH) ships, planing craft, surface effect ships, and air cushion vehicles from sources indicated in the report. The nature of each criterion is discussed and the prescribed values of these 18 criteria for each vehicle type are compared and discussed. Although some of the prescribed values of these 18 criteria are not reconcilable, other values, obtained from independent sources, show remarkable agreement. At least one new criterion not included in Table 2 is needed for monohulls. Appendixes A, B, and C contain a useful summary of important results of Olson’s massive work in a form not presented in his work. The usefulness and limitations of the frequency and time domain ship motion data bases developed for monohulls are described in Appendix D. The existence of these two data bases makes it possible to calculate the values of several of the criteria of Table 2 by two completely independent means.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Martin, M., “The Stability Derivatives of A Hydrofoil Boat – Part II”, Technical Report 001-10(II), Hydronautics Inc., January 1963
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Matveev Konstantin He has recently co-authored, with V. Dubrovsky and S. Sutulo, the book Small Waterplane Area Ships. In particular, he wrote a section on hydrofoils that provides simplified engineering methods for calculating lift and drag of low and high aspect ratio foils (including free surface effects), cavitation onset, vortex wash and wake behind a foil, and unsteady effects. Appendix G is on dynamic unloading and foil design, More information about this book and ordering information can be found at the Backbone Publishing web-site http://www.backbonepublishing.com/DreamHC/Page1.html. (070418 wnw)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Matveev Konstantin I., and Ivan Ivanovich Matveev, “Hydrodynamic Sound Generation on a Hydrofoil,” 1996, 12th Conference On High-Speed Ship Design, Nizhiy Novgorod, Russia. Abstract: Mechanism of sound generation on a hydrofoil is considered. Mathematical model of the hydrofoil ‘singing’ effect is proposed. The frequencies of ‘singing’ are obtained. The theoretical results are compared with experiments. Contact the author to discuss: Konstantin I Matveev, email: matveev@hydrofoils.org, website: www.hydrofoils.org
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Matveev Konstantin I. and Ivan Ivanovich Matveev, “Estimation and Compensation of Hydrofoil Deformations During a Season of Operation,” International Hydrofoil Society Newsletter, Summer 2000; Abstract: “One of the restrictions on the use of commercial hydrofoil crafts, which have some advantages in comparison with common displacement ships, is the necessity for specialized maintenance of the foil systems. Such work usually requires complicated equipment and experienced specialists. This paper offers a new method effectively restoring a hydrofoil after foil damage. A simplified method for conservation of the lift coefficient, which greatly influences on ship’s performance, is obtained from consideration of the factors defining the lift. The technology of the process is briefly described. This method enables operators to reduce repair expenses and time drastically, which is very important during a season of operation.” Click Here to view the full text of the article. Contact the author to discuss: Konstantin I Matveev, email: matveev@hydrofoils.org, website: www.hydrofoils.org
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Matveev, Konstantin I. and Ivan Ivanovich Matveev, “Tandem Hydrofoil System,” Ocean Engineering 28 (2000) 253-261. Abstract: “A tandem hydrofoil system enables an improvement in the lift-drag ratio of a high -speed ship. The conditions for favorable application of this type of foil structure are determined. The data on hydrofoil boats using a tandem system are presented. The problem of the stability of the vertical plane motion for a hydrofoil with bow and stern foils is considered. The general conditions providing the stability are obtained.” Contact the author to discuss: Konstantin I Matveev, email: matveev@hydrofoils.org, website: www.hydrofoils.org. Copy can be found in libraries subscribing to Ocean Engineering, or it can be ordered directly from the publisher at http://www.elsevier.com/.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Matveev Konstantin I., “Investigation of Hydrofoil ‘Singing’ in the Carman Approximation,” Phystech Journal, Vol.2, No.2, 1996. Abstract: “The effect of hydrofoil ‘singing’ has been investigated. The mechanism of sound generation is considered and a mathematical model of the process is proposed. The frequency of sound generated by a hydrofoil and the sounf intensity distribution are estimated. Experimental data are compared to calculations. Countermeasures against the hydrofoil ‘singing’ are proposed.” Contact the author to discuss: Konstantin I Matveev, email: matveev@hydrofoils.org, website: www.hydrofoils.org
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Merritt, R.G. and R.L. Herechkowitz, “Variations on a Single Theme: Future Configurations and Growth of the Patrol Hydrofoil Combatant (PHM)”, AIAA Paper 76-854, AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, Arlington, Virginia (September 20-22, 1976)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Meyer, John R., and James R. Wilkins, “Hydrofoil Development and Applications” ASNE Proceedings of High Performance Marine Vehicles Conference, Arlington VA, June 1992.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Meyer, John, Ships That Fly. About 10 years ago John collected a lot of material about hydrofoils and put it all together in a book called Ships That Fly. It became a story of the modern hydrofoil covering the early days of hydrofoil inventors and experimenters and taking the reader through over 150 pictures and illustrations of hydrofoils leading to those of recent years. He recently had the pages of the book scanned and put in a pdf file and placed on a CD that is being offered for sale.You will note that Chapter 6, The US Navy Fleet Hydrofoil-PHM, ends with a very optimistic view of PHMs in the current US Navy, and larger hydrofoils in its future. However, this was not to be. Several years following the completion of my book, Ships That Fly, there were events surrounding the US Navy PHM program that are described in an Addendum to Chapter 6. All six PHM ships were decommissioned on July 30, 1993. This was the only time the US Navy has decommissioned an entire class of ships on the same day. This addendum describes some of the events leading to this sad day for the US Navy and the hydrofoil community. Also, documented are the many attempts to save the Ship, the day of the ceremony, attempts to save the ships even after the decommissioning, and finally the subsequent disposal of the ships and their status today.John also collected a series of over 140 hydrofoil pictures and illustrations, and created a Hydrofoil Slide Show, entitled: A Century of Hydrofoil Development. All three of these files are on the CD. To find out more, log onto: http://themeyers.org/ShipsThatFly/index.html
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Miller, Boyce E., and Harvey P. Hack. “Impressed-Current Cathodic Protection.” Journal of Hydronautics July 1973: 108-111.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mitchell, T. R. … [et al.] “Hydrofoils for the fisheries law enforcement mission of the U. S. Coast Guard;” Washington : U. S. Coast Guard ; Springfield, Va. : Available through the National Technical Information Service, 1975.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mitchell, T.R., J.P. Donnelly, and J.A. Nevendorffer, “Observations of the performance of TUCUMCARI (PGH-2) in the U.S. Coast Guard mission oriented trials;” Arlington, Va., Center for Naval Analyses, 1973.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mitchell, T. R., L. S. Cohan, and C. H. Heider, “The utility of high-performance watercraft for selected missions of the United States Coast Guard;” Center for Naval Analyses, Arlington, Va. Arlington, Va. 1972.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Modern Ships and Craft, Chapter V – Hydrofoils, Special Edition of the Naval Engineers Journal, February 1985. (Contact IHS for a copy).
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Moorwood, John, “Hydrofoil Options.” Amateur Yacht Research Society (AYRS), #90 July 1998 – Covers different design ideas and approaches for sailing hydrofoils.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Myers, G.R., “Observations and Comments on Hydrofoils”, Paper Presented at the Society of Naval Architects and Marine Engineers Spring Meeting, Seattle, WA., May 13-14, 1965.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Noreen, A.E., P.R. Gill, and W.M. Feifel, Boeing Marine Systems, Inc., “Foilborne Hydrodynamic Performance of Jetfoil,” Journal of Hydronautics, Vol. 14, No. 2, Apr 1980, pp. 56-62. The Boeing Jetfoil Model 929-115 hydrofoil ship was derived from Model 929-100, with increased forward foil area for larger load-carrying capacity. Forward and aft foil contours were revised to increase cavitation margin. New hydrodynamic design methods were employed to maximize foil thickness for minimum structural weight. Prediction of foilborne cruise performance was based upon theoretical analysis, model test data, and full-scale trial data from Model 929-100. Extensive flowfield observations were made of the foil systems during sea trials of the first Model 929-115 produced. Good agreement was found between predicted and observed cavitation and ship performance characteristics. Sensitivity of ship performance to operating variables was determined from sea trial data.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Norwegian Institute of Transport Economics (1967). “Hydrofoil Boats or Hovercraft?.” Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil, 6(11) pp: 24-27
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Oakley, O. H., “Hydrofoils-A State of the Art Summary.” Proceedings of the Institute of Aeronautical Sciences, National Meeting on Hydrofoils and Air Cushion Vehicles, 17-18 September 1962.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Olling, D.S., and R.G. Merritt, “Patrol Combatant Missile Hydrofoil-Design Development and Production – A Brief History”, High Speed Surface Craft, January-February 1981.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Operational testing and evaluation of the hydrofoil seacraft DENISON from June 1962 through 1963.” Grumman Aircraft Engineering Corporation. [Bethpage, N.Y., 1963?]
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ostersehlte, Christian, “Tragflächenboote von der Unterweser — Die BREMER PIONIER und ihre beiden Vorgänger,” Bremisches Jahrbuch, Band 79, 2000, pp. 145 – 196. The predecessor boats of the title are the Focke-Schaper-Tragflächenboot (Aug 1951) and TOM-TOM II (Oct 1951).
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Patch, David A., “Operational Utilization of the Patrol Hydrofoil Missile (PHM)”, First International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, July 27-30, 1982.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Peek, R. and L. Bauer, “M-151 Transmission for Mark II Hydrofoils,” AIAA-2084, September 1981.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Petrie, D. M., “Operational and Developmental Experience on the US Navy Hydrofoil HIGH POINT.” AIAA Journal of Aircraft, Vol. 3, No. 1, January-February 1966.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Pieroth, C., “Grumman Design M163, a 2400 Metric Ton Air Capable Hydrofoil Ship”, AIAA Paper 78-749, AIAA /SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, San Diego, CA, April 17-19, 1978.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Plotkin, A. “Laminar Boundary-Layer Induced Wave Forces on a Submerged Flat-Plate Hydrofoil.” Journal of Hydronautics 8.2 (1974): 47-52.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Prandtl, Ludwig and Oscar G Tietjens; Applied Hydro- and Aeromechanics, ISBN: 048660375X. A text book of over 300 pages (5-3/8” x 8-1/2”). Prandtl was a leading aerodynamics theorist. This work has is reported as “one of the finest introductory works in the field”. Topics include flow through pipes, Prandtl’s own pioneering work on boundary layers, drag, airfoil theory, and entry conditions for flow in a pipe. Professor Tietjens is known for his research and development of experimental hydrofoil boats prior to and during the second world war. While it is uncertain whether the book deals specifically with hydrofoil hydrodynamics, it is listed by IHS due to the association of at least one of its authors with hydrofoil craft development. The book could be ordered through DoverPublications.com for $10.95 when this reference was spotted.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Report to Congress: Study of High Speed Waterborne Transportation Services Worldwide, August 1984, Publisher/Corporate Author(s): Peat, Marwick, Mitchell and Company ; 1990 K Street, NW; Washington DC 20006, Office of the Secretary of Transportation ; 400 7th Street, SW; Washington DC 20590, Advanced Marine Systems Associates, Inc.; 9421 Chatteroy Place; Gaithersburg MD 20879 USA . Abstract: In response to Congressional mandate, UMTA engaged in an extensive evaluation of high speed waterborne (HSW) passenger transportation in the U.S. and throughout the free world. The study reviewed the history of HSW, determined its current status and examined factors that might impact its future development. Unsubsidized HSW operated by the private sector was emphasized in analyzing potential U.S. sites. The U.S. site analyses included domestic, as well as foreign craft. High interest rates and the investment required to establish HSW service make the financial feasibility of operations sensitive to the cost of capital. A vessel capable of satisfactory service must also have low initial costs and be economical to operate and maintain. As a group, craft of foreign origin meet these criteria best. Were foreign technology employed, the study indicated that HSW service could be operated profitably by the private sector in some markets. A study of 10 such sites, indicated that nine might, under certain conditions, be feasible. Conditions are: (1) Competitive in time with other transport services, (2) Competitive in cost; (3) Need to capture only a small share of an existing travel market for economic viability. Primary market for HSW abroad is travel times under 45 minutes. Despite relatively high seat-mile costs, travelers abroad often pay a premium fare for travel time savings, convenience and/or novelty of HSW. HSW craft operate safely in great variety of adverse locations. Foreign HSW development has been orderly with private sector and unsubsidized service often viable. In contrast, in the U.S. HSW has been beset by inadequate capitalization and has operated with unproven vessels. Available from: Office of the Secretary of Transportation ; 400 7th Street, SW; Washington DC 20590 USA; ID: 00390706
                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Review of Selected High Speed Waterborne Operations Worldwide,” Authors: Advanced Marine Systems Associates, Inc, Urban Mass Transportation Administration, and Peat, Marwick, Mitchell and Co.; Report No. UMTA-IT-32-0001-4, Aug 84. Available from: Office of Technical Assistance, UMTA, 400 7th ST SW; Washington DC 20590 USA. Abstract: One of seven reports written under this contract to describe high speed waterborne passenger transportation, review its applicability in the US, and document its development in the free world. This report describes high speed waterborne passenger transportation operations throughout the world. Information is presented on: ridership, the type, characteristics and number of craft used, operating conditions and characteristics, crew sites and wages, terminal facilities and maintenance procedures. The operators described were chosen because they exemplify the most frequently used types of craft and operating scenarios. Services are included that operate in Europe, South America, and the Far East. Not all existing operations are covered in this report due to time and budget limitations.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Rieg, Donald F. and James H. King] “Technical evaluation of the RHS 200 for high speed ferry applications and Coast Guard missions ;” prepared for U.S. Department of Transportation, United States Coast Guard, Office of Research and Development. Rieg, Donald F. Washington, D.C. : The Office ; Springfield, Va. : Available through NTIS, 1984.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Rodriquez, Leopoldo, Dino Di Blasi, “Current Status and Future Prospects for European Commercial Hydrofoils”, Paper Presented at 1st International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, 27-30 July 1982.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Roess, R.P. and P.J. Grealy, “The Use of High-Speed Vessels in Urban Ferry Service: Issues and Economic Evaluation,” Transportation Research Record, Issue: 925, Inland Water Transportation. 1983. pp 9-12, Publisher/Corporate Author(s): Transportation Research Board; 2101 Constitution Avenue, NW; Washington DC 20418 USA; Abstract: The economic aspects of high-speed ferry operations are discussed and compared to conventional ferry services. The economic viability of high-speed service is demonstrated using conventional economic analysis techniques. Issues related to high-speed ferry operations such as safety, efficiency, and ridership attraction are discussed in more general terms. The paper concludes that high-speed ferry operations can compare favorably with conventional services and hold potential for attracting larger numbers of passengers and charging premimum fares. :Available from: Transportation Research Board Business Office; 2101 Constitution Avenue, NW; Washington DC 20418 USA. Order Number: DOTL JC
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Salvesen, Nils. “Seakeeping Characteristics of Small-Waterplane-Area-Twin-Hull Ships.” Journal of Hydronautics 7.1 (1973): 3-9.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Schrider, M., “Study of Foil Influence on Foil-Borne Hydrofoil Performance”, Intersociety Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, Arlington, VA, 5-7 June 1989.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Shen, Y., Wermites, R., “Recent Studies of Struts and Foils for High Speed Hydrofoils” Marine Technology, Vol 16, January 1979.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Shultz, W.M., “Boeing JETFOIL Model 929-100”, AIAA Paper No. 74-308, AIAA/SNAME Advanced Marine Vehicles Conference, San Diego, CA, February 25-27, 1974.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Shultz, W.M., “Current Status And Future Prospects United States Commercial Hydrofoils”, Paper Presented at 1st International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, 27-30 July 1982.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Sinnarwalla, Abbas M. and T. R. Sundaram, “On the changes in lift of hydrofoils due to surface injections of polymer additives;” Laurel, Md. : Hydronautics, Inc., 1978.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Stark, D.R., “Ride Quality Characterization and Evaluation in the Low Frequency Regime, with Applications to Marine Vehicles,” Human Factors in Transport Research Volumes 1 and 2, Academy Press Inc. (London) LTD, and Conference on Ergonomics and Transport, Swansea, United Kingdom, 1980.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Stark, D.R., “The PHM Automatic Control System”, SAE National Aerospace Engineering and Manufacturing Meeting, San Diego, CA, Oct. 1974.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Stevens, D. L., Jr., “The Bureau of Ships Hydrofoil Craft FRESH-1.” Paper Presented to Chesapeake Section, SNAME, 26 February 1964.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Study of High Speed Waterborne Transportation Services Worldwide”, Urban Mass Transportation Agency, UMTA-IT-32-0001-84-3, August 1984, Seven Vols., National Technical Information Service (NTIS) #PB 85129906/U.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Study of Hydrofoil Seacraft” Vols. I and II, PB161759, 3 Oct 58, Phase I Technical Report by Grumman Aircraft Engineering Corporation to Maritime Administration, US Department of Commerce. “This report contains the results of a parametric study made to determine the feasibility of hydrofoil seacraft with speeds from 50 to 200 knots, gross weights from 100 to 3,000 tons, and ranges from 400 to 3,600 nautical miles. The relative merits of various combinations of hydrofoil craft parameters and the possible advantages of such craft over displacement vessels were thoroughly investigated. A detailed analysis of the various design features and operational characteristics of hydrofoil craft… is also included.”
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Sueoka, H, Tozawa, S., Sakai, F., Kabata, T.,”Structural Responses of Mitsubishi Super Shuttle 400, Rainbow, in Seaways”, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, Ltd. (Japan), FAST ’95 Conference.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Sugranyes Baena, Alcides, “‘KOMETA-M’ – Description and Handling of USSR Coastal Passenger Hydrofoil,” Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil, Kalerghi Publications, Vol. 1 No. 11, Aug 72
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Sullivan, E. K. and Higgins, J. A., “Test and Trials of the HS DENISON.” Published by the Maritime Administration, circa 1962.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Swales, P. D., R. C. McGregor, and A.J. Wright. “Correlation of Force Measurements and Separated Flow Regions on Surface Piercing Struts.” Journal of Hydronautics April 1974: 72-73.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Swales, P. D. R. C. McGregor,and A. J. Wright. “Explanation of Forces on a Surface.” Journal of Hydronautics July 1973: 132-133.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Taiwan 106-36 Republic of China, Vol. 24, No. 2, 2000, pp. 120-129. Abstract: For convenience in engineering applications, we attempt to find a general regression relation between the nondimensional cavity length and the cavitation number for two-dimensional supercavitating hydrofoils. Based on observations of the general trend of the relation, a nonlinear function for these two physical quantities is proposed, and the coefficients in the function are optimally determined via a least-squares procedure and an iterative Gauss-Newton method. Several supercavitating hydrofoils, including flat-plate hydrofoils and hydrofoils with and without cambers, are investigated. The results seem to indicate that there exists a global approximate relation, the optimum coefficients of which depend on the flow conditions and hydrofoil shape. Key Words: 2-D supercavitating hydrofoil, potential flow, regression relation. Full text posted at: http://nr.stic.gov.tw/ejournal/ProceedingA/v24n2/120-129.pdf
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Terao, Yutaka; “Lateral and Roll-Yaw Coupled Motion Control of Hydrofoil Craft”, Proceedings of the 7th International Conference on Stability of Ships and Ocean Vehicles (STAB 2000), 7-11 February 2000, Launceston, Tasmania, Australia. AMECRC Ltd, Editor: Martin Renilson. pp 542 – 550. For those with a really technical bent, the mathematical modeling of the human operator using skilful body weight shift to maintain stability of a solar powered hydrofoil has been examined in this reference.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Terao, Yukata; (Tokai University, Dept. of Naval Architecture, Japan) and H. Isshiki (Hitachi Zosen Corp, Japan), “Wave Devouring Propulsion (WDP) Sea Trial,” Undated. Abstract: The development of Wave Devouring Propulsion system and results of its sea trial on the HOKUTO are presented. WDP system is an idea not only for the ship propulsion system which converts wave energy directly into thrust but also the ship motion reduction system. This system consists of a ship hull and a hydrofoil installed at the bow. Improvement of the propulsive efficiency in waves and high seaworthiness is measured during the sea trial. Click Here for full text on line.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Tietjens, O., “Das Tragflaechenboot.” Werft Reederei Hafen, Jahrg. 18, Heft 7, April 1, 1937, pp 87-90 and Heft 8 April 10, 1937 pp. 106-109.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Unruh, J. F., and R. L. Bass III. “Doublet Lattice-Source Method for Calculating Unsteady Loads on Cavitating Hydrofoils.” Journal of Hydronautics 8.4 (1974): 140-147.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Van Bibber, V. H., “The Major Problems of Hydrofoil Craft,” Lockheed Shipbuilding and Construction Company paper presented at the SNAME Hydrofoil Symposium 13-14 May 1965 Spring Meeting in Seattle Washington. Major problem areas discussed in this paper are, Propeller Designs, Manufacture of Hydrofoils and Mating of Subassemblies, Galvanic Protection, and Crew Habitability.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      van Walree, Frans, “Computational Methods for Hydrofoil Craft in Steady and Unsteady Flow,” doctoral thesis, available to the public at a cost of NLG 100 (approx. US$50), by sending a request to Maritime Research Institute Netherlands, Attn: Ms. R. Jurriens, Librarian; PO Box 28; 6700 AA Wageningen, Netherlands. Tel: +31-317-493417, Fax: +31-317-493245, email: Rjurriens@marin.nl.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Vermeulen, Johan C., Roderick A. Barr, Milton Martin, “Hydrodynamics of Hydrofoil Craft Subcavitating Hydrofoil Systems,” Hydronautics, Inc. Technical Report 463-1, April 1964
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Vogt, James E., “Automatic Control of the Hydrofoil Gunboat, TUCUMCARI,” AIAA 2nd Advanced Marine Vehicle and Propulsion Meeting, AIAA Paper No. 69-729, 1969.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      von Schertel, Baron Hanns, “European Development of Hydrofoil Craft Technology”, Paper Presented at 1st International Hydrofoil Society Conference, Ingonish Beach, Nova Scotia, Canada, 27-30 July 1982.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      von Schertel, Baron Hanns, “Design and Application of Hydrofoils and Their Future Prospects,” Institute of Marine Engineers-Transactions, Series A, Part 3, Vol 86, 1973, pp 53-64. Institute of Marine Engineers; Memorial Building, 76 Mark Lane; London EC3 7JN England; Abstract: The performance characteristics of hydrofoil craft are compared with those of other water craft with regard to lift/drag ratio, power requirement, speed loss in waves and sustained accelerations, special attention being paid to the hovercraft. The advantages and state of development of the foil systems currently in use are examined, and their commercial and military applications described. The different propulsion systems and their efficiencies are discussed. Finally the future of the hydrofoil is visualized, the prospects of the known foil sections for surmounting the speed barrier being appraised. The presumable size limit of future craft is considered.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Wang, J. & Mcowan, S., “Fast Passenger Ferries and Their Future,” Maritime Policy and Management, Vol. 27, Issue 3, Jul 00, pp 231-251. Published by Taylor and Francis, Ltd.; 1 Gunpowder Square; London EC4A 3DE, England. (USA address: 1900 Frost RD Suite 101; Briston PA 19007). Abstract: Examines the different choices of high speed craft (HSC) hull design available and briefly looks at the advantages and disadvantages of each hull form. The trends in various design aspects of HSC such as speed, capacity, and size are studied. An investigation on HSC development is conducted, and the future of HSC in the United Kingdom is studied. A study onboard an HSC with the aim of trying to determine what passengers think of HSCs and why the travel by them is also conducted. Finally, an analysis of the possible market for HSCs is carried out.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Weber, D. (1967). “New Worlds to Conquer.” Hovering Craft and Hydrofoil, 6(12) pp: 3, 6
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Wennagel, G. J., “Characteristics of the US Maritime Administration Hydrofoil Test Vehicle.” Paper Presented at SAE National Aeronautics Meeting, 1961.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Williams, R.E and P.L. Ehrman, “Operational evaluation of the hydrofoil concept for U. S. Coast Guard missions: executive summary;” Washington : U. S. Coast Guard, Office of Research and Development ; Springfield, Va. : Available through the National Technical Information Service, 1975.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Wright, H.R. and F.W. Otto, “The Hydrofoil Craft Drag Polar,” Journal of Hydronautics, October 1980.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Wright, H. Raymond, Jr. (Grumman Aerospace Corp) and Frank W. Otto (Edo Corp), “Hydrofoil Craft Drag Polar,” Journal of Hydronautics, Vol 14. No. 4., Oct 1980, pp. 111-116. Adaptation of the friction and wave drag components to the classic aerodynamic drag polar are shown with accommodation for the weight/center-of-gravity envelope. The parametric forms of the drag, power, and specific range and endurance curves are shown and related to the traditional dimensional forms. The relationship between the drag polar and the propulsion is indicated.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Yagi, T., et al, “Jetfoil Operational Experience in Japan”, ASNE Proceedings of High Performance Marine Vehicles Conference, Arlington VA, June 1992. This Page Organized by R. Terry Black;

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                                                                                                                                                                                                      Announcement

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Last updated January 29, 2016
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Announcements and Current Event
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Next 3 February 2016:
                                                                                                                                                                                                      JOINT DINNER MEETING of SNAME SD-5 PANEL AND INTERNATIONAL HYDROFOIL SOCIETY
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Topic: “The Quadrimaran”: Four identical wedge-shaped planing hulls
                                                                                                                                                                                                      William Hockberger: Chair of SNAME SD-5 & a Naval Architect and Independent Consultant

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Wednesday, 3 February 2016

                                                                                                                                                                                                      At the Army Navy Country Club, Arlington, VA
                                                                                                                                                                                                      From 5:30 to 6:30 Cash Bar – 6:30 to 7:30 Dinner – 7:30 to 8:30 Program

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Romaine salad
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Grilled marinated chicken paillard with saffron cous cous and broccolini
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Deep dish apple pie, Coffee & tea

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Price: $35.00
                                                                                                                                                                                                      To pay online, 29 January, go to www.foils.org/meetings.htm

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Make reservations by 4:00 Friday, 29 January
                                                                                                                                                                                                      with Allen Ford at allenford@verizon.net or

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Joel Billingsley at Joel.Billingsley@csra.com

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Please honor reservations. No-shows may be requested to cover costs incurred.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (Download Announcement here)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Topic: “The Quadrimaran”: Four identical wedge-shaped planing hulls
                                                                                                                                                                                                      William Hockberger: Chair of SNAME SD-5 & a Naval Architect and Independent Consultant

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The Quadrimaran has four identical wedge-shaped planing hulls that are flat on the bottom and
                                                                                                                                                                                                      sloped downward toward the stern. It was designed to operate at 45-60 knots but with relatively
                                                                                                                                                                                                      lower drag than other high-speed ships, yielding power and fuel savings to compensate for the
                                                                                                                                                                                                      increases in structure and outfit from having four hulls.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      A 57-foot prototype impressed prospective investors and buyers, and several major European
                                                                                                                                                                                                      companies supported further development and designs, with the major classification societies
                                                                                                                                                                                                      involved. An 85-foot passenger ferry was built for Caribbean operation, and numerous other
                                                                                                                                                                                                      designs were done, but contractual and financial problems stopped further construction.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      The concept gained a degree of acceptance in the US for possible high-speed sealift application,
                                                                                                                                                                                                      but recent analysis has shown that the problems experienced were due to fundamental technical
                                                                                                                                                                                                      reasons, which will be discussed and explained. The French inventor has reenergized his
                                                                                                                                                                                                      promotion of the Quadrimaran, so it is again a timely subject.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                                                                                                                                                                                                      William Hockberger is a naval architect and independent consultant in marine systems
                                                                                                                                                                                                      planning, design and development. Following 27 years in the US Navy’s ship design
                                                                                                                                                                                                      organization, he now works mainly on commercial marine systems, especially ferries and
                                                                                                                                                                                                      intermodal freight. He has a particular interest in high-performance ship design and chairs
                                                                                                                                                                                                      SNAME’s SD-5 Panel on Advanced Ships and Craft.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bill holds a bachelor’s degree in naval architecture and marine engineering (MIT), master’s
                                                                                                                                                                                                      degrees in operations research (MIT) and applied economics (American University), and is a
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Registered Professional Engineer. Besides SNAME he is a member of IHS and ASNE and an
                                                                                                                                                                                                      affiliate of the Transportation Research Board and active on its Committee on Ferry
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Transportation and Committee on the Logistics of Disaster Response and Business Continuity.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Previous JOINT DINNER MEETING of SNAME SD-5 PANEL AND INTERNATIONAL HYDROFOIL SOCIETY
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Topic: Joint High Speed Vessel (JHSV) Design & Delivery Update
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Stephen L. Kantz: NAVSEA Ship Design Manager

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Presentation Posted from JOINT IHS/SD-5 DINNER MEETING:
                                                                                                                                                                                                      “Topic: Ship to Shore Connector (SSC) Design Development /Evolution” – 7 May 2015

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The most recent Joint Dinner meeting with SNAME SD-5 Panel was held 7 May 2015 at the Army-Navy Country Club in Arlington,VA with a maximum capacity attendance of 70 people.Jay Howell: CSC Advanced Marine Center, made an excellent presentation on “Ship to Shore Connector (SSC) Design Development /Evolution”. Fully amphibious LCACs (Landing Craft, Air Cushion) were first delivered in December 1984 with a 60 short ton capacity and an expected service life of 20 years; 91 were acquired. In October 2006 the Navy formally commenced the SSC program to provide a functional LCAC replacement with the same “footprint”, a 74 short ton capacity, increased range, a 30 year service life, and improved reliability and maintainability. A significant design effort was applied to
                                                                                                                                                                                                      addressing the “Top 25” LCAC maintenance items, and the Navy employed a Set-Based Design process to optimize the selection of systems for the SSC. The Technology Readiness Assessment process was rigorously applied to ensure new technologies included would be fully ready. Mr. Howell discused some of the aspects of the early stage design development and how the SSC has evolved from the LCAC and answered many questions from those present.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      A copy of his presentation can be downloaded here. Click

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Previous JOINT DINNER MEETING of SNAME SD-5 PANEL AND INTERNATIONAL HYDROFOIL SOCIETY

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Thursday, 5 February 2015

                                                                                                                                                                                                      At the Army Navy Country Club, Arlington, VA
                                                                                                                                                                                                      From 5:30 to 6:30 Cash Bar – 6:30 to 7:30 Dinner – 7:30 to 8:30 Program

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Romaine salad Grilled marinated chicken paillard with saffron cous cous and broccolini
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Chocolate mousse, Coffee & tea

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Price: $35.00

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The Meeting is sold out, Thank you!

                                                                                                                                                                                                      To pay online, by 30 January, go to www.foils.org/meetings.htm

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Make reservations by noon Friday, 30 January with Allen Ford at allenford@verizon.net

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Please honor reservations. No-shows may be requested to cover costs incurred.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (Download Announcement here)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Topic: Unmanned Applications of Advanced Marine Vehicles in the U.S. Navy
                                                                                                                                                                                                      by Michael Bosworth
                                                                                                                                                                                                      PEO LCS Science and Technology Director

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Advanced Marine Vehicles have found a number of applications in naval service, notably
                                                                                                                                                                                                      SWATHs for high seakeeping, hydrofoils and trimarans for small combatants, and hovercraft for
                                                                                                                                                                                                      amphibious lighterage. A newly emerging area of development is unmanned maritime systems
                                                                                                                                                                                                      (surface or underwater). USVs and UUVs are less developed and less transitioned as a class
                                                                                                                                                                                                      than Unmanned Air Vehicles (UAV), with energy and autonomy/communications issues to
                                                                                                                                                                                                      overcome, respectively. But unmanned maritime systems represent a grand opportunity for
                                                                                                                                                                                                      AMV concepts, if they can translate from manned concepts to often smaller unmanned concepts.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mr. Bosworth will discuss some emerging UMS missions and needs and opportunities, then lead
                                                                                                                                                                                                      a short discussion session about the melding of AMVs and UMS’s as a developmental tool.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mike Bosworth graduated from the US Naval Academy in 1976 and spent 20 years in uniform in
                                                                                                                                                                                                      a wide variety of positions, first as a Surface Warfare Officer and then an Engineering Duty
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Officer. Midway through he attended MIT for a master’s in Naval Architecture and Marine
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Engineering and the degree of Ocean Engineer. After retiring in 1996 he worked at Syntek
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Technologies for 6 years before returning to NAVSEA, where he has spent the past 13 years
                                                                                                                                                                                                      building surface ship and craft concept design, and R&D management and transition capabilities,
                                                                                                                                                                                                      in NAVSEA 05D and 05T. He recently left as deputy of 05T (the NAVSEA corporate CTO
                                                                                                                                                                                                      group) to take the position of Science and Technology Director for PEO LCS (which includes
                                                                                                                                                                                                      LCS, the new frigate derivative, mine warfare, and unmanned maritime systems).

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Our last JOINT DINNER MEETING of SNAME SD-5 PANEL AND INTERNATIONAL HYDROFOIL SOCIETY

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Will be held Thursday,16 October 2014

                                                                                                                                                                                                      At the Army Navy Country Club, Arlington, VA
                                                                                                                                                                                                      From 5:30 to 6:30 Cash Bar – 6:30 to 7:30 Dinner – 7:30 to 8:30 Program

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Deli Buffet: Hot Soup; Mix of Breads & Rolls; Sliced Beef, Ham & Turkey, Cheeses; Pasta, Potato & Green Salads; Brownies & Cookies; Coffee & Tea

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Price: $30.00
                                                                                                                                                                                                      To pay online, by 10 October, go to www.foils.org/meeting.htm

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Make reservations by noon Friday, 10 October with Allen Ford at allenford@verizon.net or Bill Hockberger at w.hockberger@verizon.net

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Please honor reservations. No-shows may be requested to cover costs incurred.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (Download Announcement here)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Topic: 50 Years of Hovercraft in the USA Put into Perspective
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Speaker: Warwick Jacobs, Trustee, the Hovercraft Museum

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Although the hovercraft was officially invented in the UK back in 1955, the US has had a long
                                                                                                                                                                                                      association with it and has now seen half a century of activity and contributions to it. From
                                                                                                                                                                                                      GEMs (Ground Effect Machines) to ACVs (Air Cushion Vehicles) to SES (Surface Effect
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Ships), the “hover craft” has had a presence in the US, and Warwick will discuss both its
                                                                                                                                                                                                      military and civilian roles and explain the successes and failures. From the San Francisco ferries
                                                                                                                                                                                                      and Vietnam conflict in the 1960s to the dream of a 100-knot Navy to present day giant military
                                                                                                                                                                                                      craft worldwide, he will trace the rich diversity of hovercraft and what the future may hold. He’ll
                                                                                                                                                                                                      touch on today’s hovercraft sporting and cruising clubs and their great differences from the UK.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Warwick Jacobs is a trustee of the Hovercraft Museum in England and one of its founders. The
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Museum now has over 70 full-size craft, including the SR.N4, the largest civilian hovercraft ever
                                                                                                                                                                                                      built. He has been a hovercraft enthusiast from the age of four and has seen (and now acquired)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      many of them. He knew Sir Christopher Cockerell, the hovercraft inventor, and was even
                                                                                                                                                                                                      commissioned to paint his portrait (he’s also a professional painter). Earlier he worked with the
                                                                                                                                                                                                      ferry operator Hovertravel and cofounded and ran the company HoverHire. In 2012 he helped
                                                                                                                                                                                                      HoverAid in southern Madagascar with their Hovering Doctor service.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Warwick’s University of London degree specialized in transport geography, his thesis being
                                                                                                                                                                                                      “The Hovercraft and the Difficulty in Finding a Modal Role.” He was for 15 years the honorary
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Secretary of the Hovercraft Society.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Spring 2014 joint dinner meeting with SNAME SD-5 PANEL and INTERNATIONAL HYDROFOIL SOCIETY with ASNE Day was on 20 Feb. 2014

                                                                                                                                                                                                      IHS and SD-5 Joint Meeting Presentation (Download Presentation here)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      . Presentation: The Mk V Patrol Boat
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Technical Prograam Guest Speakers: Bryant Bernhard and Vincent Almerico, Jr.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      of United States Marine, Inc.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      log1

                                                                                                                                                                                                      United States Marine, Inc. designs and builds high-performance craft in aluminum and in advanced composites for the US and Foreign Military Sales military markets. The 27m MK V Patrol Boat and its Assault Craft variant are the culmination of over 25 years of MK V variants produced for US Special Operations Forces and subsequently for FMS customers. They are heavily armed for their size and have an operational speed of 45 knots, and their high-deadrise hull provides excellent stability characteristics along with significant seakindliness. This is the same hullform as the original 82m air-deployable Mk V SOC craft. USMI also produces the 11m RIB for Naval Special Warfare and the SOC-R for USSOCOM.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bryant Bernhard is President of USMI. He earned his Master’s Degree in Naval Architecture and Marine Engineering from the University of Michigan and is a Professional Engineer with over 30 years of experience. He has had extensive design and construction experience utilizing advanced materials and systems in high-performance ships and craft for both military and commercial
                                                                                                                                                                                                      applications.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Vincent Almerico, Jr. is the MK V Project Manager. With over 50 years experience in the
                                                                                                                                                                                                      industry, he is responsible for the coordination of the company’s engineering, procurement, production, customer communication and contract administration activities.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      To All IHS Members:

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The IHS has embarked on a wide range of initiatives aimed at increasing awareness of hydrofoil and hydrofoil related technology developments around the world. The Board has had lengthy discussions and concluded that it is critical to involve the membership to accomplish these objectives. There is simply too much work to be done to rely totally on the Board members. I am writing to encourage and solicit your active involvement in the work of the Society.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Specifically, we need assistance in the following areas:
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Newsletter – preparing articles and editing
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Mandles Prize – Judging
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Website – assistance to the Webmaster including responding to posted messages.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Treasurer – assistance to the Treasurer and Membership Committee.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Program – assistance in identifying guest speakers for IHS/ SNAME Panel SD-5 Joint Dinner Meetings
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Tacoma Maritime Fest (24 – 25 Aug 2013) and other future meetings/conferences– Staffing the booth
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Navy Hydrofoil Reunion in Key West (20 – 23 Sept 2013) – register to attend.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Permanent Hydrofoil Exhibit at Washington Navy Yard Museum – assistance/lead in developing the exhibit
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Phanfare Photo Site on IHS website – assistance in posting photos or editing/describing the content.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Collection/compilation/indexing of hydrofoil (and other AMV) technical papers and data.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Many of these support activities can be done at home over the internet or phone and can be at any level of engagement that volunteers are willing and able to provide, either one-off or ongoing. I urge all of you to consider where you might help in furthering these efforts. Please contact me at: mbebar@csc.com if you’re interested.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Thanks.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mark R. Bebar – President, IHS
                                                                                                                                                                                                      ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      log1 Reunion

                                                                                                                                                                                                      September 2013 Navy Hydrofoil Reunion:
                                                                                                                                                                                                      The IHS and PHM MSLG Joint Navy Hydrofoil Reunion was held from 20-23 Sept. 2013 in Key West Fla.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Approximately 150 Navy Hydrofoilers and their friends had a great time.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      log1IHS Mandles Prize Announcement
                                                                                                                                                                                                      IHS Mandles Prize Announcement Updated 20 Nov 2013
                                                                                                                                                                                                      The International Hydrofoil Society is pleased to announce that Mr. Martinn Mandles, a long-time member of IHS and his wife Connie have generously offered to fund up to $5,000 a year in IHS hydrofoil achievement prizes for students. The competition will include a $2500 First Prize and up to two $1000 Honorable Mention awards.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      In order to open the competition to a wider spectrum of qualified entries, submissions by students based on work completed since 2009 will be eligible for the Mandles Prize. The Due Date for Entry Forms is March 15th, 2014.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      This is an outstanding opportunity for the next generation of hydrofoil developers to be acknowledged for their efforts to advance the state of the art in hydrofoil and hydrofoil-assisted craft engineering, design and construction.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Students intending to enter the competition must submit an Entry Form (included in the Rules) before starting work and not later than December 30th 2013 March 15th 2014.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Receipt of this Entry form enables the IHS to communicate with students if the need arises.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      The background for the Mandles Prize and Rules for the competition can be Found by Clicking here: Mandles Prize.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      We anticipate a very exciting competition and look forward to receiving many high-quality entries. Best of luck to all those who compete!

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Questions on the Mandles Prize can be e-mailed to: prizechair@foils.org
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mark Bebar
                                                                                                                                                                                                      President – IHS
                                                                                                                                                                                                      P.S. Click here for a fun You Tube video with more Information on the Mandles Prize

                                                                                                                                                                                                      IHS was at the 2012 Tacoma Maritime Fest August 25-26

                                                                                                                                                                                                      For the past 20 years there has been a Maritime Festival in Tacoma, Washington, at the Foss Waterway Seaport. You can see what’s there at http://www.maritimefest.org/ and find out more about the Seaport itself at http://www.fosswaterwayseaport.org/
                                                                                                                                                                                                      In recent years this event has attracted 8,000 – 10,000 people over a Saturday and Sunday.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      This year’s Maritime Fest will be on August 25-26, and the International Hydrofoil Society has been invited to participate and has accepted. We think this will be an excellent opportunity to raise the level of awareness of hydrofoils and their performance attributes. The location on Puget Sound is especially good, since so much early hydrofoil development and construction occurred there, and the weather there is at its best in late August.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Our IHS booth will have a lot of photographs plus two large screens showing videos of hydrofoils in action. We’ll have on display a new hand-built scale model of PGH 2 Tucumcari generously contributed by Martinn Mandles. In the water nearby will be the hydrofoil craft Talaria IV, a 24-foot Bayliner cabin cruiser converted to foils by Harry Larsen, who will demonstrate it in the Foss Waterway in front of the Seaport. We also hope to have several human-powered hydrofoil craft there. Terry Orme, who is refurbishing the Navy R&D hydrofoil PCH 1 High Point, will have a booth nearby.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      It isn’t often that East and West Coast IHS members are able to get together, and this will be a good time for that. From the East, Mark Bebar, Frank Horn and Bill Hockberger have already committed to go. From the West we already know that Sumi Arima, Ray Vellinga, Martinn Mandles, Harry Larsen, Mike Terry and Terry Orme will be there.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Please give it some thought. We hope you’ll decide to go, too. We’d also like you to help at our booth, if you can.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      If you have any questions, contact Bill Hockberger: w.hockberger@verizon.net or Mark Bebar: mbebar@csc.com

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The Foss Waterway Seaport is at the A marker at left center below.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      tacoma
                                                                                                                                                                                                      ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

                                                                                                                                                                                                      BBS – Post or Read Messages on our Bulletin Board (Discussion, Information Sharing, Lessons Learned and Networking. Find the people with information you need. Find people with interests similar to yours. Find your problem already solved! Find your question already answered!) Note: this page will download two Java applets the first time you access it; the page will then load faster on future visits. Click Here to be notified automatically when new messages are posted to the BBS
                                                                                                                                                                                                      .
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Meetings, Conferences, Workshops, Seminars, Telecasts

                                                                                                                                                                                                      PRESENTATIONS FROM RECENT MEETINGS AVAILABLE, PRESS HERE.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Joint Meeting DIRECTIONS (Download DIRECTIONS here)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      People In the News

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [11 Nov 03] Lost Members – we have lost track of several members who evidently changed their email addresses. Click Here to view some of the names… if you know the new address or email, please let us know so that we can reestablish contact. Meanwhile, if you have moved or changed email addresses… please inform us of the change!

                                                                                                                                                                                                      New Publications

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [August 12, 2014] Third, Second and First 2014 Newsletters Available now: Click Here
                                                                                                                                                                                                      PRESENTATIONS FROM RECENT MEETINGS AVAILABLE, PRESS HERE.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      [1 Feb 06] The Third CD-ROM in IHS’s planned series of Advanced Marine Vehicle (AMV) Document Library is available for purchase now. Click Here for information on how to order.[11 Nov 03] The second CD-ROM in IHS’s planned series of Advanced Marine Vehicle (AMV) Document Library is available for purchase now. Click Here for a list of AMV CD-ROM #2 contents, including abstracts of all the documents on the CD. Click Here for information on how to order.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      [October 8, 2012] Third AND Second Quarter 2012 Newsletter Available Now: Click Here
                                                                                                                                                                                                      [October 8, 2012] Fourth 2012 Newsletter Available now: Click Here
                                                                                                                                                                                                      [December 12, 2012] First 2013 Newsletter Available now: Click Here

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Miscellaneous News Items

                                                                                                                                                                                                      None

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Commercial Pages

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoil Vessels For Sale or LeaseHydrofoils — Wanted To Buy or Lease
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoils — Joint Ventures Proposed to Operate, Manufacture/Market, or Design

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoils — Joint Ventures Proposed to Operate, Manufacture/Market, or Design

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Messages are posted here as a service to IHS members and visitors to the website. Please be aware that IHS does not recommend products or services. While we know of no serious problems having arisen from messages posted here, we are not able to verify that offers posted here are legitimate or that individuals responding to the offers are sincere. Accordingly, caution should be exercised in initiating and conducting business as a result of messages posted here to ensure your personal safety and the safety of your financial account information.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Joint Venture Sought in Fiji

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [3 Jul 03] I am looking for a partner to lease me a high powered boat with the following 70~100 passengers and with speed of 30~35 Knots. The service is geared towards the ferrying of tourists between islands . Matt (matai@mrd.gov.fj)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Joint Venture Sought in the Philippines

                                                                                                                                                                                                      {23 Jun 03] I intend to operate a hydrofoil to serve the transportation of passengers between the two main islands in the Philippines. I plan to enter into a joint venture/partnership with a vessel/hydrofoil owner wherein the operation, management and manning will come from my side. Some important details to consider: Passenger capacity: 120-150; Speed: 35-40 kts. I am currently operating two fast crafts serving the same place. — Felicito Datinguinoo (luchijane@aol.com)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoils — Wanted To Buy or Lease

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Messages are posted here as a service to IHS members and visitors to the website. Please be aware that IHS does not recommend products or services. While we know of no serious problems having arisen from messages posted here, we are not able to verify that offers posted here are legitimate or that individuals responding to the offers are sincere. Accordingly, caution should be exercised in initiating and conducting business as a result of messages posted here to ensure your personal safety and the safety of your financial account information.More info on how and where to buy/sell/restore specific categories of hydrofoils can be accessed from our Posted Messages Bulletin Board Page. Please notify the webmaster if you discover a notice that is no longer valid, or if you are unsuccessful in contacting the individual or organization that posted the message.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Fast Ferry Expert to Assist in Procurement of Fleet

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [14 Oct 03] My company is looking for a fast ferry expert to assist in the procurement of a small fleet of catamarans or hydrofoil vessels. We will consider purchase, lease, or joint venture partnership. Vessels must carry up to 150 plus passengers and travel at a minimum speed of 35 kts. Please contact me if you are interested and want more information. — Tom Dempsey dempsuryy@aol.com
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Historic Hydrofoil(s) Wanted in France

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [9 Sep 03] I seek a few old, small Russian hydrofoils in any type of condition (Raketa, Polysie or Belarus hydrofoil). This is to make a houseboats here in Toulouse, the air and space center of France… a few people are interested in this. Also, and in addition to the houseboat project, I want to start a non-profit association to restore one medium or large Russian experimental hydrofoil (Sputnik, Chaika for example)… so I am looking for a good candidate to restore for historical purposes. The hydrofoil for non-profit restoration should be an experimental craft. — Jeff Legendre (a1493@hotmail.com)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Need High-Speed Ferry Boat in Indonesia / Borneo

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [12 Jul 03] I am looking for someone to sell, lease or joint venture with me a high powered boat with the following 80~100 passengers and with speed of 30~35 Knots. The service is geared towards the ferrying people between Tarakan Island and Kalimantan. — Villepin (villepin@hotmail.com) Click Here to post a response to this message.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoil Vessels For Sale

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Following are some of the more recent announcements. More info on how and where to buy/sell/restore hydrofoils can be accessed from our Posted Messages Bulletin Board Page. Please notify the webmaster if you discover a notice that is no longer valid, or if you get no reply when contacting the individual or organization that posted the message (unfortunately, many sellers have been remiss in notifying IHS when the vessel is sold).Messages are posted here as a service to IHS members and visitors to the website. Please be aware that IHS does not recommend products or services. While we know of no serious problems having arisen from messages posted here, we are not able to verify that offers posted here are legitimate or that individuals responding to the offers are sincere. Accordingly, caution should be exercised in initiating and conducting business as a result of messages posted here to ensure your personal safety and the safety of your financial account information..

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Grumman Runabout -1958 Museum Piece

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [20 Aug 02, updated 01 Oct 03] For Sale: Sea Wing Hydrofoil-Grumman 1958 14’8″. New Mercury 40 HP, Trailer, Original 35 HP Evenrude Lark (stuck), Morse Controls. Runs great. I am in Georgia USA. Can deliver in Southeast USA. $15,500.00. — Myrel Harner (ireneharner@juno.com)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Kolkhida Hydrofoil For Sale – DELFIN 1

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [22 Sep 03] We have for sale a seagoing hydrofoil with capacity of 124 passengers. Click Here for Technical Specifications and full set of color photos, and details of the offer (Adobe Acrobat file, 400K). Price: 270.000 Euro FOB Kolobrzeg — Miroslaw Balicki, Kolobrzeg Passengers Shipping Company (kzp@pro.onet.pl)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hydrofoil For Sale

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .
                                                                                                                                                                                                      New METEORS For Sale (Two)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [14 Jul 03] Zelenodolsk Shipyard, Russia announces that two (2) METEOR hydrofoils in production are for sale. Projected date of delivery is April 2004. Choice of Russian engines or Deutz (Germany) engines. Price ranges from 500 000 Euros to 950 000 Euros. Includes all certificates and our guarantee (1.5 year). — Sergey Nikonov (zdsip@nimb.ru)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      KATRAN Hydrofoils For Sale

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [12 Jul 03] We propose for sale from direct Owners following sea-going hydrofoils:
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – Design “Katran” (“Kolkhida”), built by Volga Shipyard, Russia in 1996 (1995 2nd vessel);- The ship was built in compliance with the Rules and under the supervision of the Maritime Register of Shipping of Russia, class KM * 2 A3 Pass. Hydrofoil;- Reclassified by RINA, 100 – A -1.1; Nav S; TP;- USCG approval- Gross tonnage/Net tonnage: 135GT/53NT;- Engines: two MTU-made 12 V 396 TE 74 diesels, each of 1260 kW (1714 h.p.); 2nd vessel – two MTU-made 12 V 396 TC 82 diesels – each of 1050 kW (1430 h.p.);- Engines’ hours: less 3000– Passenger capacity – 140 (150 2nd vessel)Length, m 34,5Breadth, m 10,3Height above water (foil-borne), m 10,8Height above water (floating), m 8,9Floating draught, m 3,5Foil-borne draught, m 1,9Light displacement, t 56Full displacement, t 72Foil-borne sailing range, miles 200Foil-borne speed, kn 34Crew 5Both vessels are equipped with air-condition system.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Seaworthiness:
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – The normal operating conditions for cruising foil-borne are sea state with waves up to 2 meters high and winds up to Force 5.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      – The most unfavorable conditions for cruising hull-borne are sea state with wave height 3 meters and wind Force 6.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      We recently inspected the hydrofoils and confirm that the vessels are well-maintained and are in tip-top condition. Inspectable in N.America by arrangement. Additional information is available upob firm/named interest. — Brgds/Vyacheslav Fyodorov ; Cielo Trading Ltd ; Tel: +38 048 743 80 85 ; Fax: +44 870 125 34 00 (via UK) ; Email: (slava@cielo-trading.net )

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .
                                                                                                                                                                                                      A Gas Turbine Engine For Your PHM

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [2 Jun 03] GTE For Sale: proposed as suitable to replace the LM2500 in a surplus PHM or a commercial vessel requiring this kind of power: 20,000 HP. Built by Mashproekt in Ukraine; No operating time accumulated; Model designation D59 (original USSR designation for same model, only with a reversing mechanism: GT16000); Maximum continuous rating (MCR) – 20,000 hp in ISO conditions; Power turbine rated speed : 5200 rpm (A 3000 RPM power section is available from Russia for only $128,000 and it includes exhaust plenum and driveshaft ready to couple up to the PHM gearbox); Direction of rotation: counter-clockwise (looking at the output shaft flange), non-reversible (reversing mechanism not needed to power a water jet) ; Fuel control system operation: stabilized fuel flow rate; MTBO – 10 000 hr: (100% MCR – 300 hr, 80% MCR – 900 hr, 70% MCR and less -10 000 hr). If engine load never exceeds 70% MCR, MTBO can be extended to 20 000 hr.; Total life time – 60 000 hr. Stored in Michigan USA; Asking US$500,000 with 2 water jet drives. I would like to be put in touch with some boat builders around the Mediterranean area who might be interested. — E J Potter email: (potterej@earthlink.net); phone: 1-561-468-3587.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      53-Page Technical Manual

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (Adobe Acrobat File – 612 kb)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Click Here

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .[7 Nov 02] Looking for a good home for the H/V ALBATROSS. Hull and cabin are in good condition. However, she’s missing foils, strut, shaft, rudder, and engine. Anyone knowing of a museum, school, conservator, etc. interested in having it donated to them, please let me know. — Robert Miller cbbi@aol.com

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Response…

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [7 Nov 02] For historical and other information and photos about Bob Miller’s conversion of the ALBATROSS to a houseboat, Click Here. For historical information and photos about the ALBATROSS in its prime, see the Helmut Kock biography on this site.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Seahawk Ltd. Offers Olympias

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [21 Oct 03] Two OLYMPIA type hydrofoil vessels for sale. Both in top condition. Hydrofoil passenger vessel. Built in Russia 1993 & 1994. Hull : alloy. L – 37.54, B – 8.40, Depth – 2.60, Draught 4.60/1.40, GRT – 298 T, NET – 89 T, DW – 82 T, Main engine – MTU 16V 396 T E 74 / 2×2000. Classification : Det Norske Veritas. Renovations : Both vessels are seriously renovated. Last serious renovation : 2000. Sale price US 1.5 MIO each. Location : Trading between Finland and Estonia
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Seahawk Ltd. Offers Superfoil Ferry

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [30 Sep 02, updated 21 Oct 03] Directly from the Owners can offer for sale the following air conditioned Superfoil passenger ferry. Main particulars: Built at : Almaz Marine Yard JSC, St.Petersburg, Russia in 2002; LOA : 41 m, B : 12.4 m, Draught : fully loaded at speed / 1.2 m, at rest with retracted foils / 1.7 m, at rest with foils in operational position / 3.4 m; Passenger capacity : 286; Main engines : MJP Waterjets (Mercedes) Type 4000 M70 / 4 x 1740 kW MCR / each 1900-2000 RPM / easy and quick dismantling of main and aux. engines; Gensets : TechnoScan TS90 / 2 x 70kW / 87 KV*A; Gearboxes : Four reversing flange-mounted ZF 4650 / electrically operated; Service speed at sea State 3 : 55 knots; Range (34t DW; 55 kn. speed ; 10% margin) 200 nautical miles; Seakeeping : 2.5 sign. wave height at 100% MCR; Foils : Two fully retractable hydraulically controlled forward fully submerged foils made of high-quality titanium alloy; Interceptors : Two hydraulically controlled transom interceptors made of high-quality titanium alloy; Foil & interceptors control system : MTD / AURORA active Foil & Interceptor; Control System. FICS-3 supplied; Rudders : Two hydraulically controlled suspended rudders made of high-quality titanium alloy providing great control improvement; Classification : DNV 1A1 HSLC R3 Passenger E0, IMO HSC Code, Category A; Accommodation : 62 passenger seats in business class with 1000 mm pitch, 224 passenger seats in tourist class with 900 mm pitch, Self-service bar in business class, Large kiosk/bar, 21 sq.m duty free shop, audio/video entertainment system; Deadweight: 34.000 kg.; Crew : 12×75 kg / 900 kg.; Luggage : 286 x 10 kg / 2860 kg.; Fuel oil : 4740 kg.; Fresh water : 1000 kg.; Duty free goods : 3.050 kg; Capacities : Fuel oil : 10.000 L. Fresh water : 2000 kg. Hydraulic oil : 200 L. Lube oil : 250 L. Waste oil : 250 L; Hull / superstructure : High quality marine grade aluminum alloy type 1561; Service life : 20 years; Environmentally friendly : Extremely low wash up to max speed, low noise. Fulfills IMO emission regulations of Year 2000. Sale price : USD 7.0 MIO; Location : Europe. — Y.Eero, Managing Director, Seahawk Ltd. (seahawk@estpak.ee)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      .
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Lost Members

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [2 Jul 03] We have lost touch with the following members and would like to reestablish contact. Each name is followed by the last known postal and/or email address. If you see your name here, please contact us at webmaster@foils.org. If you see the name of someone you know, please let us know the current address or otherwise let the person know that we are trying to get in contact!
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bob Boyle (sovernbob@netscape.net)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jackim, Dr. Eugene O. (JACKIM1@home.com)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Johs Presthus (life member); Ostre Nestttunvei 16 POB 113; N5051 Nesttun, Bergen, Norway
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Schlund, Phil (106641.71@compuserve.com) Zurich Switzerland
                                                                                                                                                                                                      James Straus (jrs@osogrande.com)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Yagi, Dr. Hikaru (yagi@mes.co.jp)
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Newsletters are always In Preparation

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [3 Oct 06] IHS members and others interested in hydrofoils are invited to submit material of interest to the hydrofoil community for possible publication in the newsletter (and/or posting on the website)… an article, a photos, a news clipping, a web page URL, a letter to the editor. Submit by mail or by e-mail, your choice. The newsletter focuses on recent events, current issues, and new projects, but we also love to publish first person accounts of interesting past events and important contributors in the history of hydrofoil development. We do not have formalized author’s guidelines, but if you are not a member and would like a free sample copy to see what the newsletter is like, just ask (be sure to include your postal mailing address if you want the printed version instead of the electronic version.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                      Still didn’t find what you were looking for? Contact the webmaster by email… we may know a source for your information. Also, please suggest new topics that should be covered in this site. This search feature operates with key words. You can search for any of the words you type in, all of the words, or the exact phrase. Do not ask a complete question in the style of “Ask Jeeves” because you will likely get too many irrelevant citations if you do.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Please forgive and ignore the commercial advertising that our search engine provider recently added to the search results page. IHS neither endorses nor recommends products and services. We are in the process of finding a new search engine provider that has no ads.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Sustaining Members are corporations, companies institutions and other organizations who wish to support the work of the Society.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Island Engineering, formed in 1999, is dedicated to design and engineering support of high performance marine vehicles- primarily for the development of advanced ride control systems.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Maritime Applied Physics Corporation (MAPC) provides a mix of scientists, engineers, naval architects and technicians who are motivated to move ideas from concept through design and prototype.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                      (Last Update: 11 Dec 09)

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                                                                                                                                                                                                      Correspondence

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Photogenic Hydrofoils For Ad Campaign

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [3 Feb 02] I have been doing some preliminary research to find a working hydrofoil for an advertising photo shoot. I was wondering if you could possibly help me locate a working hydrofoil on the US west coast. It could either be a larger passenger craft, or a small, modern looking individual craft. From what I can tell from your site, the largest variety of boats in service would be in Italy? In fact, my search is not confined to the USA. Even though I would prefer finding something suitable here, we would also consider Italy or Australia. I am a bit worried about doing anything in Russia, even though their boats are among the most photogenic. Maybe there is anyone with a Russian boat outside of Russia? — Volker anon

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Responses…[3 Feb 02] Surface piercing foils seem to be what you have in mind; they do tend to highlight the fact that it is a hydrofoil for the view angle you have in mind for your layout. MANU WAI is still a snappy looking hydrofoil (with its mods) despite its age. Sydney Australia is also a nice backdrop for a photo shoot. Another suggestion is to consider Les Dauphins du St-Laurent based in Montreal, Canada. They have a very smart and clean looking white Voskhod named POLNIA III and four others. You can view a photo in the November 2001 issue of Classic Fast Ferries (free to download from http://www.classicfastferries.com) which features this operator on page 19. Of course, a more extensive article on MANU WAI with several photos is provided in the latest issue of CFF, December 2001. — Martin Grimm (seaflite@alphalink.com.au)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [3 Feb 02] Here are few quick ideas. If anything I suggest “strikes a chord” with you, then I can provide further info

                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. As your ad is for an automobile, I am assuming that you want a motor-powered hydrofoil, therefore I am not mentioning sail-powered or human powered hydrofoils.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      2. I don’t know of anyone operating a hydrofoil ferry on the west coast of the USA today. There were some Boeing Jetfoils operated in Seattle, but no longer… too bad, as that particular vessel can yield some spectacular photos.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      3. More recently there were a couple of Jetfoils operating in Florida, Seajets, Inc., but they appear to have ceased operations. There are Jetfoils operating in Japan and other overseas locations. You can locate Jetfoil routes by searching for Jetfoil on the internet.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      4. There is a company that operates hydrofoils on Lake Ontario. See http://www.seaflights.com/. These are modern hydrofoils, but are the Russian surface-piercing design.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      5. Overseas there are Russian hydrofoils operating in Greece and other areas. There are some links to operators on our site at http://www.foils.org/linksout.htm.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      6. There are are few earlier hydrofoils around. For example, some of Helmut Kock’s hydrofoils are still operating on Lake Titicaca in Peru.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      7. Scaling down in size, you might want to look at Steve Gresham’s unique and sleek personal hydrofoil Manta (it’s for sale). See his posting, photos, and film clip on our site at http://www.foils.org/announce.htm#sale.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      That is all that occurs to me at the moment. — Barney C. Black (Please use the BBS to reply)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [10 Mar 02] Just some comments:

                                                                                                                                                                                                      First you have to decide what type of hydrofoil that you want: Boeing, voskods, little or large, etc. Then you have to find the type. For example in Greece there are several, but much older types. In Helsinki, there are two OLYMPIAS, the Laura and Jaanika which will start running in May. If you are interested, I will talk to the Owners about photographing them. — Tom Schneider, The InterMar Group (img@one.net)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Whereabouts of DISCO VOLANTE Today

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [26 Jun 01] I’ve always wanted to know what became of the Thunderball hydrofoil DISCO VOLANTE. I read that a model of the boat was blown up high into the sky in the Bahamas. But who ended up purchasing the real hydrofoil, and does it exist today perhaps on display somewhere? (fmesfandiary@webtv.net)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Response…[2 Dec 02] Did you ever find out the vessel’s current status? I’ve been curious about that boat for years. — Chris G (HPNFlyer@aol.com)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Volga Engine Info Needed Fast

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [8 Dec 00] We have just acquired a Volga 28-foot hydrofoil and urgently need technical information on the engine. I believe it is a Yak engine and the number is GAZ-53,90 the. Have you any information or can you suggest anywhere where I might find it. This is a very urgent request as the boat is being used in a major motion picture we a currently shooting here in Casablanca. Please please let me have anything you can as soon as possible. Jonathan Frost (jonathanfrost@yahoo.com), fax no +212 22 30 15 45 mobile +44 7831 643 172.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Yellow Pages ENDEAVOUR Photo Needed

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [19 Sep 00] I am an assistant editor at Blackbirch Press, Inc., a children’s book publisher in Woodbridge, CT. We are currently working on a book about boats and are looking for a color photo of the Yellow Pages Endeavor. Would you know of where I can get such an image? Please get back to me as soon as possible. — Emily Kucharczyk (staff@blackbirch.com)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Response…[9 Oct 00] There was an article on the Yellow Pages ENDEAVOUR (note spelling with a “u”) in the Australian magazine titled “1994 Boat Directory” Volume 15. This is published by ACE Magazines Pty Ltd, a division of Associated Communication Enterprises Pty Ltd (incorporated in Victoria), 272 Rosslyn Street, West Melbourne 3003 VIC AUSTRALIA. Phone -61 3 3290277, Fax: -61 3 3281511. Publisher was Mark Day and Managing Editor was Geoff Hawthorne. The article has several colour photos of this stunning record breaking sail craft and its crew. I believe it still holds the world water speed record for sail powered craft. I also recall there was a photograph of it in the Guinness Book of Records. Perhaps either of those publishers would be prepared to assist. The designer was Lindsay Cunningham and I imagine he would be living in the Melbourne area as that is the city near where the craft made its speed record runs. — Martin Grimm (seaflite@alphalink.com.au)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [4 Jan 01] Here is the description from the 2000 edition of Guinness: “On 26 October 1993 the trifoiler* Yellow Pages ENDEAVOUR reached a speed of 46.52 knots (86.21 km/h or 53.57 mph) while on a timed run of 500m (547 yards) at Sandy Point near Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. This is the highest speed ever reached by any craft under sail on water. The craft has a 12m high sail and three short planing hulls. It was designed by Lindsay Cunningham and piloted by Simon McKeon and Tim Daddo, both from Australia.” * One comment on that description: The word “trifoiler” suggests that the craft was somehow foil supported. Although I have heard that the team had explored the possibility of using hydrofoils to achieve higher speeds, this apparently never eventuated due to the difficulty in achieving steady foil lift for such an application as the foils would have transitioned between fully wetted and supercavitating operating conditions. I am keen to try to follow up on what became of the craft and plans for the hydrofoil option. Prior to the Yellow Pages ENDEAVOUR gaining the sailing speed record, it was held by a wind surfer. Thierry Bielak of France rode his windsurfer to a speed of 45.34 knots (84.02 km/h or 51.21 mph) at Camargue, France. — Martin Grimm (seaflite@alphalink.com.au)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [3 Feb 01] A few years ago I saw a photo in a windsurfing shop purporting to show the setting of a windsurfing record of 54+ mph. I can’t recall where the shop was. There is a sailor named Mike Delahanty who runs Gorge Sails (in Washington state, near Hood River) who was the speed champion about that time. Perhaps he could tell you the current situation. — Rich Miller (rich@mail.ski.org)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      TV Project Solicits Proposals

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [27 Jun 00] I am currently planning a television series on sailing in general, especially on performance sailboats or extreme projects, such as navigating in arctic or tropic waters or racing. The report will be a feature like documentation and is planned to start preferably from the very beginning. Any of your serious proposals are highly welcome, The project is planned to start in very near future. Strict confidence, if required, is guaranteed. About us: We are an independent full service TV film and editing team, supplying German and European TV and electronic media. As a journalist, I specialized on multihull sailing (and will of course vote for the multihulled project …) — Claus-C. Plaass – Wulle 7 – 24159 Kiel – West Germany (plaass@foni.net), ph+fax +49-431-36 800

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Encyclopedia Publisher Needs Early Photos

                                                                                                                                                                                                      [27 Jun 00] I am collecting illustrations for the Marshall Editions – C20 Science & Technology Encyclopaedia which is to be published early in 2001, and I would be most grateful for your help. We would particularly like to include photographs of Enrico Forlanini’s 1909 first catamaran and his hydrofoil ship and also Alexander Bell’s 1918 hydrofoil boat that created a new water-speed record. Please could you advise me how to obtain the material. I’m afraid I’m not very Internet proficient and ideally I would like to receive the material by post. If that is possible please could you send the photographs to my colleague, Jane Moore at 188 Tufnell Park Road London N7 0EE and advise me by return e-mail? The material will be returned promptly after publication and credited in the book. — Dee Robinson (deerobpicresearch@cwcom.net)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Response…[27 Jun 00]

                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. As to Enrico Forlanini, photos of his craft have appeared in books and magazine articles, so I know that they exist. I will ask around within the society and will post your request on our website to see if I can find a good hard copy somewhere. Hopefully visitors to this site will suggest sources of the photos you require.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      2. As for Bells HD-4 hydrofoil, there is an immense quantity of historical photos posted on the Internet by the Alexander Graham Bell Institute. The postal mailing address is c/o University College of Cape Breton; PO Box 5300, Sydney, NS, B1P-6L2 ; Phone: 902-563-1378 — FAX: 902-562-0119. They sell a CD-ROM containing the entire collection. Note that your printer may very likely be able to download the images you select from; however, you should certainly contact the museum for permission to use the photos. Quoting from their website, “The Alexander Graham Bell Institute (The Bell Institute) of the University College of Cape Breton was incorporated on September 13, 1977. It is directed by a Board of Trustees representing the Bell family, University College of Cape Breton and members of the community. Over the years, the Bell institute has achieved several notable milestones including consolidating photographs, personal notes, and technical work of Alexander Graham Bell, completing a comprehensive index of these holdings, and conducting scholarly study of these materials. The Bell Institute is dedicated to the memory of Dr. Alexander Graham Bell and his work. Continued study of Dr. Bell’s work (“Mining for nuggets”) and development of new applied research projects are motivated by a desire to continue his high standard of principle, his practical spirit and his social conscience. The Alexander Graham Bell family collection brings together a wide range of documents accumulated by Dr. Bell and his family during their time in Baddeck, Nova Scotia. The Alexander Graham Bell institute has developed a comprehensive index of these materials. This index, with on-line access to several components of the Bell collection, can be accessed using the World Wide Web.”

                                                                                                                                                                                                      3. There is a virtual reality movie on the Internet. This is like standing in front of the restored HD-4 hydrofoil, and you are able to turn around to look behind you, up, down, left, right, etc. — Barney C. Black (Please use the BBS to reply)

                                                                                                                                                                                                       


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                                                                                                                                                                                                      MANDLES PRIZE

                                                                                                                                                                                                      MANDLES PRIZE

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Martinn Mandles and his wife Connie have funded up to $4,500 a year in IHS hydrofoil achievement awards for students commencing in 2014. What was once just a dream of our late past president, John Meyer, is now a reality due to the contributions of the Mandles and the creative efforts of several IHS members including Vice-President Mark Bebar, President Ray Vellinga, and a dedicated team of judges.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The Mandles Prize itself includes an annual total of $4,500 in awards in recognition of hydrofoil engineering, design or construction achievement by college and university students (undergraduate and graduate level) worldwide. The award of the Prize will be based on submissions from individual students or groups of up to six students with the signature of a faculty adviser endorsing each submission. Submissions must be specific to hydrofoils, and publishable by IHS. Submissions will be solicited on the IHS website, by contacting faculty at educational institutions internationally, and by advertisement, cost permitting, in applicable professional and trade publications (e.g., SNAME’s Marine Technology, ASNE’s Naval Engineers Journal, etc.). Submissions will be due on or before June 1st of each year, with the Prize winner selected, announced and awarded no later than early August of that year. The awards consist of the $2,500 First Prize with a commemorative plaque, and as many as two optional Honorable Mention prizes of $1,000, each with a commemorative plaque. IHS will appoint a panel of no less than five (5) judges, free from any real or perceived conflict of interest, to evaluate the submissions and recommend the Prize winners. Depending on the submissions received, it may be necessary to add other judges who are Subject Matter Experts.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      In a past email of thanks to Martinn and Connie, IHS member Bill Hockberger captured the spirit of this competition: “I was really pleased when I learned of your generous offer to establish a student competition with monetary awards. I think it will motivate young people studying ship design to consider hydrofoils in a way that a mere award certificate or plaque can never do. And if they jump in, by necessity it will also motivate their professors to learn about hydrofoils so they can oversee their students’ projects. That’ll be a significant extra bang for the buck! A big part of the problem getting people to consider hydrofoils when they might be the best alternative is that so few know enough about them.”

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Many of our members know Martinn and something about his accomplishments. For others, here is a summary: Martinn started as a hydroplane racer in high school and became both an airplane and hydrofoil “pilot” before earning an engineering degree from Stanford University in 1964. As such, he was the first co-pilot of Boeing’s Aqua-Jet hydrofoil research hydroplane, and on the first flight crew of the Boeing built FRESH-1 high-speed research hydrofoil. Upon his return from Vietnam in 1967, Mandles became the Navy’s first captain of Boeing’s first hydrofoil gunboat, USS Tucumcari. After completing five years of military service in 1969, Mandles commenced a 37-year career at ABM Industries (NYSE: ABM), where he was Chairman of the Board from 1997-2006.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      An accomplished aviator and avid adventurer, Martinn was the first non-NASA American pilot to graduate from the Russian Cosmonaut Basic Training Program at Star City near Moscow, and has visited both the North and South Poles, as well as the North Face Base Camp of Mt. Everest in Tibet and countless other challenging destinations worldwide. Two of these adventures are illustrated here.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      IHS member

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Martinn and his wife Connie reside in Los Angeles, where he now serves as an executor and trustee of several major trusts.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      IHS Mandles Prize Announcement Updated 20 Nov 2013

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The International Hydrofoil Society is pleased to announce that Mr. Martinn Mandles, a long-time member of IHS and his wife Connie have generously offered to fund up to $5,000 a year in IHS hydrofoil achievement prizes for students. The competition will include a $2500 First Prize and up to two $1000 Honorable Mention awards.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      In order to open the competition to a wider spectrum of qualified entries, submissions by students based on work completed since 2009 will be eligible for the Mandles Prize.   The Due Date for Entry Forms is March 15th, 2014.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      This is an outstanding opportunity for the next generation of hydrofoil developers to be acknowledged for their efforts to advance the state of the art in hydrofoil and hydrofoil-assisted craft engineering, design and construction.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Students intending to enter the competition must submit an Entry Form (included in the Rules) before starting work and not later than December 30th 2013 March 15th 2014.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Receipt of this Entry form enables the IHS to communicate with students if the need arises.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      The background for the Mandles Prize and Rules for the competition can be Found by Clicking here: Mandles Prize.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      We anticipate a very exciting competition and look forward to receiving many high-quality entries. Best of luck to all those who compete!

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Questions on the Mandles Prize can be e-mailed to: prizechair@foils.org

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Mark Bebar
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Vice President – IHS

                                                                                                                                                                                                      P.S. Click here for a fun You Tube video with more Information on the Mandles Prize